President Trump: Making America Great Again...

[chrisrenrut]

Where is the GA case? That is the only one of the 3 that seemed criminal to me. I am with USUC on the hush money case. IMO it is only being brought against Trump for political reasons. I think the 06 Jan is reason to not vote for him but difficult to prove criminal intent when other folks did the illegal stuff. I thought he should have been impeached because of what he did wrt election results in GA.

Right. But the senate leaders refused to impeach, saying it should be sorted out in the courts instead.

Impeachment as a tool defined in the constitution has become a joke. Politics today make it impossible to be used effectively as it was intended.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Right. But the senate leaders refused to impeach, saying it should be sorted out in the courts instead.

Impeachment as a tool defined in the constitution has become a joke. Politics today make it impossible to be used effectively as it was intended.

Yeah, the impeachment process is a joke. Trump could commit murder and they wouldn't impeach him.

[Goatnapper'96]

The documents case seems like the most black and white one to me.

I can't see that one working when every President and VP seems to inadvertently take Top Secret documents with them.

[PaloAltoCougar]

I can't see that one working when every President and VP seems to inadvertently take Top Secret documents with them.

I agree that every previous president (and likely most every worker in the West Wing) has probably taken top secret documents, not with malicious intent but through simple carelessness. But the comparison with what Trump did when compared to any of the others, including Biden, is both stark and disturbing. For example, when Biden's docs were discovered he immediately notified the proper authorities, allowed additional searches, and did pretty much everything reasonably (and legally) expected. We shouldn't punish him or others who do the same. Trump. on the other hand., throughout the process refused to cooperate, provided false statement concerning documents in his possession, instructed his employees to hide some of the documents,, etc. (I'm sure there are a host of essays outlining the huge (and, I think, very culpable) differences between how Trump operates and how all of his predecessors have. Trump has made a career (going back to his and his father's slumlord days) of skirting the law and obfuscating his wrongdoing, just as Roy Cohn taught him. It's time the courts put an end to this.

[falafel]

I can't see that one working when every President and VP seems to inadvertently take Top Secret documents with them.

Curious in what way you don't see it "working." The public won't buy it? The judge won't buy it? The jury wouldn't convict? Are you suggesting Trump will argue selective enforcement (he will - so he can yell political witch hunt)?

Legally speaking, the documents case seems to be the most straightforward.

[Goatnapper'96]

Curious in what way you don't see it "working." The public won't buy it? The judge won't buy it? The jury wouldn't convict? Are you suggesting Trump will argue selective enforcement (he will - so he can yell political witch hunt)?

Legally speaking, the documents case seems to be the most straightforward.

Speaking of the public. I don't think most folks will move beyond the taking of documents issue and will conclude that it happens to every President or VP and anything after that is just a political witch-hunt.

I think his actions in the GA case are the easiest to clearly make a case to people about.

[frank ryan]

If Trump were any other politician, these cases would not be brought forward. It's the double standard that is plain as day. And everybody knows it. It's a political strategy.

I'm going to shock you, but I don't think you can holler double standard when Trump's behaviors are unprecedented it doesn't work.
The guy tried to overthrow our democracy. It wasn't just grumpy maga slugs causing a kerfluffle, it was a real threat to our republic. He has caused his own controversies. If a double standard is in play, it is the fact that Trump has had so many scandals (which aren't the result of witchhunts) that he is almost immune.
He came into office and on the first day, his camp floated the invented idea that Trump's inauguration was the best attended one ever. It wasn't but Trump immediately cried evil media. He has done this so much that his acolytes ignore reality.

[Goatnapper'96]

I'm going to shock you, but I don't think you can holler double standard when Trump's behaviors are unprecedented it doesn't work.
The guy tried to overthrow our democracy. It wasn't just grumpy maga slugs causing a kerfluffle, it was a real threat to our republic. He has caused his own controversies. If a double standard is in play, it is the fact that Trump has had so many scandals (which aren't the result of witchhunts) that he is almost immune.
He came into office and on the first day, his camp floated the invented idea that Trump's inauguration was the best attended one ever. It wasn't but Trump immediately cried evil media. He has done this so much that his acolytes ignore reality.

Nailing some hoe and then paying her off to stay quiet about it isn't unprecedented. Stop being silly.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Nailing some hoe and then paying her off to stay quiet about it isn't unprecedented. Stop being silly.

Sigh...How far our expectations have fallen.

[falafel]

Speaking of the public. I don't think most folks will move beyond the taking of documents issue and will conclude that it happens to every President or VP and anything after that is just a political witch-hunt.

I think his actions in the GA case are the easiest to clearly make a case to people about.

Thanks. I actually think the public would go the opposite way. Most people understand that Top Secret means you shouldn't be keeping them at your "club" where anyone could stumble on to them. But I can see the waters turning muddy when people try to compare Biden's confidential doc issues and whoever the other person (Al Gore?) that came forward recently is.

[YOhio]

I think it's about time we all admit that nobody really cares about politicians mishandling classified information except when it's someone you weren't going to vote for anyways. Republicans will freak out when Sandy Berger is sneaking classified docs out of the National Archives in his socks, Hillary sending classified info on her private server, and Biden storing classified info in his garage. But Trump sharing real time military strategy with Xi Jinping over chocolate cake and storing classified docs at Mar a Lago is a witch hunt. Same thing with Democrats. The kabuki theater is exhausting.

[Maximus]

would they care if they realized agents and assets starting dying right around the time he went back to mar largo with all these classified docs on purpose?

[Goatnapper'96]

Sigh...How far our expectations have fallen.

Sadly, I have found Trump to be far more of a symptom of our problems than the cause.

[Applejack]

I can't see that one working when every President and VP seems to inadvertently take Top Secret documents with them.

I agree with goat on the FL case.

1. publicly it will not play well. "Everyone does it, even Joltin Joe!"
2. It does kind of seem like inconsequential stuff when compared with J6 and election interference.
3. The judge in florida is not smart.
4. Trump is much more likely to get a sympathetic jury in florida than in ny or dc.
5. With the speed of the FL judge, the case will be tried some time in 2035.

[Applejack]

The GA or DC cases are the most damning, methinks.