Why are chiropractors scam artists?

[myboynoah]

I'm honestly interested in knowing. My parents swore by them, but I can't ever see myself going to them. Are they legit, or at least kind of legit? Why? How do they compare to acupunturists? What is the science behind all of this?

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

doctorcoug has already told me I'm an idiot, when I had a heniated disc for about 3 months and the pain reached a point that I basically was non-functioning in February, my doctor gave me Percoset and said I could get an MRI and maybe surgery. A friend said he'd seen a chiro and I decided to give it a try. After about 3 weeks of once a week visits I was in little to no pain, he said that if I wanted I could see him every other month or so, or just come back if the pain/numbness returned. That was in April.

There was no popping or cracking that I always envisioned of a chiro, a lot of stretching and resistance type things. If it is a swindle it is the best swindle of my life.

[jay santos]

I am really anti-chiropractor. I went to one for a herniated disk. They took me into a back room and gave me a presentation and worked me harder than been worked by any MLM sales pitch. I was embarrassed for them. They wanted me to commit to a $$ number of how important my health was. How do you answer that? "Yeah my overall health is kind of important to me, I'm willing to shell out $10 a week for it."

I went in over back pain, and they gave me this presentation on how depending on how much money I was willing to fork over, they could cure all my health issues: headaches, colds and runny noses, weight loss, etc.

I have asked others about this, and others seem to have had similar experiences with other chiropractors.

[Mormon Red Death]

doctorcoug has already told me I'm an idiot, when I had a heniated disc for about 3 months and the pain reached a point that I basically was non-functioning in February, my doctor gave me Percoset and said I could get an MRI and maybe surgery. A friend said he'd seen a chiro and I decided to give it a try. After about 3 weeks of once a week visits I was in little to no pain, he said that if I wanted I could see him every other month or so, or just come back if the pain/numbness returned. That was in April.

There was no popping or cracking that I always envisioned of a chiro, a lot of stretching and resistance type things. If it is a swindle it is the best swindle of my life.

I've had the same experience. I've thrown out my back 4 times. They have really helped me.

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[TexTechCoug]

I am really anti-chiropractor. I went to one for a herniated disk. They took me into a back room and gave me a presentation and worked me harder than been worked by any MLM sales pitch. I was embarrassed for them. They wanted me to commit to a $$ number of how important my health was. How do you answer that? "Yeah my overall health is kind of important to me, I'm willing to shell out $10 a week for it."

I went in over back pain, and they gave me this presentation on how depending on how much money I was willing to fork over, they could cure all my health issues: headaches, colds and runny noses, weight loss, etc.

I have asked others about this, and others seem to have had similar experiences with other chiropractors.

I think they are very helpful in relieving back and neck pain.

The problem is that they are trying their darndest to get you to come back 2-3 times a week forever. They must teach the high pressure tactic in their schools because it is so common.

If they would limit their scope of practice those areas in which they actually get results they wouldn't have such a bad reputation. I can only imagine that the pseudo science and high pressure sales keep them busy and make $$$, so they keep at it.

[ERCougar]

I used to have no problem with chiropractors in treating back or neck pain.

Then I became facebook friends with my cousin's wife. She's a chiropractor and batshit crazy. Literally every post has something to do with chiropractic care as the answer to overall health, neonatal chiropractic manipulation , and the dangers of vaccinations/genetically modified food/traditional medical care (and by traditional, she of course means evidence-backed modern western medicine, and not completely unproven alternative and eastern medicine). I've followed a few of her posted links and discovered that the field of chiropractic medicine has no intention of limiting itself to back and neck pain--those who do this are looked on with disdain and are not "true" chiropractors.

So, I kind of have a problem with it now. Honestly, I don't know anything that a chiropractor could help that a massage therapist or physical therapist couldn't, and at a lower cost and with better results. And a whole lot less quackery.

[LiveCoug]

There are wacky chiros and there are good chiros. They have their place, but some of them can truly go too far.

[TripletDaddy]

I've posted before about my uncle in law chiro that says crazy stuff. He is socially awkward and always wants to work on everyone at Sunday dinner gatherings. He carries a briefcase filled with pulsating machines and laser guns and magnets. His weirdness goes beyond the pale as he incorporates elements of priesthood ordinances into his work, "casting out" spirits before he does any work on a patient. I think he is the extreme.

In fairness to chiros, I had a really bad back pain once and was desperate, so I went to a local chiro that did electric stim. That machine was an answer to prayer (if I would have prayed about such matters). It felt great and helped.

I've been two two chiros in my life, both of them here in Utah. One was the electric stim guy the other one was a guy who uses this torture rack that mashes your vertebrae into place. I don't like that machine much and didn't go back. I prefer the warm soothing electric stim machine.

I dont have an answer to myboynoah's question. It appears that many chiros want to cure everything. They often eschew modern medicinal best practices. They often want to sell you vitamins and homeopathic solutions. My crazy uncle in law has stated that he could cure cleft palate and acid reflux via back adjustments. Most rational people aren't going to buy into that. But if you want someone to work on your back, a reputable chiro seems like a good option.

Another thing I noticed about both chiros that really impressed me. Both times I went in with back pain and they had me hunch forward just a bit. They looked at my back and could instantly pinpoint the exact spot of the back pain, simply by looking at my back. I would slouch my shoulders forward a bit and they took their finger and pressed it directly on the exact spot where I had a massive knot or whatever it was. I guess my vision isn't refined enough to spot knots, but they could see it instantly. It was pretty cool.

[Jeff Lebowski]

3-4 years ago I had some aggravating, on-going back pain. My friend insisted that I go see his chiropractor so I gave it a shot. He did the standard crack-your-back and electrolysis stuff and he also had a brass knuckle thing that he used to torture me with. Hurt like hell, but he said it was necessary. I still had the old pain but now I also had bruising from the brass knuckle. I kept going back every week for a couple of months and nothing changed so I realized I was just wasting my money and stopped. Finally, I made an appointment with a massage therapist. That one visit did more good than all the chiro visits put together.

Similar to others' experiences, most of the chiros I have known have also been into general quackery, big time. They claim all your problems are due to back alignment and/or they diagnose your problems and then they just happen to be selling the herbs, supplements, etc that you need to buy to restore your health.

[CardiacCoug]

Sure HFN and DDD, I don't know much about back pain but I am sure there are some types of back pain that could be improved with deep massage or "adjustment" so I don't doubt at all that some people benefit from back pain treatment from a chiropractor. There are plenty of smart, reliable people who felt a lot better after seeing a chiropractor and I believe them.

The thing to remember about back and neck pain, though, is that 1. it almost always goes away on its own and 2. it is cyclical so when it's at its worst it can only get better no matter what you do.

Here are the major problems I have with chiros, though.
1. Non-scientific underlying theory of "subluxation" as a health problem that affects the entire body.
2. Aggressive business model with frequent return visits and maintenance visits.
3. Impersonation of a physician without relevant medical training -- patients may put off getting a real medical evaluation if they are seeing a chiro.
4. Preying on chiropractic students. What a nightmare for poor students who are often in for $200,000 before realizing that they have to lie to and manipulate vulnerable and ignorant patients for their business to succeed.
5. Spine x-rays performed and radiation administered with no medical indication and no qualified reader of the x-ray.

That's what comes to mind for now -- I'm sure there's more.

[Jeff Lebowski]

4. Preying on chiropractic students. What a nightmare for poor students who are often in for $200,000 before realizing that they have to lie to and manipulate vulnerable and ignorant patients for their business to succeed.

Years ago, we had a young guy in our ward who was in this boat. Just finished chiro school and was massively in debt and realized he had made a gigantic mistake. He was in hell.

[frank ryan]

I echo Jeff's experience. I have chronic back pain (due to a herniated disc). I didn't know the cause and I went and saw a chiropracter who wanted to see me 3xs a week indefinitely. I went a few times, it would feel good for less than a day. I decided to try massage therapy and the relief was much longer lasting.

[TexTechCoug]

I've had good results, but I never schedule repeat visits. I go once and almost always have had relief of pain that lasts.

Back pain is a bummer and there are many people; chiropractors, neurosurgeons, orthopods, and interventional pain management doctors who spin MRIs, x-rays, and really poor quality evidence into very lucrative careers which do little or nothing for their patients.

[CardiacCoug]

Back pain is a bummer and there are many people, chiropractors, neurosurgeons, orthopods, and interventional pain management doctors who all spin MRIs, x-rays, and really poor quality evidence into very lucrative careers which do little or nothing for their patients.

This is true, but just because there are a lot of unethical spine specialist MDs doesn't mean chiropractors should be given a pass.

However I think if it's a choice between going to a chiropractor or going to a pain physician who will make a patient an oxycodone/oxycontin/methadone/fentanyl patch addict then I would tell somebody to go see the chiro.

[frank ryan]

This is true, but just because there are a lot of unethical spine specialist MDs doesn't mean chiropractors should be given a pass.

However I think if it's a choice between going to a chiropractor or going to a pain physician who will make a patient an oxycodone/oxycontin/methadone/fentanyl patch addict then I would tell somebody to go see the chiro.

What is up with that? There are some shady pain clinics around that act less ethically than the neighborhood dope dealer. I've seen people's lives ruined.