LDS Garments: Why I Want Out of This Club

[Mrs. Funk]

I'd go have it done tomorrow.

Only it if meant not having to wear garments, right? Otherwise, that's just plain crazy.

[UtahDan]

Only it if meant not having to wear garments, right? Otherwise, that's just plain crazy.

Yes, obviously not if we still had to wear garments.

[Mrs. Funk]

Yes, obviously not if we still had to wear garments.

Yeah, I suppose it was a bit obvious. I made a tiny huge mistake.

[Moliere]

I actually think that would be cool. The bodies of men were (and for the most part still are) mutilated as infants as a sign of a covenant. Obviously we are not asked to do it, but I don' think it would be inconsistent with any gospel principle. I'd go have it done tomorrow.

Going anywhere in Utah that required shorts or a swimsuit would be very interesting. You'd know right away who was Mormon and who wasn't....well at least who was Mormon at some point.

[BoylenOver]

My only exposure to garments came in my last relationship. She was very open about what they are and what they mean to her, and they definitely helped her keep her covenants.

[Uncle Ted]

My wife has similar struggles with the women's garment. She has taken to buying the "petite" sized garments in the spandex because that is the most form fitting option and has the least amount of excess material. She used to receive a lot of crap from the old ladies at the distribution center because at 6'1", they didn't think she should buy the petites. After discussing her difficulty, she found that they will custom make garments for you. The garments are made within some parameters but are more custom. I wonder if that could help you in your quest to avoid garment belly bunch and leg lift.

Just have your wife order the petites off the web site. No questions asked except for your TR number.

That aside, I expect we will see tank-top garment tops or "wife beater" garment tops within a generation. Such an adjustment doesn't seem problematic religiously and it seems inevitable given the direction garment size and shape have gone.

This may create a whole new white field "already to harvest" in the south.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Have any of these urban legends regarding garments protecting people from burns, etc. ever been substantiated? Shouldn't we go back to ankle and wrist-length garments if they are supposed to protect our skin, or just start wearing mithril armor under our clothes?

I am late on responding, but historians say that it started after the martyrdom at Carthage. Joseph and Hyrum (and a few others) had removed their garments due to the heat, but John Taylor had not. After Taylor's seemingly miraculous survival, many of the saints attributed it to the fact that he didn't remove his garments.

[scottie]

I am late on responding, but historians say that it started after the martyrdom at Carthage. Joseph and Hyrum (and a few others) had removed their garments due to the heat, but John Taylor had not. After Taylor's seemingly miraculous survival, many of the saints attributed it to the fact that he didn't remove his garments.

Any idea what the history is on the guideline to wear them all the time? Does it come from verbiage or a commandment in the temple? Or a prophet saying that's how it should be so it worked it's way into the TR questions? Is it in the D&C?

[Surfah]

I am late on responding, but historians say that it started after the martyrdom at Carthage. Joseph and Hyrum (and a few others) had removed their garments due to the heat, but John Taylor had not. After Taylor's seemingly miraculous survival, many of the saints attributed it to the fact that he didn't remove his garments.

There are some cool traditions regarding the garment. Some hold that the garment given Adam was passed down and worn by the succeeding patriarchs down to Noah. This is how Noah was able to command the animals to fill his ark two by two as they recognized the garment Adam given him in the Garden of Eden. The garment was then passed to Ham who then had them stolen by his son Nimrod (great-grandson of Noah and rather interesting and important character who isn't mentioned much in the OT. This is how Nimrod became a mighty hunter. Kind of like bait fishing in a stock pond. When Esau beheads Nimrod he inherits the garment. And these are the best clothes referred to that Rebecca takes (because Esau had not put them on - interesting in the context of our discussion and wearing the garment day and night) for Jacob. Isaac smells the garment and blesses Jacob. There is another tradition that bypasses Ham and Nimrod and says that the garment went from Noah to Shem to Abraham. But I like the Nimrod stealing the garment best.

[Gidget]

I agree with all you ladies. Garments are really very difficult. Almost ot the point that I feel like it is some kind of punishment.

I am particularly bitter about wearing them in the summer and especially now that I am nursing for the first time (there is no way to do it, nursing garments=joke).

I have been wearing them everyday out of fear. Sad isn't it? I do believe in the covenants I have made, but I hate feeling trapped. Squashed by submission. There is no one we can write to, no one we can talk to about this. I am with Mrs. Funk - It isn't about wanting to show more skin or even be less hot (temperature-wise). It is about being able to wear modest clothing without drawing attention to yourself OR the weird white underwear you have on.

I get so mad that I actually had a hard time reading this thread, it makes me want to cry. I don't understand with the thousands of women, who I AM SURE have the same issues with their G's, how there is no consulting the masses who actually wear them. And by masses I mean majority, not a 70 year old general RS/Primary/YW Pres. I am not even sure they are consulted, I honestly put G's on and have a distinct feeling they are designed by a Priesthood holder.

This is really a tough subject. Female G's need better design. Even a legit comment box in the lobby would be cool.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Any idea what the history is on the guideline to wear them all the time? Does it come from verbiage or a commandment in the temple? Or a prophet saying that's how it should be so it worked it's way into the TR questions? Is it in the D&C?

I think it just gradually evolved. If the prophet felt inclined to take them off when it was hot, it obviously was different at first.

There was no official pattern for quite a while either. Members just made their own. Eventually, someone suggested that they adopt a common pattern and the prophet (BY I think) agreed.

Speaking of temple recommends, it was quite a few years before they started using recommends (well after they came to Utah). At first it was a fairly simple process that was primarily a verification from your bishop that you were an active member. Over time they gradually added more and more questions. It wasn't until the 1930's or so that WoW questions were added to the TR questions. Of course, this was a significant factor in the evolution of WoW from counsel to commandment.

Interesting how all of this stuff evolves over time.

[I.J. Reilly]

And by masses I mean majority, not a 70 year old general RS/Primary/YW Pres.

Sister Beck is 55, thank you very much!

Sometimes I think I'd be cooler with wearing a kippah, but I think we've got a thousand years or so before we get there.

[UtahDan]

This is really a tough subject. Female G's need better design. Even a legit comment box in the lobby would be cool.

This is an interesting metaphor for almost any issue a woman might have in the church. This is the reason I keep bumping that patriarchy thread of mine. As I have begun to see the world through the eyes of my daughter, I have felt frustration over how little input or recourse women have in many situations.

[Uncle Ted]

There are some cool traditions regarding the garment. Some hold that the garment given Adam was passed down and worn by the succeeding patriarchs down to Noah. This is how Noah was able to command the animals to fill his ark two by two as they recognized the garment Adam given him in the Garden of Eden. The garment was then passed to Ham who then had them stolen by his son Nimrod (great-grandson of Noah and rather interesting and important character who isn't mentioned much in the OT. This is how Nimrod became a mighty hunter. Kind of like bait fishing in a stock pond. When Esau beheads Nimrod he inherits the garment. And these are the best clothes referred to that Rebecca takes (because Esau had not put them on - interesting in the context of our discussion and wearing the garment day and night) for Jacob. Isaac smells the garment and blesses Jacob. There is another tradition that bypasses Ham and Nimrod and says that the garment went from Noah to Shem to Abraham. But I like the Nimrod stealing the garment best.

I read about the following a while back and thought it was kind of interesting:

Gammadia on Early Jewish and Christian Garments

Among the textile fragments excavated at Masada were the remains of pieces of fabric with L-shaped cloth markings affixed to them. Dating to before A.D. 73, these are among the very earliest known examples of such marked garments. Among the textile fragments excavated at Masada were the remains of pieces of fabric with L-shaped cloth markings affixed to them. Dating to before A.D. 73, these are among the very earliest known examples of such marked garments. Scholars refer to these markings as gammadia, some of them being shaped like the Greek letter gamma (G). Though similar patterns have been found in several locations, the significance of these markings remains unknown to archaeologists and art historians. Because these markings seem to appear artistically in conjunction with some hope for life or glory after death, their presence on the clothing found at Masada may reflect something about the religious hopes and convictions of the Jewish fighters who died there.

[Moliere]

Not to keep pushing my suggestion, but you sound very frustrated. Why not just find something that fits you (and is white, and modest) and make your own garment? The church used to sell patterns for members to make their own anyway, so its not like there's no precedent for this.

I realize this isn't the most orthodox solution, but its got to be better than just tossing garments altogether.

Go to about the 53 minute mark on podcast #3 of the Daymon Smith podcast. I laughed when he mentioned this.

http://mormonstories.org/?p=980