What were you thinking.....honestly...

[cougjunkie]

To say he's had some drops is an understatement in my mind. He had 8+ just last week. That is 4.2 standard deviations above the norm of 3 drops per game. For people who haven't taken stats, that is a number that blows your bell curve out of the water.

Heaps will be fine. He looks better/more poised and more accurate as a Freshman than Beck did in game situations. He will be fine.

I counted he had 11 against Utah State. 11 drops, if they catch 5 of those balls he throws for 75 more yards and a td (I am looking at you JJ).

This PER stuff that keeps getting thrown out is bullshit if you ask me. You can look at the kid and anybody who has ever watched a game can tell that he is special and he has the ability to be very good.

[MartyFunkhouser]

By not excelling you mean going 2-1 in his career vs Utah?

Yes, he was 2-1 against the Utes, but it isn't like he had great games against them either.

2007:
17-40, 269 yards, 0 TDs, 1 INT, 93.99 rating
2008:
21-41, 205 yards, 0 TDs, 5 INT, 51.2 rating
2009:
12-32, 134 yards, 2 TDs, 0 INT, 93.30 rating

I guess, I'm still not seeing it how Jake Heaps with a worse running game and wide receivers is going to kill the Utes, when Hall couldn't really accomplish that during his 3 games against Utah. All 3 of his games against Utah were subpar in comparison to his performances against other teams. I'm expecting the same from Jake Heaps.

[jay santos]

That is what you're most disappointed in? You should pay attention more.

I'm most disappointed in Jake because we have all our eggs in his basket. Guys drop passes, you can fix that. We suck at safety? That's happened before.

What happens when you're QB University and have leveraged the franchise for a guy, with no backup plan, and find out maybe he's not that great?

[Goatnapper'96]

Hell, Max Hill never excelled vs. Utah. But a QB with a PER well below triple figures will?

I think Heaps is better suited to perform better against Utah than Hall, but I doubt it happens this year or next year for that matter.

Hall was a better career qb than Beck, but Beck sliced up Utah twice. And in both times doing it he/the offense sucked hind tiddy for two quarters. While I believe Beck faced far poorer Utah defenses than Hall did, I think it speaks of the oft spoken issues of matchups.

[TheBYUGuy]

I counted he had 11 against Utah State. 11 drops, if they catch 5 of those balls he throws for 75 more yards and a td (I am looking at you JJ).

This PER stuff that keeps getting thrown out is bullshit if you ask me. You can look at the kid and anybody who has ever watched a game can tell that he is special and he has the ability to be very good.

Yes, I counted about 10, on top of 10 more that he had the previous week. Yes, Heaps looks like a freshman at times, but his PER would be at least average if his receivers weren't dropping as many balls as they are catching.

[Flystripper]

I'm probably mostly disappointed with Heaps. I'm just not feeling it. Barkley had a pass rating of 131 last year. Heaps is 89. The ten year NCAA average is 130 with st dev of 16.4. Heaps is 2.5 st dev's below the average. That's really really really really bad for your guys who never took stats.

I know it's not all about stats and Heaps has had some drops and some extenuating circumstances. But I look at him and I see a QB that might be a decent D1 QB in two years not a guy who should be leading a program like BYU's.

SC's receivers are a tad more talented than BYU's, but I hear what you are saying. Heaps has not performed well. Lets see how he does over the course of a full season before we write him off as a 3-4 year project though.

[MartyFunkhouser]

I counted he had 11 against Utah State. 11 drops, if they catch 5 of those balls he throws for 75 more yards and a td (I am looking at you JJ).

This PER stuff that keeps getting thrown out is bullshit if you ask me. You can look at the kid and anybody who has ever watched a game can tell that he is special and he has the ability to be very good.

He does have the ability to be very good, but he isn't very good yet. Right now he has shown that he has great arm strength and throws a good deep ball. He hasn't proven yet that he can be consistent with the short and mid range stuff. His accuracy has not been great. He has a long way to go before he is very good. I do expect him to reach that level, but doubt it will be this year.

Plus, for Heaps to "kill Utah" he actually needs help from the players around him. Utah has traditionally played to stop the pass first against BYU. Even with arguably your best RB of all time, you haven't been able to put up great pass numbers the past 3 years.

Now a freshmen QB with a mediocre ground game and bad WRs is going to come in and do something that Hall couldn't accomplish even with the support of Unga?

[jay santos]

It's funny to me how everyone can rip every position but Heaps is untouchable. Heaps has been nothing short of abysmal. OMG he can throw a deep out, I can't stop touching myself. He throws a nice ball. Lots of potential D1 QB's have strong arms. There's a lot more to it than that. If there are ten key characteristics of a successful D1 QB, he's shown maybe two of them so far in games. He has not proven a thing on the field.

*Disclaimer so you guys don't take this too far. I do not think he'll be a failure at BYU. Maybe he's a great practice player and sucks in games and just hasn't put it together yet. But what he's shown on the field should give no one any confidence whatsoever that he won't be a failure.

[TheBYUGuy]

It's funny to me how everyone can rip every position but Heaps is untouchable. Heaps has been nothing short of abysmal. OMG he can throw a deep out, I can't stop touching myself. He throws a nice ball. Lots of potential D1 QB's have strong arms. There's a lot more to it than that. If there are ten key characteristics of a successful D1 QB, he's shown maybe two of them so far in games. He has not proven a thing on the field.

I would think that one of the 10 characteristics of being a successful D1 QB would be having guys around you who can catch a football. Another one would be to have a good running game to take some pressure off the passing game. I could argue that successful QBs also typically have a decent defense so they're not always playing from multiple scores behind.

In at least these three factors, Jake Heaps has been a miserable failure.

[Top Ute]

This PER stuff that keeps getting thrown out is bullshit if you ask me. You can look at the kid and anybody who has ever watched a game can tell that he is special and he has the ability to be very good.

There's potential, and there's results. There's nothing in terms of results to indicate Jake Heaps will have even a so-so game against Utah, much less an exceptional one.

I won't disagree that Heaps may have all the potential in the world, but we know what we're getting with BYU's skill position players, ie, there's not a big-play threat in the bunch. That's not going to change as things stand now.

[Flystripper]

It's funny to me how everyone can rip every position but Heaps is untouchable. Heaps has been nothing short of abysmal. OMG he can throw a deep out, I can't stop touching myself. He throws a nice ball. Lots of potential D1 QB's have strong arms. There's a lot more to it than that. If there are ten key characteristics of a successful D1 QB, he's shown maybe two of them so far in games. He has not proven a thing on the field.

*Disclaimer so you guys don't take this too far. I do not think he'll be a failure at BYU. Maybe he's a great practice player and sucks in games and just hasn't put it together yet. But what he's shown on the field should give no one any confidence whatsoever that he won't be a failure.

I agree that he has shown very little to be excited about other than some very physically talented throws that for the most part have been dropped by shitty receivers. Do I have confidence in him to lead us back to greatness? Not yet, but I do realize he is only 5 games into his college career and has only played the equivalent of about 3.5 games and I have a glimmer of hope.

What is more disturbing to me than Heaps' lack of development, is BYU's lack of playmakers on offense. Maybe there are playmakers currently on missions. Maybe there are injured play makers (Apo?). I have no idea. All I know is that I don't care how polished Heaps, Lark or Munns becomes if BYU continues to lack any offensive playmaking ability at the WR, TE, RB and FB positions.

[Sizzle]

It's funny to me how everyone can rip every position but Heaps is untouchable. Heaps has been nothing short of abysmal. OMG he can throw a deep out, I can't stop touching myself. He throws a nice ball. Lots of potential D1 QB's have strong arms. There's a lot more to it than that. If there are ten key characteristics of a successful D1 QB, he's shown maybe two of them so far in games. He has not proven a thing on the field.

*Disclaimer so you guys don't take this too far. I do not think he'll be a failure at BYU. Maybe he's a great practice player and sucks in games and just hasn't put it together yet. But what he's shown on the field should give no one any confidence whatsoever that he won't be a failure.

He's a true freshman! What do you expect? Of course he isn't untouchable. He's made mistakes, and he'll continue to make them. He's missed guys who are open, and made decisions that weren't the greatest, and he should be held accountable for those mistakes. But he needs some help. A bigger issue than Heaps is the receivers, and not just with drops. The drops are absolutely horrendous, but a bigger part is the receivers are not getting open. Heaps has had to force so many passes into coverage because guys can't get separation (I'm looking at you McKay). But he's had plenty of throws that should have been caught for TDs (calling out Hafoka in the Nevada game, Ashworthless and JJ in the Utah State game, and I think it was Wilson at the goal line in the Washington game). Add in those TDs and his rating jumps back up into triple digits.

Look at the Utah State game. He had two TD passes that were dropped, and 10 total dropped passes. If those balls get caught, his line looks like 37-55 for 370 yards (he averaged 10 per complete) with 2 TDs and 2 INTs. That puts him at a very acceptable 131 passer rating. He's not perfect. But he's not the worst QB in the history of BYU.

[Goatnapper'96]

It's funny to me how everyone can rip every position but Heaps is untouchable. Heaps has been nothing short of abysmal. OMG he can throw a deep out, I can't stop touching myself. He throws a nice ball. Lots of potential D1 QB's have strong arms. There's a lot more to it than that. If there are ten key characteristics of a successful D1 QB, he's shown maybe two of them so far in games. He has not proven a thing on the field.

*Disclaimer so you guys don't take this too far. I do not think he'll be a failure at BYU. Maybe he's a great practice player and sucks in games and just hasn't put it together yet. But what he's shown on the field should give no one any confidence whatsoever that he won't be a failure.

I remember thinking the same about Beck and then suddenly he became a total stud when a bunch of other things, which had greatly been outside of his control for his first 3 years, lined up. This is my opinion of Jake. I don't think he knows where he is supposed to throw the ball and when he is supposed to throw it. However, I have seen enough to believe that when that piece comes together and he has the other components of a good rush game and a good defense, he will become very studly. I stand with those more impressed with him than Beck at similar times in their career. However, Beck was so unprepared to play that first year it was a waste. This year is a bit of a waste for Jake, IMO, but not as much as Beck's was.

I don't know what a failure is, but I think Heaps is going to be all conference caliber by his junior year and potentially earlier. IMO if next year he were to come into the support cast that Hall had when Hall was a soph, it would be a better year than BYU had in '07.

[UtahDan]

I have been reading, listening to, and participating in various discussions re: the state of BYU football right now and I was wondering how the pulse of CUF would answer....

Many seem to be in either panic mode or, at the very least, despair/shock over the team's current record. Admittedly, the outlook for this season looks dim at best.

I referenced before that SC fans are having a difficult time with the fact that the team is not competing for a national championship in the coming seasons, yet the writing was clearly on the wall.

I am seeing some similarities now amongst BYU fans. Everyone knew this was going to be a rebuilding year. Everyone knew BYU had lost the core and heart of the team....over the past couple of seasons, Max, Collie, Pitta, Unga et al... Everyone knew that Riley can't throw a deep ball and everyone knew that Jake Heaps was going to be a true Freshman.

So what were your honest expectations going into this season? Does the shock/panic indicate that many ignored the writing on the wall? Is 1-4 really that shocking? Is a 6 win season that unbelievable?

For my part, I knew we would not compete for a conference championship, let alone anything more glamorous than that. I hoped, yes...but I knew hope would be futile. I guess I did buy into the Kool-Aid a bit in that I assumed that we would NOT lose to teams like Utah State. Losing to FSU on the road I can understand, but I thought we would handle schools like Reno and USU. Granted, UNR is having a great and unexpected season, but that is not an excuse.

Having gone through the Matt Barkley drama, I can honestly say that I never expected Heaps to go undefeated, but I did expect him to lay a foundation for a solid future. True freshman generally can't win all your games for you. Thus far, I am actually really pleased with Heaps. He has a lot of work to do, but he has the tools.

I was thinking we would win approx 7 games. I was obviously off on that. I am thinking we will likely win around 5 games now. Interestingly, that may be enough to go a bowl this year...a sad commentary on the state of the college football bowl system.

http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showpost.php?p=427360&postcount=10

[Goatnapper'96]

He's not perfect. But he's not the worst QB in the history of BYU.

I think there is a good argument that for this one year he is really close.

However, I think there is a great deal outside his control and the program shortcoming was having to use him. I thought he would be more prepared than he is and I also thought that BYU would not have to rely upon him as much.

I really think any strong opinions on Heaps should wait until at least this time next year. There are indicators of both future suckitude and greatness and one can find whatever they want to satisfy their point.