Does Florida make a run at Whittingham?

[All-American]

You really can't be serious, right? "Best football player ever [sic]".

Sammy Baugh, at his peak as a college player, achieved an amazing completion rate of 50.5%. He came into his own as a pro player and was merely a very good college athlete. That speaks little of TCU's tradition, in fact, might suggest that they had a great player that the TCU thumpers couldn't figure out how to use.

Using your logic, Brown University has an amazing tradition for football excellence and a place like Northern Iowa is a real program on the rise...

Okay, there is clearly no point in arguing with you. At this point, you're disputing the indisputable.

The fact is, TCU's history, while ancient, by far outclassed what Utah had before Meyer. Heck, NYU and Chicago have histories that outclassed Utah pre-Meyer. And Patterson assumed control of a TCU program that had just made a run at the BCS and produced the number one pick of the draft. They were on the rise.

If you're still disputing this, you're simply up in the night. I'll leave you and exie to make whatever sorts of noises you wish.

[U-Ute]

And Patterson assumed control of a TCU program that had just made a run at the BCS and produced the number one pick of the draft. They were on the rise.

While I agree that they were a team on the rise, they were far from making a run at the BCS.

1998 WAC Dennis Franchione, 8-4, Sun Bowl vs USC (W 28-19)
1999 WAC Dennis Franchione, 8-4, Mobile Alabama Bowl vs East Carolina (W 28-14)
2000 WAC Dennis Franchione, 10-2, Mobile Alabama Bowl vs Southern Miss (L 28-10)
2001 Independent Gary Patterson, 6-6
2002 C-USA Gary Patterson, 10-2, Liberty Bowl vs Colorado State (W 17-3)

The 2000 Mobile Alabama Bowl was the first game coached by Patterson.

None of those really scream being on the verge of busting the BCS.

U-Ute

[All-American]

While I agree that they were a team on the rise, they were far from making a run at the BCS.

1998 WAC Dennis Franchione, 8-4, Sun Bowl vs USC (W 28-19)
1999 WAC Dennis Franchione, 8-4, Mobile Alabama Bowl vs East Carolina (W 28-14)
2000 WAC Dennis Franchione, 10-2, Mobile Alabama Bowl vs Southern Miss (L 28-10)
2001 Independent Gary Patterson, 6-6
2002 C-USA Gary Patterson, 10-2, Liberty Bowl vs Colorado State (W 17-3)

The 2000 Mobile Alabama Bowl was the first game coached by Patterson.

None of those really scream being on the verge of busting the BCS.

U-Ute

In 2000, they only had one loss going into the bowl game. They were 7-0 going into week eight, ranked 13 in the BCS poll and had cracked the top ten. Even after their loss, they were at 14 in the last three polls.

[Viking]

In 2000, they only had one loss going into the bowl game. They were 7-0 going into week eight, ranked 13 in the BCS poll and had cracked the top ten. Even after their loss, they were at 14 in the last three polls.

Go to Texas...any town will do...and make the argument that TCU has a great football tradition. You're nuts.

[All-American]

Go to Texas...any town will do...and make the argument that TCU has a great football tradition. You're nuts.

Lucky for me, I don't have to prove "great." I just have to prove "better than Utah." That isn't that tough.

[Viking]

Lucky for me, I don't have to prove "great." I just have to prove "better than Utah." That isn't that tough.

Utah does have a better football tradition than TCU. Utah, through 2008, has played 1,045 games, winning 58.6% of its games (#34 of active Div I teams). TCU has played 1,120 games and has won 52.1% (#63 of same cohort). Utah has won 80% of its bowl games, TCU 46%.

Further, TCU, by virtue of its location, has no excuses. Utah has done more with less.

[All-American]

Utah does have a better football tradition than TCU.

Not before Meyer and Whittingham.

[Viking]

Not before Meyer and Whittingham.

970 games played through the 2002 season for the Utes and they won 57.1% (43rd on active list).

1,045 for TCU over the same period, and they won 50.4% of those games (75th on active list).

You're incorrect.

[SeattleUte]

The question under consideration is whether Whitthigham's climb was less vertical than Patterson's (we're being a bit premature here since Boise still may beat TCU, like it very nearly did lat year). Clearly it wasn't. Patterson took over a program that was an established success, which is why Alabama hired his predecesor. Whittingham didn't take over a ready made BCS bowl champion; he had to rebuild.

Part of what's going on here, like the Ute fan base's belief that 2004 was the greatest team not just in Utah history but in the history of college football, is the myth of Urban Meyer. Two events created that myth: First, Utah's historical, groundbreaking season in 2004 (since surpassed by Kyle Whittingham and perhaps matched by Gary Patterson); second, Florida's evisceration of unbeaten, no. 1 ranked Ohio State in the 2006-07 BCS bowl.

Urban Meyer is a great coach. But he has been extraordinarily fortunate in terms of timing. No one is saying he's not a good recruiter. But his success at Utah had nothing to do with his recruiting prowess. Neither has Kyle Whitthingham's success had much if anything to do with Urban Meyer's recruiting prowess. Kyle built Utah's current program all by himself, with his own recruits and coaching talent.

Urban may be no better than 10-20 other coaches in the country, with a little more bad luck. One of the coaches who appears to be his equal is Kyle Whittingham. Kyle has already succeded spectacularly in the seemingly impossible task of following Pope Urban. I bet he could do it again. It would be easier to do at Flordida than it was at Utah. If I were Bernie M. I'd hire him in a flash. I'd offer him the moon, so much money he couldn't resist. It would be a great set up and a great unfolding story.

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

First, Utah's historical, groundbreaking season in 2004 (since surpassed by Kyle Whittingham and perhaps matched by Mike Patterson); second, Florida's evisceration of unbeaten, no. 1 ranked Ohio State in the 2006-07 BCS bowl.

Who?

[Portland Ute]

That Mike Patterson is one helluva coach.

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

Every Day Should Be Saturday with a fun run down of the Florida coaching potentials. They like both Patterson and Whitt, at least much more than the Kool-Aid man.

[SeattleUte]

Who?

Gary, dipshit.

[SeattleUte]

That Mike Patterson is one helluva coach.

SHUTUP

[All-American]

970 games played through the 2002 season for the Utes and they won 57.1% (43rd on active list).

1,045 for TCU over the same period, and they won 50.4% of those games (75th on active list).

You're incorrect.

If you use THAT measuring stick, perhaps. If you use a different one (say, national championships, heismans, or athletes for whom trophies given to the nation's best quarterback are named), TCU come out on top.

At any rate, it should be clear enough that TCU had a sparkling era of success many, many years ago, while Utah had nothing of the sort at any time before Meyer.