Repentance and confession - What would you do?

[CardiacCoug]

Were the revelations posted by Tooblue contrived by Joseph?

Well I think Joseph eventually told Emma that he was having sex with other women. I'm not sure if he confessed to his Bishop, though. I'll have to look into that.

[CardiacCoug]

You completely misinterpreted that. I too am not a fan of everything happens for a reason like on thinking.

My bad. Sorry about that.

[Surfah]

I think the correct answer probably depends on how orthodox his friend is in his religious beliefs.

If every day for the rest of his life he wakes up and thinks, "Too bad my family and I are screwed for eternity because I never told the Bishop and my wife about this," then it's better to confess now and get it over with so he can move on feeling good about himself. In other words, if formal confession to the Bishop is going to eventually free him from paralyzing and emotionally crippling guilt, then it's a good thing.

If he doesn't really buy the stuff about the degrees of glory and the Spirit Correctional Facility or the somewhat strange LDS adoption of the Catholic tradition of the confessional (which is more my attitude, although thankfully I have never cheated on my wife) then he's probably better off keeping it to himself.

Well of course there is a question of orthodoxy here. If he believes then he should. If he doesn't then why make any sort of reconciliation with church and God?

So confession is an adoption of Catholic tradition? Were the revelations posted by Tooblue contrived by Joseph? Or is confession simply required of those who aren't able to mete out the terms of their own salvation with his God and Savior?

[CardiacCoug]

That people allow religion to intrude in their lives this way is one thing that just is so unfortunate, in my view. He's been doing fine without Mormonism. This issue should be between him and his wife, exclusively, unless they decide to get help from a professional. His first mistake was telling the bishop. Now he should just ignore him.

For some reason the guy wants to be a part of the Church. Coming back to Church activity has the potential to be a great blessing for him and his family, at least from this guy's perspective. (Or else why would he even be considering it?)

To me, it's unfortunate that this extra barrier of confession has to stand between him and his guilt-free participation in the Church. In my opinion, it is an unnecessary, man-made barrier.

What I find interesting about the orthodox position is the following: Let's say the guy still feels tremendous guilt about cheating on his wife. So he goes in to the Bishop and the Bishop says, "Hey, don't worry about it. It's been such a long time and you've been faithful since. God forgives you. You just have to forgive yourself. Whether or not you tell your wife is up to you." So then does the guy just walk out and never feel guilty about it again?

I could never accept another person's ruling on my spiritual guilt or innocence to override or really even affect what I knew in my heart, whether the ruling was positive or negative.

[Surfah]

The idea of an Abrahamic test strikes me as an "Everything happens for a reason" line of thought of which I am not a fan.

If you cheat on your wife, there is no larger purpose at work along the lines of "God must have wanted your wife to have a chance to forgive like the Savior forgives." That's not the way I like to think about life, anyway.

Everything doesn't happen for a reason.

You completely misinterpreted that. I too am not a fan of everything happens for a reason like on thinking.

[SeattleUte]

That people allow religion to intrude in their lives this way is one thing that just is so unfortunate, in my view. He's been doing fine without Mormonism. This issue should be between him and his wife, exclusively, unless they decide to get help from a professional. His first mistake was telling the bishop. Now he should just ignore him.

[CardiacCoug]

I think Cowboy said it best in that it is his personal belief that we will all have an "Abrahamic" test. I think in many ways confession is part of that. Not just for the transgressor but also for those whom have been offended.

The idea of an Abrahamic test strikes me as an "Everything happens for a reason" line of thought of which I am not a fan.

If you cheat on your wife, there is no larger purpose at work along the lines of "God must have wanted your wife to have a chance to forgive like the Savior forgives." That's not the way I like to think about life, anyway.

Everything doesn't happen for a reason.

[wuapinmon]

Damn, that's hot!

I know exactly what you're thinking, tío. Ponle el candado al corazón y especialmente al pico.

[Tim]

but if there are more than two witnesses it is better

Damn, that's hot!

[CardiacCoug]

Having had some time to think about this for a few hours and having just taught a temple prep class, I think that Cowboy's friend should meet with his current Bishop. He should explain what happened and all that has happened since the indiscretion. He should explain his meeting with his former Bishop and share the counsel he rejected. He should then explain the feelings of why he didn't heed that counsel. Then he should do whatever his current Bishop asks of him to return and be in good standing.

I think the correct answer probably depends on how orthodox his friend is in his religious beliefs.

If every day for the rest of his life he wakes up and thinks, "Too bad my family and I are screwed for eternity because I never told the Bishop and my wife about this," then it's better to confess now and get it over with so he can move on feeling good about himself. In other words, if formal confession to the Bishop is going to eventually free him from paralyzing and emotionally crippling guilt, then it's a good thing.

If he doesn't really buy the stuff about the degrees of glory and the Spirit Correctional Facility or the somewhat strange LDS adoption of the Catholic tradition of the confessional (which is more my attitude, although thankfully I have never cheated on my wife) then he's probably better off keeping it to himself.

[wuapinmon]

I'm too busy with mid-term grades to really deal with this right now, but I'm wondering if there are any lessons from the prodigal son lesson we can apply?

[wuapinmon]

Having had some time to think about this for a few hours and having just taught a temple prep class, I think that Cowboy's friend should meet with his current Bishop. He should explain what happened and all that has happened since the indiscretion. He should explain his meeting with his former Bishop and share the counsel he rejected. He should then explain the feelings of why he didn't heed that counsel. Then he should do whatever his current Bishop asks of him to return and be in good standing.

I agree.

[Babs]

Unless I am misunderstanding you, you are saying that you would prefer to live in a false reality than to face the cold hard truth....because the truth would be too difficult?

Unlike some, I prefer to live in the present.

[Surfah]

That's awfully simplistic, don't you think? I may have long-ago forgiven the kid in the sixth grade who tripped me in the hallway, sending me careening into the metal lockers and leaving a gash over my left eye. I may have forgiven him, yet the scar is still there, interfering with the line of my otherwise perfectly arched brow. And when the climate is just right, it even still hurts a little.

So sure, there are women strong enough to forgive, but that's not to say the marriage won't be permanently altered.

But your comment hints at something I was thinking: this is really the kind of decision that has to be made on a case-by-case basis. Church dictum aside, there is probably no one right answer. The husband of a terribly insecure wife is probably not going to want to exacerbate her insecurities by telling her of an age-old indiscretion. The husband of a wife who values honesty above all, whose affair may be revealed through mutual acquaintances, he might want to confess.

I think Cowboy said it best in that it is his personal belief that we will all have an "Abrahamic" test. I think in many ways confession is part of that. Not just for the transgressor but also for those whom have been offended. I am pulling a 180 here from my initial reaction to CardiacCoug's thoughts on the matter:

Without confession there is no forgiveness. And I am not talking about from God. If we withhold our trespasses we don't give others a chance to forgive. While we may save them heartache, we rob them of the opportunity to be as our Savior is. And I believe above all things in this mortal existence that we are supposed to learn how to forgive and love one another. Gidget will probably throw up in her mouth after reading this because I absolutely suck at this. But I believe this to be true. And I am working daily at being better.

Having had some time to think about this for a few hours and having just taught a temple prep class, I think that Cowboy's friend should meet with his current Bishop. He should explain what happened and all that has happened since the indiscretion. He should explain his meeting with his former Bishop and share the counsel he rejected. He should then explain the feelings of why he didn't heed that counsel. Then he should do whatever his current Bishop asks of him to return and be in good standing.

[TripletDaddy]

of course it doesn't. That was a reference to some form of church confessional.



If it were a one-time-only thing that happened the first year of our marriage (when, frankly, in our case we were miserable) ten years ago...

Then I'd rather he keep it to himself. I'd rather preserve the freedom and intimacy that results from the bond and trust I have with him and in him. If he were to divulge a long-past indiscretion -- a failing from which he has clearly repented and which is not affecting our current marriage -- my faith in him and in myself would be shattered, and the revelation wouldn't be worth it to me. I would never truly, wholly be able to commune with him again. No thanks.

Unless I am misunderstanding you, you are saying that you would prefer to live in a false reality than to face the cold hard truth....because the truth would be too difficult?

To each his or her own, but that doesn't sound good to me. Not in my marriage.

However, if the majority of women feel this way, no wonder so many men cheat. Why not? Just don't get caught and let enough time pass. You are golden.