Snip snip!

[RC Vikings]

It is a lot like concealed carry... walking around with a loaded gun isn't for everyone, but it is important that some of accept it as a personal responsibility.

Sometimes those loaded guns go off at the worst moments.

[RobinFinderson]

Sometimes those loaded guns go off at the worst moments.

And what... it results in a precious little baby?





What is wrong with you!

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

Let me bold it differently:

The Church strongly discourages surgical sterilization as an elective form of birth control. Surgical sterilization should be considered only if (1) medical conditions seriously jeopardize life or health or (2) birth defects or serious trauma have rendered a person mentally incompetent and not responsible for his or her actions. Such conditions must be determined by competent medical judgment and in accordance with law. Even then, the persons responsible for this decision should consult with each other and with their bishop and should receive divine confirmation of their decision through prayer.

By wording the handbook like this it would seem to suggest that the general LDS person should know verbatim the entire handbook. What other personal things that I would never think to involve the church in am I supposed to consult with the bishop and receive divine confirmation before proceeding?

[wuapinmon]

And what... it results in a precious little baby?

remind me again why you don't have lots of precious little babies....

[Northwestcoug]

Nor have I...and perhaps that is the point. The guidance is there if it is asked for, otherwise, the lord trusts that we'll make that decision on our own. With so many members and each one of them in a different place on the "path" if you will, some will seek guidance on what toothpaste to use, or whether or not to get snipped. Others are quite comfortable making those decisions for themselves.

Were I in a position to advise, I'd probably tell them whath the CHOI says and add that it is still their decision to make on there own (and politely tell them to get out of my office and not bring their trivial problems to me )

Just to reiterate, this is available on the church website, under the 'policies on moral issues' section. They are not hiding it, far from it. They consider it a moral issue. If they make it available on the website, they must want the membership to read it. I don't think I'm going out on a limb saying that if the church had its way, they would rather not any member get sterilized. And if they do, they want the local leadership to get involved.

[RobinFinderson]

remind me again why you don't have lots of precious little babies....

I'll remind you, again, that I probably have more progeny than anyone on the board.

[Tone Loc]

I'll remind you, again, that I probably have more progeny than anyone on the board.

Sad. There is a difference between being a father, and a sperm donor. I can safely say you should go get sterilized without your bishops permission.

[RobinFinderson]

Sad. There is a difference between being a father, and a sperm donor. I can safely say you should go get sterilized without your bishops permission.

There is nothing sad about respecting God's first commandment.

[RC Vikings]

What other personal things that I would never think to involve the church in am I supposed to consult with the bishop and receive divine confirmation before proceeding?

I'm glad their are men out there like AV and BigPiney to handle these things because I just wouldn't have the patience for it. I really don't think "Are you shitting me, you really need to run this by me" would be an appropriate response from a bishop.

[mUUser]

I genuinely feel bad for bishops & SP's that have to waste their time with crap like that. Of course, this particular bishop didn't exactly nip it in the bud and show them the door. Shouldn't have taken more than a minute of his time.

[Eddie]

Who's supposed to read the CHOI? I've never been told/encouraged to read it, but I have been given sections of it depending on the calling. I know a large section of it is now online, but that wasn't the cased until recently.

How are members supposed to know to do this if not by reading the manual?

Disclaimer: I'm not claiming ignorance here, but I've always been under the assumption that these manuals are for the leaders. Is it the leaders responsibility to disseminate the information therein to the congregation? I've never heard this topic addressed in church by leaders.

This is my thought too.

I would NEVER have thought to go to the Bishop for something like this. I would've thought that it was a big/permanent life-altering decision and that it was one that needed to be made with a lot of prayer and careful consideration. But I never would've thought to go to the Bishop. Just like I wouldn't think to go to the Bishop to ask his advice about having additional children.

What else is there in the CHOI that no one knows about? I would think if this was a super-serious issue, there would be a temple recommend question that went something like "have you ever been sterilized? If so, were there serious health issues that resulted in you deciding to do it? Did you pray and consult your bishop first?"

Short of that, how am I to know how serious of an issue it is?

[TripletDaddy]

Do people pray about something like this? If so, why?

For me personally, I don't think it would rise to the prayer level. Again, that is just my own personal opinion.

If you are later on in life and done having kids (generally the impetus for having such a procedure) then what is the goal in praying about it?

[wally]

Do people pray about something like this? If so, why?

For me personally, I don't think it would rise to the prayer level. Again, that is just my own personal opinion.

If you are later on in life and done having kids (generally the impetus for having such a procedure) then what is the goal in praying about it?

Suppose you are widowed later in life (say in your 60s or so) and you remarry a 20-something woman without children. Who are you to deny her babies? If you pray about it now you might receive this inspiration. If you do receive this inspiration you can share it with your present wife as a reason you will not get snipped.

[mUUser]

Do people pray about something like this? If so, why?

For me personally, I don't think it would rise to the prayer level. Again, that is just my own personal opinion.

If you are later on in life and done having kids (generally the impetus for having such a procedure) then what is the goal in praying about it?

Our conversation went something like this:

Me: Do you want more kids?
Her: Nope.
Me: Positive?
Her: Yep.
Me: Would you support me getting a V?
Her: Sure.
Me: Will you pick me up from the hospital?
Her: What day?
Me: Tuesday.
Her: I'll clear my calendar.

30 second decision. Max.

[TripletDaddy]

Our conversation went something like this:

Me: Do you want more kids?
Her: Nope.
Me: Positive?
Her: Yep.
Me: Would you support me getting a V?
Her: Sure.
Me: Will you pick me up from the hospital?
Her: What day?
Me: Tuesday.
Her: I'll clear my calendar.

30 second decision. Max.

This is my thought, too.

I don't think I have ever prayed about a medical procedure. Although I have never had an elective medical procedure so perhaps my mindset would be different.