Non-Conference Scheduling rumors

[Portland Ute]

Personally I don't know why U fans are so quick to defend this. Why is the Pac-12 attempting to marginalize the only competitive threat in its footprint such a bad thing from their perspective? There shouldn't be any need to justify or dismiss it. It's BYU's problem. Not theirs...

Yep.

If anything....

:clap:

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

So Shog was 9/11 an inside job?

[jay santos]

Regardless, if his strategy is what you say it is...

Agree. It would be dumb to have any other strategy. And even more dumb for BYU managers or fans to think Utah is wrong or immoral for it. Even more dumb yet if BYU managers made any serious plans banking on Utah not acting like that.

[shoganai]

Except that really isn't true.

Maybe we define "own" in completely different ways.

Regardless, if his strategy is what you say it is...

The problem is more that Utah DOESN'T own the market, and the most simple way to obtain the same ownership they have in every other major western market (treating Las Vegas as a separate beast) doesn't work for Cal and Stanford.

BYU still has about a 60/40 overall market share in a bad year. It's more like 2/1 on average in the last decade. Stealing market share from BYU is easily Scott's most obvious avenue for growing his business long term since adding new markets or increasing penetration through mergers is off the table.

[jay santos]

Except that really isn't true.

Maybe we define "own" in completely different ways.

Regardless, if his strategy is what you say it is...

Owned is a more accurate than own. We owned the market in the 90's. It's been a slow erosion since then. It won't be long before Utah owns the Utah market if BYU keeps getting shut out of the conference picture.

[Scratch]

Just in that it was agreed to before it became un-PC to schedule BYU. I have no idea when they actually decided to fax the contract over, but with the agreement made in principle and ESPN pulling the strings, it really didn't matter.

You'll have to take my word for it since I can't link to my sources.

So there wasn't anything there that I said that was wrong. I'm aware that ESPN (Dave Brown) was involved in setting it up, but there was nothing formally in place until December 2011. As you probably know, these things fall apart all the time. The bottom line is that if there was anything significant from Scott or the conference about not playing BYU, this contract would have never been signed in December 2011.

[Scratch]

The problem is more that Utah DOESN'T own the market, and the most simple way to obtain the same ownership they have in every other major western market (treating Las Vegas as a separate beast) doesn't work for Cal and Stanford.

BYU still has about a 60/40 overall market share in a bad year. It's more like 2/1 on average in the last decade. Stealing market share from BYU is easily Scott's most obvious avenue for growing his business long term since adding new markets or increasing penetration through mergers is off the table.

I'm curious where you're getting the 60/40 and 2 to 1. Everything I've seen seems to indicate that it's about a wash in the state (I assume you're talking either about the state as a whole or the Wasatch front, as you are discussing a market).

[Portland Ute]

BYU still has about a 60/40 overall market share in a bad year. It's more like 2/1 on average in the last decade. Stealing market share from BYU is easily Scott's most obvious avenue for growing his business long term since adding new markets or increasing penetration through mergers is off the table.

I'd be interested in where you are pulling those numbers.

Regardless, if it's the most obvious avenue, then why NOT pursue it?

[shoganai]

I'm curious where you're getting the 60/40 and 2 to 1. Everything I've seen seems to indicate that it's about a wash in the state (I assume you're talking either about the state as a whole or the Wasatch front, as you are discussing a market).

It's coming from my decade-long stint working in the Utah sports media industry, I left that business around 2008.

The details of how it's all formed and calculated are pretty long and boring, but the bottom line is BYU still holds a sizable advantage in both the DMA, and in the state as a whole.

Utah's numbers are slightly better when you just consider the Salt Lake DMA, but not by much. While you eliminate BYU-dominant southern and central Utah, you also add in southern Idaho and pockets of Wyoming and Nevada that are overwhelmingly blue.

[Scratch]

It's coming from my decade-long stint working in the Utah sports media industry, I left that business around 2008.

The details of how it's all formed and calculated are pretty long and boring, but the bottom line is BYU still holds a sizable advantage in both the DMA, and in the state as a whole.

Utah's numbers are slightly better when you just consider the Salt Lake DMA, but not by much. While you eliminate BYU-dominant southern and central Utah, you also add in southern Idaho and pockets of Wyoming and Nevada that are overwhelmingly blue.

How does that square with all the polls that show one or the other marginally ahead of the other in the state?

[shoganai]

How does that square with all the polls that show one or the other marginally ahead of the other in the state?

What polls?

[Scratch]

What polls?

Here's an article from a couple of years ago that details a few years of polling. I have seen some since that show the trend slowly continuing to shift to Utah, if I recall correctly, but the bottom line is that the numbers are close and go back and forth.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/7...rade.html?pg=1

[The_Douger]

I could easily see an off the record discussion with Pac 10 AD's and the commish.

Larry Scott: "BYU owns the Utah market, and we want it. Our strategy is to let BYU die a slow death with their independence thing. We already see a slow shift to Utah over BYU in the Utah TV market. We want to encourage that trend. They depend on Pac teams for their scheduling, so if you want to support your new Utah brother, it would be a good show of support to stop scheduling them. Utah plans to cut them off. But we don't want this to get out and make us look like jerks. It could back fire. So do what you want to do, but that's my stance on it."

Isn't it pretty much even as far as the Utah market is concerned?

Edit: I saw that it's been discussed above, now.

[YOhio]

So Shog was 9/11 an inside job?

Go to hell you PAC12 fanboi. BYU is blacklisted by Larry Scott and Stanford and Cal because anti-Mormon bigotry. Those are the facts.

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

Go to hell you PAC12 fanboi. BYU is blacklisted by Larry Scott and Stanford and Cal because anti-Mormon bigotry. Those are the facts.

I'm having lunch with 2 members of the Oregon athletic department tomorrow. I'm going to ask how much they've been told to avoid BYU. I assume none since they are both involved in basketball scheduling and told me last year they were hopeful the bball series could become somewhat regular. I imagine they are liars though.