Should they stay or should they go: Brexit 2016

[Northwestcoug]

I understand the downsides of remaining with the EU. I think there's a bureaucratic mess that most people object to, especially when a EU directive intervenes in local issues. But do these downsides outweigh the benefits of remaining a member of the EU? And, are the problems with the EU rooted in anything else besides nationalism?

I don't have much skin in the game, unless the market doesn't rebound soon . But I'm not looking forward to another round of Quebec and Scotland threatening to secede.

[Dwight Schr-ute]

Should they stay or should they go: Brexit 2016

'71, it seems like a good time to buy some sterling (and maybe take a trip to the UK)... looks like the GBP lost about 10% on the dollar. UBS thinks that it will fall below 1.30. What are you hearing?

It doesn't pull in the most traffic, but it's nice to see UB5 getting some international cred.

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I liked my ESPN joke better.

Harry Reid has always loved the poor and uneducated. He has historically relied upon busloads of union "voters" who are driven to the booths with sheets telling them exactly how to vote. Afterwards interviews with these voters often reveals they have no idea for whom they voted. This is how the Dems love the poor and uneducated.

This is also a rhetorical device. If you disagree with somebody and you consider yourself bright and intelligent, the other side must be dumb. The Dems have traditionally characterized anybody disagreeing with them as dumb and uneducated. It is an age old trick which is used over and over again.

LOL.



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[Jeff Lebowski]

I liked my ESPN joke better.

That was pretty good.

[Color Me Badd Fan]

Uh.. OK.

I have simply stated that this movement seems to be fueled by the same demographics fueling the Trump phenomenon. Help me understand how the stats/demographics I have presented are wrong. Furthermore, what is it that all of the economists are missing?

I'm sure the city of San Francisco has a higher proportion of college graduates than Utah. Perhaps you wouldn't mind brining in the San Francisco city counsel to run Utah's affairs since they've had so many great ideas over the years.

Also, if the UK is anything like Germany, a far smaller percentage of the population are going to college than what happens here in the states.

What's really happening in the UK are the people in the middle voted for this, while the people that don't care about the economy or immune to current realities (i.e. the super-educated and the welfare recipients) voted against it.

[Color Me Badd Fan]

I understand the downsides of remaining with the EU. I think there's a bureaucratic mess that most people object to, especially when a EU directive intervenes in local issues. But do these downsides outweigh the benefits of remaining a member of the EU? And, are the problems with the EU rooted in anything else besides nationalism?

I don't have much skin in the game, unless the market doesn't rebound soon . But I'm not looking forward to another round of Quebec and Scotland threatening to secede.

Has anyone in this thread mentioned what the benefits of the EU aside from the trade deals?

Btw, the UK wasn't part of the agreement where they were obligated to take in refugees entering the EU. So try again, JL.

[Omaha 680]

So the UK already opts out of (with certain exceptions) the Europe common travel/visa zone, and there are non-EU member states that participate in both the common travel zone and the single market. So why couldn't the UK be admitted to the single market like Norway, Switzerland, and Iceland, and retain the status quo with respect to passport and border control? I guess the answer would be they could be forced out of both by the EU either out of spite or to make an example to keep other EU members in line. But it seems such a move would harm the EU as much or more than the UK. The vote seems to me to be desire to take back any of the sovereignty ceded to the European central government, but is it really a desire to leave the single market?

The dreams of a political European superstate might be dead now, but was that ever really a good idea? Will I ever stop posting by just asking a bunch of questions?

[Jeff Lebowski]

I'm sure the city of San Francisco has a higher proportion of college graduates than Utah. Perhaps you wouldn't mind brining in the San Francisco city counsel to run Utah's affairs since they've had so many great ideas over the years.

lol. One of your worst analogies yet.

Also, if the UK is anything like Germany, a far smaller percentage of the population are going to college than what happens here in the states.

What's really happening in the UK are the people in the middle voted for this, while the people that don't care about the economy or immune to current realities (i.e. the super-educated and the welfare recipients) voted against it.

So the less educated working class folks are the ones with the real understanding of how the economy works? And those rich folks and capitalists with their fancy Oxford degrees who rely on the economy to make and maintain their wealth don't care enough to even study it or understand it? That makes perfect sense.

[Northwestcoug]

Has anyone in this thread mentioned what the benefits of the EU aside from the trade deals?

Btw, the UK wasn't part of the agreement where they were obligated to take in refugees entering the EU. So try again, JL.

I'm out of my league in foreign economic theory, but trade agreements have to be a huge plus staying in the EU. Also anything that helped travel between countries seems like a big deal also.

But again, other than sovereignty and nationalistic arguments, what does the UK gain by leaving the EU? And is it worth it?

[Goatnapper'96]

I'm out of my league in foreign economic theory, but trade agreements have to be a huge plus staying in the EU. Also anything that helped travel between countries seems like a big deal also.

But again, other than sovereignty and nationalistic arguments, what does the UK gain by leaving the EU? And is it worth it?

They gain control over immigration in their country. Is it worth depends, IMO, how the trade agreements work out. The reality is EU needs GB trade more than GB needs EU trade. I think the economic agreements will be remarkably similar to what is in place right now, or at least what was in place this time yesterday.

[Goatnapper'96]

I'm out of my league in foreign economic theory, but trade agreements have to be a huge plus staying in the EU. Also anything that helped travel between countries seems like a big deal also.

But again, other than sovereignty and nationalistic arguments, what does the UK gain by leaving the EU? And is it worth it?

They gain control over immigration in their country. Is it worth depends, IMO, how the trade agreements work out. The reality is EU needs GB trade more than GB needs EU trade. I think the economic agreements will be remarkably similar to what is in place right now, or at least what was in place this time yesterday.

[Northwestcoug]

They gain control over immigration in their country. Is it worth depends, IMO, how the trade agreements work out. The reality is EU needs GB trade more than GB needs EU trade. I think the economic agreements will be remarkably similar to what is in place right now, or at least what was in place this time yesterday.

I'm probably going to get slammed for wading into an economic argument that I don't fully understand, but I read that the UK has a huge trade deficit with the EU. If that's the case, then it seems like it would be easier to work to alleviate that deficit by staying in the EU, since theoretically it has less trade barriers. But I'm not sure if that argument holds.

I do think the immigration argument is worth having, but I'm not sure how much of it is based on sound economic and policy data versus base nationalism.

[Bo Diddley]

^There's a glitch in the Matrix.

We visited the UK last month. The pound was depressed a bit due to the impending referendum. We've decided to head back there next year about the same time. I don't think I'll speculate on the pound at all, and just take it as is comes. I expect volatility over the next year.

[Commando]

FWIW, when I visited Scotland a couple years ago, I visited with a family of working class Scots (had a family construction business.. I think that qualifies. ) in a pub who were some of the most blatantly and boisterously bigoted group of people I'd ever talked to- the dad was slightly 'pissed' and ranting about Muslim immigrants and exhorted America (me) to keep out the immigrants. I told him I was an immigration lawyer and the dad somewhat mellowed out upon urging by his sons, but it was uncomfortable. Total Trump supporters probably.

[Omaha 680]

I'm probably going to get slammed for wading into an economic argument that I don't fully understand, but I read that the UK has a huge trade deficit with the EU. If that's the case, then it seems like it would be easier to work to alleviate that deficit by staying in the EU, since theoretically it has less trade barriers. But I'm not sure if that argument holds.

I do think the immigration argument is worth having, but I'm not sure how much of it is based on sound economic and policy data versus base nationalism.

That trade deficit is why the EU would be crazy to bar the UK from the single market. Why would they want to cut out one of their biggest consumers?

[Omaha 680]

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