Colin Powell is one of our greatest leaders

[Goatnapper'96]

I doubt you lack faith.

He's a fraud.

I don't think Obama is a fraud. He is a liberal pragmatist. When he gets information he did not previously have he is willing to alter his course, I think how outspoken he was on some various foreign affairs issues that he has reversed course on indicates that. Domestically, he is trying to do what he said he would. His shortcomings, from my limited perspective, are twofold. Primarilly he suffers from the same syndrome afflicted to very capable people. He believes that he can talk anyone into anything. Kind of like a black SeattleUte in that way. When he went to the press last week looking to shore up public support for his health care reform, I felt for the dude. He needs to learn that he can't convince everyone just by talking. He was befuddled and not the normal Obama I have come to fear. I thought someone had kidnapped my President and replace him with "DYNOMITE!" His second shortcoming is his lack of experience in DC. He does not yet understand that the god of lawmakers is reelection. He still thinks he can talk them out of it - see shortcoming # 1. I think in the end his pragmatist perspective will win out and if anything comes from health care it will be seriously watered down from what he claimed on the campaign trail. I don't think that makes him a fraud.

[il Padrino Ute]

I don't think Obama is a fraud. He is a liberal pragmatist. When he gets information he did not previously have he is willing to alter his course, I think how outspoken he was on some various foreign affairs issues that he has reversed course on indicates that. Domestically, he is trying to do what he said he would. His shortcomings, from my limited perspective, are twofold. Primarilly he suffers from the same syndrome afflicted to very capable people. He believes that he can talk anyone into anything. Kind of like a black SeattleUte in that way. When he went to the press last week looking to shore up public support for his health care reform, I felt for the dude. He needs to learn that he can't convince everyone just by talking. He was befuddled and not the normal Obama I have come to fear. I thought someone had kidnapped my President and replace him with "DYNOMITE!" His second shortcoming is his lack of experience in DC. He does not yet understand that the god of lawmakers is reelection. He still thinks he can talk them out of it - see shortcoming # 1. I think in the end his pragmatist perspective will win out and if anything comes from health care it will be seriously watered down from what he claimed on the campaign trail. I don't think that makes him a fraud.

Actually, I meant that he's a fraudulent Messiah.

[Goatnapper'96]

True. I guess being involved in politics will ultimately result in becoming a politician.

I know, that sentence was full of insight.

He was the first, and perhaps only, 4 star general who never commanded beyond brigade command. His brigade command evaluation reports we less than complimentary. He was always a politician. Most high ranking generals are, but his was more pronounced because he demonstrated so far less as a warrior.

There is a lot to admire about Powell and he would be a great lieutenant, but at the end of the day he is not a great leader IMO- his track record shows that he is frequently all to cautious with his opinions to make sure they are popular. That makes him a great lieutenant but not genuine leader material. It would not have bothered me if he would have taken a staff position for Obama. I think he loves America and could be of great service with his capacity.

[il Padrino Ute]

He was the first, and perhaps only, 4 star general who never commanded beyond brigade command. His brigade command evaluation reports we less than complimentary. He was always a politician. Most high ranking generals are, but his was more pronounced because he demonstrated so far less as a warrior.

There is a lot to admire about Powell and he would be a great lieutenant, but at the end of the day he is not a great leader IMO- his track record shows that he is frequently all to cautious with his opinions to make sure they are popular. That makes him a great lieutenant but not genuine leader material. It would not have bothered me if he would have taken a staff position for Obama. I think he loves America and could be of great service with his capacity.

I didn't know that about Powell. I just assumed he had commanded beyond brigade.

I still think he's a good man and wants what is best for the country. I suppose my thoughts about him were based on not realizing that Generals can be and are politicians, so when he started sounding like a politicians, it just didn't compute.

[kccougar]

I attended a speech of his at Virginia Tech. I was also underwhelmed.

[RobinFinderson]

I attended a speech of his at Virginia Tech. I was also underwhelmed.

Just so we can all have a frame of reference for your personal speech-whelming-meter, could you please name a speech that overwhelmed you, and also point out why? And also a speech that merely 'whelmed' you. Calibration of this sort does best with a minimum of three points of reference.

[Surfah]

Just so we can all have a frame of reference for your personal speech-whelming-meter, could you please name a speech that overwhelmed you, and also point out why? And also a speech that merely 'whelmed' you. Calibration of this sort does best with a minimum of three points of reference.

In the same day I heard Colin Powell speak I heard Rudy Giuliani speak. Mind you this is when Rudy was clearly the GOP front runner and Colin's name was in the rumor mill. I never cared much for Rudy. But he came off very well that day. Robert Patterson was more polished as well and had a better, coherent message. But he's a televangelist.

[Flattop]

He was the first, and perhaps only, 4 star general who never commanded beyond brigade command.

Don't forget Eisenhower.

[happyone]

He was the first, and perhaps only, 4 star general who never commanded beyond brigade command. His brigade command evaluation reports we less than complimentary. He was always a politician. Most high ranking generals are, but his was more pronounced because he demonstrated so far less as a warrior.

I think he commanded V Corps before Gulf I. He never had a Division though. He came out of the White House and was given V Corp before going back to the Pentagon as Chairman

[I.J. Reilly]

In the same day I heard Colin Powell speak I heard Rudy Giuliani speak. Mind you this is when Rudy was clearly the GOP front runner and Colin's name was in the rumor mill. I never cared much for Rudy. But he came off very well that day. Robert Patterson was more polished as well and had a better, coherent message. But he's a televangelist.

I feel like you and I attended the same motivational/managment conference thingy. Zig Ziglar was at the one I went to, Rudy, Forbes, and a few others. It was one of the worst days of my life. There were religious come-ons, stock-trading tips (for a price!) and a semi-power hour where a volunteer was called on stage and taught how to break a board in half. I felt like I was trapped in MLM hell with a whole bunch of eager idiots by my side. I hated every second I was there, and I will never forgive the people that dragged me there.

It was interesting to see Rudy, as everyone knew he was gearing up to run at the time. It was the day I decided to never vote for Rudy.

[Goatnapper'96]

I think he commanded V Corps before Gulf I. He never had a Division though. He came out of the White House and was given V Corp before going back to the Pentagon as Chairman

I thought I read that he was the Deputy Corps Commander. Besides that, isn't a Corps a larger unit than a Division? I am pretty sure that the XVIII Airborne Corps included the 82nd Airborne, 101st Air Assault and 10th MTN Divisions. So if he didn't command a Division, I doubt he commanded a Corps as it would mean he skipped one level of command.

[Surfah]

I feel like you and I attended the same motivational/managment conference thingy. Zig Ziglar was at the one I went to, Rudy, Forbes, and a few others. It was one of the worst days of my life. There were religious come-ons, stock-trading tips (for a price!) and a semi-power hour where a volunteer was called on stage and taught how to break a board in half. I felt like I was trapped in MLM hell with a whole bunch of eager idiots by my side. I hated every second I was there, and I will never forgive the people that dragged me there.

It was interesting to see Rudy, as everyone knew he was gearing up to run at the time. It was the day I decided to never vote for Rudy.

Probably was. It dragged. I didn't pay for it. We made fun of the lemmings running out to buy the stock trading programs. They do it every year all across the country.

[Jarid in Cedar]

Probably was. It dragged. I didn't pay for it. We made fun of the lemmings running out to buy the stock trading programs. They do it every year all across the country.

[YOUTUBE]Ea8ki0yAXwY&feature=related[/YOUTUBE]

[Flattop]

I thought I read that he was the Deputy Corps Commander. Besides that, isn't a Corps a larger unit than a Division? I am pretty sure that the XVIII Airborne Corps included the 82nd Airborne, 101st Air Assault and 10th MTN Divisions. So if he didn't command a Division, I doubt he commanded a Corps as it would mean he skipped one level of command.

Yes, a corps is larger than a division. (shocking that the navy guy knows that while the army guy is unsure.) Wiki reports that Powell took command of the V Corps in Franfurt, Germany in 1986.

[happyone]

I thought I read that he was the Deputy Corps Commander. Besides that, isn't a Corps a larger unit than a Division? I am pretty sure that the XVIII Airborne Corps included the 82nd Airborne, 101st Air Assault and 10th MTN Divisions. So if he didn't command a Division, I doubt he commanded a Corps as it would mean he skipped one level of command.

Yes a Corp is bigger than a div. He came out of the White House and went there. He had it less than a yr then went back to the Pentagon. How do I say this nicely, there was a lot of people who thought that there were more deserving 2/3 stars out there. The fact that he hadn't had a division came up alot also. From the O-Club discussions I heard, most people, thought he was the ultimate political general. not quite a Cortney Massengale ( a character from the novel Once an Eagle ), but... Admittedly this is from LT/Capt level bs sessions.

When I was in the 101st, the XVIII ABC was the 101st, 82nd, and the 24th ID ( I don't know how they got the tanks to fall out of airplanes without breaking )