Question on the ancient prophets vs modern

[Mormon Red Death]

It seems that ancient prophets rarely came from within organization of the priesthood and were almost always outsiders sent to preach repentance and reform to the people. Contrast that with Today where the prophets are administrators. For example, Jeremiah (or Lehi or abinadi or Christ for that matter) was sent to the people to change the customs. If someone were to do this today they would be excommunicated for not following protocol.

Any thoughts on this?

[pellegrino]

the only thought I have is that your analysis is correct.

[Moliere]

I often hear from the teenagers in my ward that they question things. I remind them that this church was started by a young boy (14 years old) that questioned what he was being taught. If we have the truth, we shouldn't fear questioning because ultimately people will come back to the truth.

Anyway, this is pretty interesting when juxtaposed to this lesson that was taught in YMs two Sundays ago, which ends with this quote:

Sister Elaine A. Cannon, who has devoted much of her life to guiding and teaching young people, bore this witness of the living prophet: “Now, as he speaks to us … it is as if the Lord Jesus Christ himself were addressing us. … Christ made this very clear when he said to others of his children a time ago, ‘Blessed are ye if ye shall give heed unto the words of these … whom I have chosen from among you to minister unto you’ (3 Nephi 12:1). … Your course should become clear, your priorities ought to be known to you. … Personal opinions vary. Eternal principles never do. When the prophet speaks … the debate is over” (“If We Want to Go Up, We Have to Go On,” New Era, Jan.–Feb. 1979, pp. 40–41).

•What did Sister Cannon mean when she said that when the prophet speaks, the debate is over?
•Why is this so important to us?

That quote is false.

[CardiacCoug]

I often hear from the teenagers in my ward that they question things. I remind them that this church was started by a young boy (14 years old) that questioned what he was being taught. If we have the truth, we shouldn't fear questioning because ultimately people will come back to the truth.

Anyway, this is pretty interesting when juxtaposed to this lesson that was taught in YMs two Sundays ago, which ends with this quote:



That quote is false.

Yeah the YM teaching manuals really are terrible and totally out of date.

I'm not sure if there is a demonstrably lower priority in the Church than the Sunday School and Priesthood/RS curriculum. The manuals seem like they could have been produced by 3 people working for about a week and they use material that is at least 20+ years old.

[Solon]

Yeah the YM teaching manuals really are terrible and totally out of date.

I'm not sure if there is a demonstrably lower priority in the Church than the Sunday School and Priesthood/RS curriculum. The manuals seem like they could have been produced by 3 people working for about a week and they use material that is at least 20+ years old.

For MRD: http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showpost.php?p=774215

For Moliere: http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showthread.php?p=491704

[Moliere]

I will say though that most of the prophets we have in the scriptures are similar to Joseph Smith in that they came about at a time of apostasy. I'm not sure if I'd compare Moses to TSM, but maybe that is also MRD's point

[Mormon Red Death]

I will say though that most of the prophets we have in the scriptures are similar to Joseph Smith in that they came about at a time of apostasy. I'm not sure if I'd compare Moses to TSM, but maybe that is also MRD's point

That is exactly my point. I would however compare Moses however to Joseph Smith. We are supposed to be learning about these great prophets (in my case I am teaching about abinadai on Sunday) and seeing their example as influences on our lives.

I can only think of 4 prophets that came within the system. Joshua, Eli, Alma the younger.

[ERCougar]

For MRD: http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showpost.php?p=774215

For Moliere: http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showthread.php?p=491704

Dang. I was going to summon you.

[Moliere]

That is exactly my point. I would however compare Moses however to Joseph Smith. We are supposed to be learning about these great prophets (in my case I am teaching about abinadai on Sunday) and seeing their example as influences on our lives.

I can only think of 4 prophets that came within the system. Joshua, Eli, Alma the younger.

I'd add Jacob. Also the book of Omni is full of them, although given what little we know of them they would also probably qualify as administrators instead of prophets.

[Indy Coug]

I'd add Jacob. Also the book of Omni is full of them, although given what little we know of them they would also probably qualify as administrators instead of prophets.

I doubt they were either. They were kings based on heredity and had no ecclesiastical power or authority, IMO.

[Moliere]

I doubt they were either. They were kings based on heredity and had no ecclesiastical power or authority, IMO.

Hmmm, I'd say that at that time ecclesiastical power seemed to follow bloodlines, or at least that is an argument that I recall Grant Hardy making in this book. Maybe I'm mistaken so I'll have to go back and check...

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Understanding-Book-Mormon-Readers-Guide/dp/0199731705/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1336750590&sr=8-1"]Amazon.com: Understanding the Book of Mormon: A Reader's Guide (9780199731701): Grant Hardy: Books@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41NAg%2BbAP8L.@@AMEPARAM@@41NAg%2BbAP8L[/ame]

[jay santos]

That is exactly my point. I would however compare Moses however to Joseph Smith. We are supposed to be learning about these great prophets (in my case I am teaching about abinadai on Sunday) and seeing their example as influences on our lives.

I can only think of 4 prophets that came within the system. Joshua, Eli, Alma the younger.

This is an interesting comparison.

Compare Joseph Smith to Moses, Abinadi, Jeremiah, Lehi who came outside the system and were necessary to restore and reveal truth.

Then compare our other modern prophets to those on your list that came from within the system. They didn't do a lot of revealing and restoring. They pretty much regurgitated what they were already taught, right? So maybe we shouldn't complain so much that there's nothing new.

[Jacob]

That is exactly my point. I would however compare Moses however to Joseph Smith. We are supposed to be learning about these great prophets (in my case I am teaching about abinadai on Sunday) and seeing their example as influences on our lives.

I can only think of 4 prophets that came within the system. Joshua, Eli, Alma the younger.

John the Baptist? Isaac, Jacob/Israel, Joseph.
Also, it depends on who you are calling a prophet. There was ecclesiastical leadership and the leaders came from within the system, generally, except for when there was a change to the system.

[Solon]

Dang. I was going to summon you.

Don't forget, I'm 9 time-zones ahead of you.

[DrumNFeather]

Technically speaking, weren't all of these prophets foreordained to their callings before the world was? So really, they all came from the "system" just in different ways.