Where have you gone Milton Friedman?

[byu71]

I never said they did. I do believe, though, that most people deserve to not live in poverty.

I haven't done any detail analysis, but I think you would find on a percentage basis more people live in poverty in the other systems. The least in the capitalistic system.

Please don't pick out Saudi Arabia as an example to disprove what I am saying and I won't pick out a couple of countries like Cuba and North Vietnam to prove the reverse.

[Solon]

Free Enterprise is NOT the root cause of the current turmoil. Its government intervention which skewed the markets. If true capitalism were able to flourish without government mandates (uh umm Community Reinvestment Act). We would not be in this situation.

btw... Uncle Milty did not have anything to do with executing thousands of citizens in Argentina.

Chile, dude. Friedman and his buddies messed up Chile.

I generally believe in free-market and capitalism, but I don't really believe in Milt as much as everyone else seems to. He gets too much credit when it seems that nobody really has a handle on the awesome forces that are economics.

Except pelagius, of course.

[Mormon Red Death]

Chile, dude. Friedman and his buddies messed up Chile.

I generally believe in free-market and capitalism, but I don't really believe in Milt as much as everyone else seems to. He gets too much credit when it seems that nobody really has a handle on the awesome forces that are economics.

Except pelagius, of course.

say what you want about economic policies but he certainly didnt have any impact on Pinochet's killings.

BTW this a side note. Everytime I see Uncle Milty he looks like the actor that played Hyman Roth in the Godfather II.

[I.J. Reilly]

I really developed after my first couple of years a code that my first responsibility to my clients is to "protect them against the folks in the financial system back east." Sure, they say they have the clients interest at heart, but the human condition takes over and the higher they climb the more it is about them making money and having power. I read a book early in my career called "liars poker". It should be a must read for every person who wants to be an investment advisor.

I think you're on to something here. I too have read Liars Poker and I appreciated the view it presented. Michael Lewis is one of the few business writers that is actually is qualified to write about business. His article in Portfolio about the collapse was one of the best pieces about the whole mess http://www.portfolio.com/news-market...l-Streets-Boom is, in my opinion, the best on the subject.

The wrong part of the system is that many of these guys get paid whether things are bad or good. Their incentive is to increase volume and they use very questionable tactics to do so. Perhaps making them take some sort of equity stake in their clients positions would force restraint. Probably not very plausible or fraught with too many dificulties (what do you do when a client wants to buy a stock you don't want?) but that was a thought off the top of my head.

Jubak* presented an interesting idea in his column today http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com...ll-street.aspx that I think really makes sense. Decentralizing the markets would address a lot of problems that are inherent in a system where most of the power and resources are concentrated.



*I don't necessarily endorse Jubak, btw. I see him as a pop prognosticator of the markets along the lines of Jim Cramer, though not nearly as bad.

[KillerDog]

I never said they did. I do believe, though, that most people deserve to not live in poverty.

On the contrary, I think about 20% of people deserve to live in poverty.

[byu71]

I think you're on to something here. I too have read Liars Poker and I appreciated the view it presented. Michael Lewis is one of the few business writers that is actually is qualified to write about business. His article in Portfolio about the collapse was one of the best pieces about the whole mess http://www.portfolio.com/news-market...l-Streets-Boom is, in my opinion, the best on the subject.

The wrong part of the system is that many of these guys get paid whether things are bad or good. Their incentive is to increase volume and they use very questionable tactics to do so. Perhaps making them take some sort of equity stake in their clients positions would force restraint. Probably not very plausible or fraught with too many dificulties (what do you do when a client wants to buy a stock you don't want?) but that was a thought off the top of my head.

Jubak* presented an interesting idea in his column today http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com...ll-street.aspx that I think really makes sense. Decentralizing the markets would address a lot of problems that are inherent in a system where most of the power and resources are concentrated.



*I don't necessarily endorse Jubak, btw. I see him as a pop prognosticator of the markets along the lines of Jim Cramer, though not nearly as bad.

Between working and posting I don't have time to read the article, but I will. The decentralization thing I think would be healthy. I have always wondered why regulators go along with a lot of these derivitive schemes. As I have said numerous times, my first encounter was with Milliken (sp) and junk bonds. I could go on and on. Each time one of these schemes comes along the theme espoused is, it creates liquidity and helps the market to fundction. B.S. What it does it creates more and more transactions. It is like more games to play at the Casino and therefor the Casino makes more. The big money centers love it. New York makes a killing of off the exchanges and so does Chicago.

I hear those who defend naked shorting as it "gives the public the knowledge that these companies are bad". To follow that scenario you would have to believe the short sellers are always the smart folks. How do you sell something you don't own? Just seems crazy.

The saddest thing about this collapse for me is a lot of the idiots that made the bad bets still pulled millions out of the system. Maybe not as much as they once had, but they pulled out plenty.

[byu71]

Between working and posting I don't have time to read the article, but I will. The decentralization thing I think would be healthy. I have always wondered why regulators go along with a lot of these derivitive schemes. As I have said numerous times, my first encounter was with Milliken (sp) and junk bonds. I could go on and on. Each time one of these schemes comes along the theme espoused is, it creates liquidity and helps the market to fundction. B.S. What it does it creates more and more transactions. It is like more games to play at the Casino and therefor the Casino makes more. The big money centers love it. New York makes a killing of off the exchanges and so does Chicago.

I hear those who defend naked shorting as it "gives the public the knowledge that these companies are bad". To follow that scenario you would have to believe the short sellers are always the smart folks. How do you sell something you don't own? Just seems crazy.

The saddest thing about this collapse for me is a lot of the idiots that made the bad bets still pulled millions out of the system. Maybe not as much as they once had, but they pulled out plenty.

Would someone point out to SU I am making some serious posts. Also let him know I prefer he not comment. People who are clueless in this area add nothing to the discussion.

[I.J. Reilly]

But that's SU's schtick! Take that away and there is but a fixated former member left. You wouldn't want to do that to SU would you?

[byu71]

But that's SU's schtick! Take that away and there is but a fixated former member left. You wouldn't want to do that to SU would you?

No, everyone knows I love the guy. Back in the old days on CB, I think I was the only one who would schtick up for him.

[I.J. Reilly]

And in SU's defense the first thing that popped into my mind when I saw "Where have you gone Milton..." was wondering why a post about John Milton was in the Water Cooler.

[wuapinmon]

say what you want about economic policies but he certainly didnt have any impact on Pinochet's killings.

BTW this a side note. Everytime I see Uncle Milty he looks like the actor that played Hyman Roth in the Godfather II.

Friedman got to get his hands on a country's economy wherein a brutal pig of a dictator gave him free reign. It was an economist's dream......he could put all his Chicago Boys principles into action without worrying about public or government opinion. I'm sure the democratically-elected socialists politicians that were imprisoned and/or executed in the 1970's in Chile didn't suffer because of their opposition to Friedman's policies.

He lay down with dogs. He has fleas.

FEBRUARY 19, 1975
Four MIR leaders, who had been arrested by the DINA, appear on national television to declare the political and military defeat of the MIR and to call on their party to renounce armed struggle.

MARCH 25, 1975
Milton Friedman, founder of the Chicago School of Economics, visits Chile. His stay roughly coincides with changes to the Junta's economic policy, influenced by a group of monetarists dubbed "the Chicago boys" after Friedman's thought.

JULY 23, 1975
A list of 119 disappeared Chileans are reported dead in the foreign media. The Chilean media reproduce two lists of disappeared people, originally published in Argentina and Brazil. The first list of 60 people, appears in an obscure Argentine magazine "LEA" on July 15. A second list of 59 Chileans, also disappeared, is taken from Brazil's "O Dia" on July 17, the only issue of that magazine ever published. The deceased Chileans are reported to be MIR members, victims of infighting among factions. The Chilean media conclude that these press reports confirm the Junta's argument that the disappeared are extremists who have gone underground or moved abroad, is in fact true. However, subsequent investigations and eyewitness accounts prove the entire incident to be a fabrication called "Operation Colombo" carried out by the Chilean military regime in collaboration with intelligence forces from other countries. The 119 remain disappeared.

JULY 31, 1975
Ninety-five political prisoners go on a hunger strike to denounce the falsehood of the list of 119 disappeared. The striking prisoners, from the Melinka concentration camp in Puchuncavi, claim to know of at least 33 individuals from the list of 119 that were confined and tortured alongside them in different detention centers run by the DINA secret police.


SEPTEMBER 1, 1975
The Comando Conjunto anti-Communist squad is formed, joining officers from the Air Force intelligence service SIFA, the Navy and Carabineros as well as former members of the civilian paramilitary group Patria y Libertad. The commando is led by SIFA chief Colonel Edgardo Ceballos Jones and has as its principal objective the elimination of the Communist Party (PC). From the Comando Conjunto's creation until the end of 1976, two successive central committees of the PC and numerous members of the Communist Youth, are arrested and made to disappear. The Rettig report holds the Comando Conjunto responsible for at least 30 of these disappearances while other sources cite figures as high as 70.

NOVEMBER 27, 1975
The Comite para la Paz is dissolved due to pressure from the regime. In a letter to Cardinal Raul Silva Henriquez requesting the organization's closure, General Augusto Pinochet says the regime considers the Comite to be a "medium used by Marxist-Leninists to create problems that disrupt the peace of the citizenry...."

DECEMBER 1975
The ruling Junta broadens powers to suspend publications or other media for up to six days if they are found to be "distorting the facts or creating public alarm." The Journalists' Guild and other media organizations protest these new powers.

http://www.rrojasdatabank.org/econom~1.htm
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...p_3nY&refer=us

[Mormon Red Death]

Friedman got to get his hands on a country's economy wherein a brutal pig of a dictator gave him free reign. It was an economist's dream......he could put all his Chicago Boys principles into action without worrying about public or government opinion. I'm sure the democratically-elected socialists politicians that were imprisoned and/or executed in the 1970's in Chile didn't suffer because of their opposition to Friedman's policies.

He lay down with dogs. He has fleas.




http://www.rrojasdatabank.org/econom~1.htm
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...p_3nY&refer=us

Making Policy and ordering 119 people to jump out of an airplane without a parachute is completely different.