Why Men Hate Going To Church

[Surfah]

I actually like going to church now more than I did as a youth. I enjoy sitting with my family. I am busy during the week and it seems like we're always adding stuff to the schedule especially with soccer and softball starting up. And I really like being in primary with the other little kids. They all think I'm cool and fight to sit next to me. But I enjoy teaching these kids and trying to keep them engaged. I get genuinely sad and emotional to think that if statistics bear out most of those kids won't be active someday. I am going to miss that as I just got a new calling in the EQ presidency. I don't think anyone is going to fight to sit next to me in priesthood.

[Indy Coug]

I've asked to be the Gospel Doctrine teacher ("if you ever need someone with a solid base a teacher to be the Gospel Doctrine teacher, I'd be willing"). Instead I'm "service projects coordinator" and my wife is the damned nursery leader, and our daughter in the only kid in the nursery!

So you've freed up a couple of other members to do the heavy lifting so they can learn the kinds of things you learned while you were in New Orleans.

Enjoy the vacation while it lasts.

[Rosebud]

I kinda think the emasculation of men is a problem all across society right now. I'm frankly pretty sickened by the way schools expect little boys to act like little girls. I could go on an on about the ways that boys aren't treated fairly, believe it or not .

Not speaking of the church now, but I wonder if the broader societal problem (as it exists IMO) might be collateral damage from the feminist and gay rights movements.

[cowboy]

I've asked to be the Gospel Doctrine teacher ("if you ever need someone with a solid base a teacher to be the Gospel Doctrine teacher, I'd be willing"). Instead I'm "service projects coordinator" and my wife is the damned nursery leader, and our daughter in the only kid in the nursery!

I've found that helping a teacher deliver a good lesson through strategic participation is much more challenging and rewarding than actually teaching the lesson. I'll admit that this is tough in larger classes, and nearly impossible with a teacher who isn't willing to play along.

I really enjoy my calling as a SS teacher, but I confess that sacrament meeting is often just something to be endured.

[RC Vikings]

Four more months until my youngest leaves and then I'm on the BYU71 schedule. I'm not enduring that well.

[hostile]

I'm reading "Why Men Hate Going to Church," and it's quite an interesting book. I certainly don't agree with everything in it, but the author makes some valid points. It would be fun for CUF to read it.

One of the points is eerily akin to something I said during President Packer's talk:

Me: Correlation has emasucalted men and patronized women. It's substituted policy wonks, company men, and wusses for leaders.

Sirs: I haven't thought about it like that.

Me: And its revised history to turn every Church leader into a wuss. Even Brigham Young--a hardy pioneer man who could sometimes be brash--has been correlated into a complete wimp. Maybe this is why some men cling to Captain Moroni so much--he was an ass kicker.

Sirs: Ok, I can see that.

Me: It's making me rethink my opposition to Scouts. Scouts is the last corner in the Church where men are reawarded for taking risks, being courageous, and coming up with new ideas. Try any of those things in your basic Mormon meeting and it isn't likely to go over well. Moreover, Duty to God is a wussified replacement for Scouts. It's waiting in the wings.

Sirs: But the Young Women's program gets short shrift compared to the Scouts.

Me: That's true. Perhaps that's what policy wonks do to compensate for trying to turn all of the stallions into geldings. It's the lining on the velvet coffin.

Sirs: You're sexy when you talk like this.

Me: Let's have meat for dinner.

It took me a bit to figure out why you would refer to your wife as SIRS. I read that as Systemic Inflammatory Response Syndrome - not a pretty disease at all, with every organ system shutting down. No wonder my wife isn't thrilled when I "talk about work" when we are at social events.

[YOhio]

My problem with church is that they schedule ot on the same day there are a lot of NFL games. If they held it on Wed. night I think more men would enjoy it, imo.

[UtahDan]

What did Christ get out of doing what he did?

He did what he did for others. Out of pure love. Are you saying that this is the reason you go to church or that we shouldn't expect to get anything?

[jay santos]

I haven't been to elder's quorum consistently for ten years and really not much at all my entire adult life. I'm always in young men's or primary. So I haven't had to deal with elder's quorum for a long time.

A few years ago I stopped going to Gospel Doctrine except for rare occasion. But for opposite reasons. I don't mind the boring lessons. I can't handle the politics discussions and the Christian church bashing and the anti-grace self-righteous comments and the doctrinal stuff I disagree on like overemphasis of deification or even the crazy doctrinal stuff (like the exact age of God).

If someone could guarantee me a perfectly correlated lesson with perfectly correlated comments, I'd be more apt to want to attend.

I enjoy sacrament meeting usually.

[Indy Coug]

He did what he did for others. Out of pure love. Are you saying that this is the reason you go to church or that we shouldn't expect to get anything?

I think if your focus is primarily "what does it do for me" that you may possibly be missing out on what it could do for you.

[UtahDan]

I think if your focus is primarily "what does it do for me" that you may possibly be missing out on what it could do for you.

If I am honest, my primary focus when I go to church is the fact that being there makes me feel good. On Sunday anyway. The other five days of the week I am there my focus is on enduring to the end.

I ask sincerely, do you think that is the wrong focus? Perhaps worship is a more proper focus, is that what you are saying? If so, I would agree with that.

[Sleeping in EQ]

I propose that we read this book. It's cheap and will lead to all sorts of interesting discussions. It might even contribute to a more beneficial church experience.

[Jeff Lebowski]

http://speeches.byu.edu/reader/reader.php?id=2553

Nibley gave this talk at a commencement address, but I sometimes think that the primary audience he had in mind were not those that were graduating.

That's a classic. One of my favorite parts:

At the present time, Captain Grace Hopper, that grand old lady of the Navy, is calling our attention to the contrasting and conflicting natures of management and leadership. No one, she says, ever managed men into battle. She wants more emphasis in teaching leadership. But leadership can no more be taught than creativity or how to be a genius. The Generalstab tried desperately for a hundred years to train up a generation of leaders for the German army, but it never worked, because the men who delighted their superiors, i.e., the managers, got the high commands, while the men who delighted the lower ranks, i.e., the leaders, got reprimands. Leaders are movers and shakers, original, inventive, unpredictable, imaginative, full of surprises that discomfit the enemy in war and the main office in peace. For managers are safe, conservative, predictable, conforming organization men and team players, dedicated to the establishment.

[Indy Coug]

If I am honest, my primary focus when I go to church is the fact that being there makes me feel good. On Sunday anyway. The other five days of the week I am there my focus is on enduring to the end.

I ask sincerely, do you think that is the wrong focus? Perhaps worship is a more proper focus, is that what you are saying? If so, I would agree with that.

For me, the primary purpose of going to church is setting aside time (despite the interruptions from wrestling with my kids and so forth) to reflect on my week and partaking the sacrament to help me repent of all the things I've said on CUF the last 7 days. Next, it's for me to participate fully in class and my pre-block meetings and fulfilling my calling to help in whatever small way I can those around me.

For me it's pretty much that simple, but I recognize that my situation is not your situation, my goals are not your goals, my needs are not your needs

[Babs]

I kinda think the emasculation of men is a problem all across society right now.

I was thinking this, too.