Max Hall: Overrated?

[Colly Wolly]

LA Ute,

Are these the kinds of reactions you were hoping for when you started this thread?

[LA Ute]

LA Ute,

Are these the kinds of reactions you were hoping for when you started this thread?

Pretty much. I really was hoping to get some real insight and info on Hall because living in L.A., I pretty much focus my efforts on following the Utes and didn't know much about him. So thanks to everyone.

BTW I was at the BYU-Utah game last fall and that's the only time I have seen Max play a full game. I did watch most of the Vegas Bowl against Arizona. Those two games were not shining moments for Max, but I knew his career stats were good so I was curious about how knowledgeable BYU fans really saw him. The rap on Max is that he doesn't do well against fast secondaries -- but he has one season left to show he can.

Now that I have accepted my status as an old guy (although I feel pretty young at 54) I can see these college players as the kids they are (I have two sons the age of most BYU and Utah players). Max is doing fine for a 22 year-old.

[cougjunkie]

I'm ready to what Max can do. (Some on this thread seem to think he already has shown us. Aren't we football fans great?)

Kidding aside, I am sure Max is eager to show that he can win big games against big-time competition. He has a chance to do so this season. His destiny is in his own hands.

I remember that going into his senior year, I had some questions about Brian Johnson's ability to lead, stay cool, and win the big ones. A lot can change between a junior and senior year. (I do hope for a similar result in the rivalry game, however . . . .)

Max does have wins against TCU, Utah, and he is 5-2 against the PAC-10.

[BoylenOver]

It's funny to me how BYU's lost 7 games in three seasons, but my fellow Utah fans (and an Alabama sympathizer) seem to think the wheels are coming off because the Cougars are on a 2-game losing streak.

I suppose if you create a straw man by saying BYU fans think Max Hall is a Heisman candidate this year he is overrated, but by conventional methods the perception equals reality.

That said, while the presented argument is "Max Hall can't win big games", and he beat TCU and Utah in 2007, his numbers were only good in one of those games (26/44 for 306 yards, 1 TD, and 1 INT vs. TCU in 2007). In 4 total games against Utah and BYU, he's averaging below 250 yards passing and has 1 TD pass to 8 INT's.

[whoneedscorners?]

Pretty much. I really was hoping to get some real insight and info on Hall because living in L.A., I pretty much focus my efforts on following the Utes and didn't know much about him. So thanks to everyone.

BTW I was at the BYU-Utah game last fall and that's the only time I have seen Max play a full game. I did watch most of the Vegas Bowl against Arizona. Those two games were not shining moments for Max, but I knew his career stats were good so I was curious about how knowledgeable BYU fans really saw him. The rap on Max is that he doesn't do well against fast secondaries -- but he has one season left to show he can.

Now that I have accepted my status as an old guy (although I feel pretty young at 54) I can see these college players as the kids they are (I have two sons the age of most BYU and Utah players). Max is doing fine for a 22 year-old.

The whole "doesn't do well against fast secondaries" argument is IMO garbage. UCLA was plenty fast and Max had a field day against them. I would say Max doesn't do well against prepared defenses.

Both TCU and Utah knew exactly where the ball was going to go. A couple things that stick out in my mind are Max's first pick against TCU and the second half of the Utah game. He threw his first pick in the TCU game when the safety jumped the route almost before the ball was thrown. Against Utah, they put D-lineman in the passing lanes and stacked the side that Collie was on.

Max definitely has his flaws. His inability to look off receivers undoubtedly cost BYU. But to be fair, he wasn't always put in the best position to succeed either. In both his bad games last year BYU was severely out coached.

Max isn't stupid. He knows what his weaknesses were last year. The coaches aren't stupid either. Both sides have made and will continue to make adjustments. I expect Max to have a very good Sr year...

[LA Ute]

It's funny to me how BYU's lost 7 games in three seasons, but my fellow Utah fans (and an Alabama sympathizer) seem to think the wheels are coming off because the Cougars are on a 2-game losing streak.

I suppose if you create a straw man by saying BYU fans think Max Hall is a Heisman candidate this year he is overrated, but by conventional methods the perception equals reality.

That said, while the presented argument is "Max Hall can't win big games", and he beat TCU and Utah in 2007, his numbers were only good in one of those games (26/44 for 306 yards, 1 TD, and 1 INT vs. TCU in 2007). In 4 total games against Utah and BYU, he's averaging below 250 yards passing and has 1 TD pass to 8 INT's.

Keep this up and you're going to get your UF.Net privileges revoked, buddy!

[LA Ute]

Max isn't stupid. He knows what his weaknesses were last year. The coaches aren't stupid either. Both sides have made and will continue to make adjustments. I expect Max to have a very good Sr year...

Make no mistake, many (less jingoistic) Ute fans respect him. We hope he proves us wrong . . . .

[Shaka]

Last season we found that Max had a couple of things to work on during the offseason. As long as he has addressed these concerns there's no reason why he doesn't have a monster season.

Max is a very good quarterback and I believe he will prove it this season.

[BoylenOver]

Keep this up and you're going to get your UF.Net privileges revoked, buddy!

I thought they were already revoked.

[smokymountainrain]

I suppose if you create a straw man by saying BYU fans think Max Hall is a Heisman candidate this year he is overrated, but by conventional methods the perception equals reality.

This is the key right here. The initial claim was that he's overrated. You have to either have some past accolades or you have to be hyped to a certain extent in order to be overrated. Hall didn't win MWC offensive player of the year last year. He was 2nd team in a pretty mediocre conference. That's about where he should be based on how he played. Certainly not overrated.

Is Hall really a serious Heisman candidate? A straw man, indeed. If he's a Heisman candidate it's only because people might have hope that he can have a Beck-like turnaround for his senior season. Again, I'm not seeing the overrated part of this.

I've never been one to shy away from criticizing BYU players and Max Hall is no exception. But the "overrated" argument, by itself, simply doesn't hold water.

[Ruby Soho]

I'm glad the Utah / TCU game isn't on a Thursday this year. I'd hate for Max to be split again between watching "The Office" with his wife or maybe an important conference game to watch.

[JohnnyLingo]

Someone already mentioned this, but what set Beck apart his senior season was his ability to rocket pinpoint strikes to his receivers against good secondaries. See: TCU 2006 for the best example of that. I doubt Max's arm will ever be able to perform those kinds of throws, and as such, he will continue to struggle against fast, prepared defenses.

My two cents.

[Indy Coug]

I'm not quite sure how Hall can be considered overrated. Virtually every opinion I've seen of him over the last 7 months is either lukewarm or downright negative.

[Flattop]

The whole "doesn't do well against fast secondaries" argument is IMO garbage. UCLA was plenty fast and Max had a field day against them. I would say Max doesn't do well against prepared defenses.

Tommy Grady had a field day against UCLA as well (in SLC), so I'm not sure how good of a measuring stick the Bruins are. But I think you still make a good point about prepared defenses.

The coaches aren't stupid either. Both sides have made and will continue to make adjustments.

No, the coaches aren't stupid, but they may have fallen into a trap smart people often do, getting arrogant. It appeared that they believed that their system was so good that all the players had to do was execute and they would be unstoppable. This led to not making adjustments, which only helped those fast, prepared defenses.

[jay santos]

Max suffers from being Kevin Feterikish.

He was advanced early in his career and played at a high level as a sophomore. He hasn't improved a lot since then and likely won't. His arm strength gives him a ceiling that will be hard to break through.

He's still a great (or at least very good) college QB.