The Church and Organized Higher Education

[YOhio]

Thanks, I didn't see any official newbie introduction area so I just jumped in, but in case anyone was wondering, my name is pellegrino and I'm an alcoholic. I hope that satisfies the introduction protocol.

Drunk-posting night is usually Saturday night, but landpoke sometimes starts on Thursday.

[pellegrino]

Drunk-posting night is usually Saturday night, but landpoke sometimes starts on Thursday.

I hope to bring the board to new heights

[Goatnapper'96]

True, the original honor code was drafted by students, but then it was co opted by administration and now the students have very little input as to its shape or the discipline that comes from it, except for those zealous whisker watcher students who refuse service based on when you last shaved.

In many other universities the students completely run the honor code, even having honor courts for issues as serious as cheating and plagiarism. The accused student gets fair representation (usually some pre-law geek) in front of a panel of his peers and they weigh the evidence and administer the punishments. I'm not opposed to the idea of the honor code, I just wish the implementation were less hierarchical.

At the Service Academies the Cadet/Midshippmen Honor Code is the only thing the Cadets or Middies still actually run.

BYU provides the LDS Church at large with some great services but it really could do so much more if it were operated the way you suggest. I remember about a year ago some discussion on Cougarboard about Keni Kaufusi's gang involvement and the growth of gangs in the Poly Community in Utah. Finally a board participant gave about the best explanation for the root cause of the issue. His point was the the traditional Polynesian family structure was thrown upside down when the family emigrated because the children's greater ability to adapt to the new environment made their parents dependent upon their kids. IMO, this is something that BYU could and should be involved in. Rather than just regurgitating gospel principles about what the ideal is and if we all lived the ideal problems could be avoided, some scholarship and research that would result in recommendations on how to cope day to day would be helpful. I would go so far as to comment that given the LDS Church's role in facilitating the Poly's emigration perhaps BYU has a moral obligation for this type of research. But to research the subject and offer recomendations will be interpreted by many as second guessing the Brethren and perhaps allowing those with issues a way of not taking personal responsibility for their problems. So the problem festers and we hope that John By-The-Way and his nipple hardening priestcrafts will motivate them all at some gay Youth Conference.

[DrumNFeather]

Does anyone know why the church changed Ricks to BYU-Idaho? Seems like it was a move so that more kids could say that they went to BYU without qualifying which one. Then again, when my brother was at his sister in law's hs graduation, one of the kids was announced as attending BYU-Provo Campus.

[Solon]

Does anyone know why the church changed Ricks to BYU-Idaho? Seems like it was a move so that more kids could say that they went to BYU without qualifying which one. Then again, when my brother was at his sister in law's hs graduation, one of the kids was announced as attending BYU-Provo Campus.

I think it had to do with changing Idaho to a 4-year school and accreditation. It's a lot easier to open up a new campus of an established school than to found a new one.

But I still call it Ricks.

[Hallelujah]

It seems to me like BYU is a great investment for the Church.

How many kids who go to BYU would have left the Church and never payed tithing if they had attended another university? I think it's a pretty big number. Getting intelligent LDS students to marry other LDS students (often more orthodox) is a great way to keep members within the fold.

So it's all about tithing and increasing revenue to the Church? Interesting. A little too conspiratorial for me, though.

I think they should expand the Institute program rather than create other BYU campuses. Which I think they know.

[Hallelujah]

I think it had to do with changing Idaho to a 4-year school and accreditation. It's a lot easier to open up a new campus of an established school than to found a new one.

But I still call it Ricks.

That is correct.

[LA Ute]

I think they should expand the Institute program rather than create other BYU campuses. Which I think they know.

That's exactly the plan, I think. I'm amazed at what the Institute at the U. of U. has become (in a positive sense). It seems to be much more of a gathering place than it was during my student days (just at the close of the Paleolithic era). My two sons are not "Norman the Mormon" but they hang out there a lot. In my era it seemed like Norman was the only guy there most of the time.

I also think that the Brethren realize what a monster they created with BYU, and how horribly that experiment has turned out, so they are now trying to limit the damage.

(I know this is not Cougarboard, but I'll reassure everyone that I am just kidding anyway.)

[SeattleUte]

My fourteen point plan for making BYU respectable:

1) Remove all GA's from the Board; appoint a lay board of qualified members;

2) Renounce all funding from the LDS Church;

3) Raise tuition by 1,000 percent;

4) Reduce enrollment by 70%;

5) Eliminate religion course requirements; handle it in general Western Civ. curricula and mountain west and Utah history courses;

6) Eliminate the honor code;

7) Issue formal apology for MEP 1955 talk and the like;

8) Disassociate with FARMS, which can become an independent "think tank" associated with the mother church;

9) Adopt a formal academic freedom policy as part of a mission statement (probably not necessary at most other universities but critical for heralding BYU's new makeover);

10) Formally recognize gay student groups;

11) Aggressively fund raise for endowment based on announced new independence;

12) Step up pursuit of federal grants and contracts;

13) Eliminate any subsidy or favoratism for LDS applicants.

14) Recruit a new president with qualifications like Michael Young.

[BigPiney]

But I still call it Ricks.

You and me both. It will always be Ricks and will live forever in infamy as RCVikings continues to represent.

[LA Ute]

My fourteen point plan for making BYU respectable:

1) Remove all GA's from the Board; appoint a lay board of qualified members;

2) Renounce all funding from the LDS Church;

3) Raise tuition by 1,000 percent;

4) Reduce enrollment by 70%;

5) Eliminate religion course requirements; handle it in general Western Civ. curricula and mountain west and Utah history courses;

6) Eliminate the honor code;

7) Issue formal apology for MEP 1955 talk and the like;

8) Disassociate with FARMS, which can become an independent "think tank" associated with the mother church;

9) Adopt a formal academic freedom policy as part of a mission statement (probably not necessary at most other universities but critical for heralding BYU's new makeover);

10) Formally recognize gay student groups;

11) Aggressively fund raise for endowment based on announced new independence;

12) Step up pursuit of federal grants and contracts;

13) Eliminate any subsidy or favoratism for LDS applicants.

14) Recruit a new president with qualifications like Michael Young.

What is scary is that you actually mean all of this.

[SeattleUte]

What is scary is that you actually mean all of this.

If they did this they would look like Notre Dame or Georgetown. That's scary?

[il Padrino Ute]

My fourteen point plan for making BYU respectable:

1) Remove all GA's from the Board; appoint a lay board of qualified members;

2) Renounce all funding from the LDS Church;

3) Raise tuition by 1,000 percent;

4) Reduce enrollment by 70%;

5) Eliminate religion course requirements; handle it in general Western Civ. curricula and mountain west and Utah history courses;

6) Eliminate the honor code;

7) Issue formal apology for MEP 1955 talk and the like;

8) Disassociate with FARMS, which can become an independent "think tank" associated with the mother church;

9) Adopt a formal academic freedom policy as part of a mission statement (probably not necessary at most other universities but critical for heralding BYU's new makeover);

10) Formally recognize gay student groups;

11) Aggressively fund raise for endowment based on announced new independence;

12) Step up pursuit of federal grants and contracts;

13) Eliminate any subsidy or favoratism for LDS applicants.

14) Recruit a new president with qualifications like Michael Young.

I suggest you forward this immediately to the Board of Trustees. Let us know if you get a response...specifically a response other than "Kiss our hineys."

[LA Ute]

If they did this they would look like Notre Dame or Georgetown. That's scary?

No, what's scary is that you may actually think anyone with decision-making authority might actually take even a single element of your proposal seriously. I think you're getting pretty close to going over the edge, SU!

[SeattleUte]

No, what's scary is that you may actually think anyone with decision-making authority might actually take even a single element of your proposal seriously. I think you're getting pretty close to going over the edge, SU!

I love the fact no one would take even a single element seriously. It's very affirming.