If a female tried to get into the priesthood session of GC...

[Paperback Writer]

I think that, at some point, the OW movement will realize that Church members are more like employees than stockholders.
I know that ideally "they ARE the Church", but in fact they aren't.
None of us is.

Correct. Stockholders have voting rights. When church members raise their hands, it's to sustain decisions already made; not to vote on those decisions. I'm not sure employee is the correct term since an employee gets paid and, considering tithing obligations, the reverse seems to be the case. I'll suggest this analogy: church members are more like naturalized citizens who take a pledge and then agree only to sustain (or abstain) rather than actually vote. The LDS church has never been a democracy.

[byu71]

Correct. Stockholders have voting rights. When church members raise their hands, it's to sustain decisions already made; not to vote on those decisions. I'm not sure employee is the correct term since an employee gets paid and, considering tithing obligations, the reverse seems to be the case. I'll suggest this analogy: church members are more like naturalized citizens who take a pledge and then agree only to sustain (or abstain) rather than actually vote. The LDS church has never been a democracy.

Could it be like a lot of religions. I will admit I don't know much about other religions, but I think there are more than just the LDS church who are not democratic.

I only know of two religions (christian) who do not allow women in the Priesthood. Ourselves and the Catholics. Are there any others? My guess is the Southern Baptists, JW's, Christian Science don't, but don't know for sure.

Could this whole thing have started back with Paul and his poor attitude when it comes to women. I have heard he was an ugly little guy and could explain his problem with women.

[Sullyute]

Could this whole thing have started back with Paul and his poor attitude when it comes to women. I have heard he was an ugly little guy and could explain his problem with women.

I heard he was pretty good at pitching a tent.

[Katy Lied]

toward babylon?

[Green Monstah]

I stepped into in on FB over this issue today. A good friend's sister changed her profile pic to the ordain women logo. Friend's mom went off on FB and included a statement that those who don't believe in JS "have no business in the church." Daughter has been on the outs with mom since she stopped attending church recently, which made me sad. My intent was to simply state, "Hey there are lot's of people in the Church who think differently than you do. I'm not sure the answer is to suggest that they leave the church," but set off a bit of a firestorm, including a ton of PMs from facebook friends who saw my comments.

We'll see how the Mrs. handles this.

[Mormon Red Death]

toward babylon?

you mean "toward Sodom"?

[creekster]

you mean "toward Sodom"?

Hey now, that is not how Paul rolls

[Uncle Ted]

I stepped into in on FB over this issue today. A good friend's sister changed her profile pic to the ordain women logo. Friend's mom went off on FB and included a statement that those who don't believe in JS "have no business in the church." Daughter has been on the outs with mom since she stopped attending church recently, which made me sad. My intent was to simply state, "Hey there are lot's of people in the Church who think differently than you do. I'm not sure the answer is to suggest that they leave the church," but set off a bit of a firestorm, including a ton of PMs from facebook friends who saw my comments.

We'll see how the Mrs. handles this.

Joseph Smith viewed women as priesthood holders…

http://www.dialoguejournal.com/wp-co..._V18N03_23.pdf

Maybe this statement would be better stated as "those who don't believe in BY…"?

[Northwestcoug]

I stepped into in on FB over this issue today. A good friend's sister changed her profile pic to the ordain women logo. Friend's mom went off on FB and included a statement that those who don't believe in JS "have no business in the church." Daughter has been on the outs with mom since she stopped attending church recently, which made me sad. My intent was to simply state, "Hey there are lot's of people in the Church who think differently than you do. I'm not sure the answer is to suggest that they leave the church," but set off a bit of a firestorm, including a ton of PMs from facebook friends who saw my comments.

We'll see how the Mrs. handles this.

I have a FB friend who dissed the OW women crowd on her feed. Of course she felt comfortable doing this, since the majority of her friends feel the same way. But one friend politely disagreed, saying that he believes in the church, but sees some wiggle room for ordination of women. The dissing friend tried to be polite for awhile, and he did as well. But finally she tired of the back and forth and dismissed him with this:

I'm sorry you're willing to jeopardize your eternal salvation over stuff that just does not matter anymore. Have a good night

You can't win an argument when someone can use that trump card to end any debate.

[Green Monstah]

I have a FB friend who dissed the OW women crowd on her feed. Of course she felt comfortable doing this, since the majority of her friends feel the same way. But one friend politely disagreed, saying that he believes in the church, but sees some wiggle room for ordination of women. The dissing friend tried to be polite for awhile, and he did as well. But finally she tired of the back and forth and dismissed him with this:



You can't win an argument when someone can use that trump card to end any debate.

My best friend weighed in with a "You're better than this, GM" and then attributed my lack of faith to a "curveball" thrown by "life." We've been texting back and forth, and I feel badly that he's having a hard time with it. For the first time in a decade, I feel comfortable with where I stand with the Church. It sucks when I put others in a position to worry for me.

[Katy Lied]

Interesting article.

[Uncle Ted]

I have a FB friend who dissed the OW women crowd on her feed. Of course she felt comfortable doing this, since the majority of her friends feel the same way. But one friend politely disagreed, saying that he believes in the church, but sees some wiggle room for ordination of women. The dissing friend tried to be polite for awhile, and he did as well. But finally she tired of the back and forth and dismissed him with this:

I'm sorry you're willing to jeopardize your eternal salvation over stuff that just does not matter anymore. Have a good night

You can't win an argument when someone can use that trump card to end any debate.

Oh, but you forget there is a trump card for this trump card...

1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.


2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

https://www.lds.org/scriptures/nt/matt/7.2?lang=eng

And if they still don't get the hint then continue onto verse #3...

3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

[ERCougar]

My wife disagrees with my on this issue, but she's been pretty embarrassed by the response of some members towards the OW crowd.

[Katy Lied]

This could be how it goes:

Women will be ordained, not with the power of the priesthood, but with the power of Jesus Christ to heal etc. Women will have spiritual gifts restored, on a voluntary basis, if they want. The men will retain the ceremonial positions of priesthood power, and the power to preside over meetings and gatherings and offices. This new power will be rejected by older women and traditionalists, and embraced by younger women. Women without a priesthood holder in their home (or without a worthy one) will seek to become worthy to gain the power of these spiritual gifts, and there will be a revival of the traditional midwife role of minister to the members of the ward. Older women and traditionalist women will look on with envy. Offices for which there is no need for priesthood power (finance clerk, membership clerk, sunday school president, maybe WML) will start being held by women. Young women will embark on their missions with these extra spiritual gifts, and they will soon gain a reputation for miraculous healing, etc.

[byu71]

My best friend weighed in with a "You're better than this, GM" and then attributed my lack of faith to a "curveball" thrown by "life." We've been texting back and forth, and I feel badly that he's having a hard time with it. For the first time in a decade, I feel comfortable with where I stand with the Church. It sucks when I put others in a position to worry for me.

It is too bad it can't be a discussion instead of boiling down to supposed good vs evil. Crap like "you are better than this" and "your salvation is in jeopardy" are the supposed trump cards of the religionists. Of course on the other side you have the "enlightened" crowd who have their trump cards like "mormons on the wrong side of history" and "when is the church going to come into the 21st century".

I guess if you are going to be passionate about something you have to think you are right and there is only black and white.