I learned in church today

[clackamascoug]

I would "guess" that the 250K/per is very low.

[falafel]

Isn't it a bit disingenuous to suggest that the Church's only cost is building costs/maintenance?

What about humanitarian aid?
What about aid to the poor in the ward (food/rent)?
What about the missionary program?
What about free copies of the book of Mormon and the Bible?
What about GA stipends?
What about other building maintenance (COB, Tabernacle, Temples, Conference Center, Seminary buildings, etc.)
What about Seminary teacher pay?
What about CES pay?

Its late, I'm sure there are a lot more examples. Your question feels a bit like if I were to say "I paid my mortgage and my car payments each month, but I can't figure out where the rest of the money is going!" Its all drained away by a billion different things.

[pellegrino]

I would "guess" that the 250K/per is very low.

I was shooting for the conservative side. I know for a fact that my ward brings in upwards of$400K

[pellegrino]

Isn't it a bit disingenuous to suggest that the Church's only cost is building costs/maintenance?

What about humanitarian aid?
What about aid to the poor in the ward (food/rent)?
What about the missionary program?
What about free copies of the book of Mormon and the Bible?
What about GA stipends?
What about other building maintenance (COB, Tabernacle, Temples, Conference Center, Seminary buildings, etc.)
What about Seminary teacher pay?
What about CES pay?

Its late, I'm sure there are a lot more examples. Your question feels a bit like if I were to say "I paid my mortgage and my car payments each month, but I can't figure out where the rest of the money is going!" Its all drained away by a billion different things.

Read it again, I never said that.

you identify very logical destinations for church funds, let's make a few more estimates.

If the average unit costs $55k to run, then that means ~ 1.6 billion is spent on just running the units. That's less than half of the estimated gross revenue of North American units. It doesn't include any revenue from foreign units. Does it make sense that the church is spending a billion plus on all of the things you mentioned?

Keep in mind, some of those spending lines you brought up have their own revenue streams that are outside of tithing (perpetual education fund, fast offerings, individuals and families paying for their own missions), that have not been included in my estimates.

Those outside revenues make the missionary program, the welfare program, and humanitarian aid basically self sustaining. Are we really paying CES employees that much?

Where does the money go?

[old_gregg]

Does it make sense that the church is spending a billion plus on all of the things you mentioned?

yes, easily

[imanihonjin]

yes, easily

No kidding. The church has basically gone from temples numbering barely in the double digits to now having almost 175 announced, under construction, or finished in less than two decades.

[Paperback Writer]

Isn't it a bit disingenuous to suggest that the Church's only cost is building costs/maintenance?

What about humanitarian aid?
What about aid to the poor in the ward (food/rent)?
What about the missionary program?
What about free copies of the book of Mormon and the Bible?
What about GA stipends?
What about other building maintenance (COB, Tabernacle, Temples, Conference Center, Seminary buildings, etc.)
What about Seminary teacher pay?
What about CES pay?

Its late, I'm sure there are a lot more examples. Your question feels a bit like if I were to say "I paid my mortgage and my car payments each month, but I can't figure out where the rest of the money is going!" Its all drained away by a billion different things.

Tuition subsidies for BYU and BYU-Idaho?

[byu71]

Tuition subsidies for BYU and BYU-Idaho?

Why does the church do this? As popular as BYU is now and I believe the education you get is of the highest quality, why are students still subsidized? If a going rate tuition was charged, I think you would still have the same number of students. Perhaps a different mix, but the same number.

An explanation from those closer to the decsion making process would be appreciated.

[Sullyute]

Why does the church do this? As popular as BYU is now and I believe the education you get is of the highest quality, why are students still subsidized? If a going rate tuition was charged, I think you would still have the same number of students. Perhaps a different mix, but the same number.

An explanation from those closer to the decsion making process would be appreciated.

are you suggesting that all students pay the same unsubsidized rate or should BYU go the Harvard route where there is a sliding scale of tuition based on the ability (or parents' ability) to pay?

[Paperback Writer]

Why does the church do this? As popular as BYU is now and I believe the education you get is of the highest quality, why are students still subsidized? If a going rate tuition was charged, I think you would still have the same number of students. Perhaps a different mix, but the same number.

An explanation from those closer to the decsion making process would be appreciated.

In my view, BYU has been the best investment ever made by the LDS church. Pellegrino estimates the revenue brought in my US wards and a huge chunk of that is possible because of the affordable and high quality education BYU provides. Also, subsidizing a large university has allowed generations of Mormons to marry other Mormons, remain in the LDS faith and pay tithing, and raise children who are observant and pay tithing. If not for BYU, I think there could be a lot of LDS outside the Mormon West who marry outside the faith and don't observe the law of tithing because a non-member spouse is not OK with donating 10% of the family income.

It will be interesting to watch how the church subsidizes BYU as BYU becomes more like Notre Dame as far as acceptance rates. I went to high school with a lot of Catholics and many of them wanted to attend Notre Dame. Many applied but none were accepted. Most of the Mormon kids who applied to BYU got accepted back them. However, Notre Dame and BYU are not even close to being in the same tier as far as tuition rates. Maybe that will change when the majority of applicants don't gain acceptance to BYU.

[TripletDaddy]

are you suggesting that all students pay the same unsubsidized rate or should BYU go the Harvard route where there is a sliding scale of tuition based on the ability (or parents' ability) to pay?

We have gone the Harvard route with our academics, we might as well go that same route with our finances.

[Jeff Lebowski]

In my view, BYU has been the best investment ever made by the LDS church. Pellegrino estimates the revenue brought in my US wards and a huge chunk of that is possible because of the affordable and high quality education BYU provides. Also, subsidizing a large university has allowed generations of Mormons to marry other Mormons, remain in the LDS faith and pay tithing, and raise children who are observant and pay tithing. If not for BYU, I think there could be a lot of LDS outside the Mormon West who marry outside the faith and don't observe the law of tithing because a non-member spouse is not OK with donating 10% of the family income.

It will be interesting to watch how the church subsidizes BYU as BYU becomes more like Notre Dame as far as acceptance rates. I went to high school with a lot of Catholics and many of them wanted to attend Notre Dame. Many applied but none were accepted. Most of the Mormon kids who applied to BYU got accepted back them. However, Notre Dame and BYU are not even close to being in the same tier as far as tuition rates. Maybe that will change when the majority of applicants don't gain acceptance to BYU.

I heard someone say the other day that 30% of the leadership in the church = BYU grads. I have no idea how this would be defined or if it is accurate, but it is difficult to overstate the quality of the students being admitted now. Tremendously talented and terrific leaders. It is a great investment to subsidize their education in the BYU environment.

[TripletDaddy]

Hail to the Cougars, the Leaders and Best!

[imanihonjin]

Hail to the Cougars, the Leaders and Best!

The Greatest University in the World!

[TripletDaddy]

The Greatest University in the World!

and the most recognized logo in all sports!