States and Unions

[Tex]

So the public unions that endorsed the gov. like the state troopers won't lose their cb rights. This looks like a power grab to me.

Speaking of graft, why are you anti-union folks ignoring the fact that the law would exempt the public unions that endorsed the governor? That seems mighty shady to me.

The state troopers, cops and firefighter endorsed Walker and they won't lose their cb rights under the bill. The prison guards didn't and they will.

Golly Frank, that sounds like a kind of pay to play operation. IIRC there was a thread here just this week which called it payola!

Oops, there went that theory.

[frank ryan]

Oops, there went that theory.

Not exactly

[LA Ute]

Walker apparently ran on this, and always said that police and firefighters should be protected. I don't know why prison guards don't get the same category in his budget. I am sure there is some malevolent reason, however.

Nice summary of the matter here:

"There was a referendum on this issue and the unions lost."

[Eddie]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/howard..._b_824886.html

I have to admit that I didn't read all of the links, but I read this one - since it was written by a law professor and all and is credible.

To be honest - I got a chuckle out of it.

Why?

Because it reminded me of Obama winning the presidential election and telling everyone it was a "mandate" that people wanted him to do certain things. Wasn't he quoted as saying something like "I won, you lost, deal with it"? I know that isn't a direct quote, but it seems like I recall hearing something along those lines when republicans tried to negotiate certain things with him.

So now someone from the other side wins and election and becomes governor, accompanied by his party taking control of the state legislature - and when he tells everyone the election gave him a mandate to change things this law professor basically says he is delusional.

Could you link the article he wrote after Obama's election so I can see that he is at least consistent? I mean, his interpretation was that people were fed up with the status quo, which led to the change in power. It seems to me that this is kind of the same thing that happened when Obama and the democrats took over the federal governement, isn't it?


To be fair, I'll state my political leanings. I am somewhat conservative and see myself as a moderate republican - from Utah's standards. I have yet to vote a straight party ticket in any election, if that helps show who I am. And I find the extremes on both ends of the political spectrum to really be the same morons who are so obsessed with simply having control that neither is interested in doing what is right for the country as much as they are interested in tearing down what the other side does. Bunch of lobsters in the pot while the water keeps getting hotter making sure that NO ONE gets out before the water boils...

[Tex]

Not exactly

Um, the very guy who's supposed to be the recipient of this "pay to play" "shady" "power grab" both regrets his endorsement and regrets the perceived benefits. If that isn't a total repudiation of your allegation, it at least weakens it a good bit.

And for BD this afternoon: here's a colleague of Ezra Klein's disputing some of his claims. And here's E. J. Dionne--sounding very down-in-the-mouth, by the way--acknowledging that the Tea Party is winning.

[Borderline Divine]

Um, the very guy who's supposed to be the recipient of this "pay to play" "shady" "power grab" both regrets his endorsement and regrets the perceived benefits. If that isn't a total repudiation of your allegation, it at least weakens it a good bit.

And for BD this afternoon: here's a colleague of Ezra Klein's disputing some of his claims. And here's E. J. Dionne--sounding very down-in-the-mouth, by the way--acknowledging that the Tea Party is winning.

I read Dionne as saying that the Tea Party has won to the extent that they have been able to frame the current debate and dialogue. They have yet to govern, and thats harder than talking or shouting slogans, as both parties have come to learn over the years.

The jury on their ability to govern is very much still out. Sadly, we've seen that the other two parties can't govern either.

[byu71]

Like Eddie, I consider myself a moderate Republican. I am frustrated by outlandish statements by both sides. I can actually say positive things about President Obama and just shake my head at those who attack him on everything.

On the other side, this morning I heard someone defending the Unions in Wisconsin. Her claim was this is about destroying Unions. Those who are trying this want to destroy the middle class and hate teachers. What crap and so sad if people believe that.

There are tons of middle class folks who are not fans of Unions. I am not a fan of a lot of the things they do. I absolutely do not hate teachers. I may have problems with their Unions and I know some teachers who feel the same.

To say someone who is against Unions hates teachers is like saying someone who dislikes the LDS church hates mormons. You don't hate mormons do you SU.

[byu71]

CNN is reporting that the Wisconsin protestors are now getting support from the entertainment community.

This reminds me of the great inequality the capitalist system creates. Entertainers making millions and millions and millions vs school teachers. Is Katie Couric worth 14million a year. Are Rush, Hannity, Beck et. al. worth what they make? WEll that is the free market system.

Since show biz folks seem to in general dislike the system, let's help them out.

I propose a 30% surcharge tax on any entertainer's income over 1 million per yer. That sounds reasonable doesn't it.

[Eddie]

CNN is reporting that the Wisconsin protestors are now getting support from the entertainment community.

This reminds me of the great inequality the capitalist system creates. Entertainers making millions and millions and millions vs school teachers. Is Katie Couric worth 14million a year. Are Rush, Hannity, Beck et. al. worth what they make? WEll that is the free market system.

Since show biz folks seem to in general dislike the system, let's help them out.

I propose a 30% surcharge tax on any entertainer's income over 1 million per yer. That sounds reasonable doesn't it.

I think your idea sounds silly.

I think it would be much more appropriate for the two (teachers and entertainers) to join together in a union and bargain collectively to each earn the same amount.

I mean, when you think about it they really are doing the same thing. Except teachers are entertaining a smaller group.

[byu71]

I think your idea sounds silly.

I think it would be much more appropriate for the two (teachers and entertainers) to join together in a union and bargain collectively to each earn the same amount.

I mean, when you think about it they really are doing the same thing. Except teachers are entertaining a smaller group.

I wouldn't mind your idea except it is going to make the union bosses richer and more powerful. Besides, they will negotiate all entertainers get what the highest entertainer gets, which includes the teachers, and then ask the taxpayers to pay for it.

[Tex]

Not exactly

Here's a little further debunking of this nonsense allegation, via NewsBusters.

Governor Walker claims only 4 of 314 fire and police unions in the state endorsed him. Politfact notes that the endorsements came from local Milwaukee unions, whereas the much larger statewide unions endorsed the Democrat.

And then this from Indiana: apparently Indiana Dems have fled their state to stop the Republicans from passing legislation. Rumor is Ohio Democrats are considering this tactic too.

Does anyone really think this portrays the Democrat party in a flattering light? That the American people writ large are going to be persuaded by electoral losers who flee the fight, and subsequently reward them with their future votes?

That this is becoming the Democrat party M.O. is fascinating, and hilarious.

[byu71]

Here's a little further debunking of this nonsense allegation, via NewsBusters.

Governor Walker claims only 4 of 314 fire and police unions in the state endorsed him. Politfact notes that the endorsements came from local Milwaukee unions, whereas the much larger statewide unions endorsed the Democrat.

And then this from Indiana: apparently Indiana Dems have fled their state to stop the Republicans from passing legislation. Rumor is Ohio Democrats are considering this tactic too.

Does anyone really think this portrays the Democrat party in a flattering light? That the American people writ large are going to be persuaded by electoral losers who flee the fight, and subsequently reward them with their future votes?

That this is becoming the Democrat party M.O. is fascinating, and hilarious.

Well, I heard a very compelling argument from a Dem. strategist concerning these folks leaving the State.

He said, well republicans filabuster, what is the difference.

[Tex]

Well, I heard a very compelling argument from a Dem. strategist concerning these folks leaving the State.

He said, well republicans filabuster, what is the difference.

I suppose none, if you believe fleeing the state to be just another standard parliamentary tactic. Is that what we want to see our state legislatures become? Anytime there's a severe disagreement, one side or the other leaves the state?

I don't think the American people generally agree with that, but that's just my opinion. People tend to elect representatives for a reason, and it's not to thwart representative democracy by hiding in hotels outside the state they represent.

[Indy Coug]

Have we been commanded not to call a prophet an insular racist? Link?

- Cali Coug

I love how you still have that as your signature.

[Borderline Divine]

Republicans already disagree with the Democrat's position, and vice-versa. Positions are set in stone on both sides. So the only hearts and minds anybody is playing for now are those pesky independents, and I've never been able to figure out what the hell they want.

I think they just want everybody to get along. They remind me of the family member or co-worker who will never take a side for fear of offending someone.

Looks mostly like grandstanding right now on the part of the Democrats. They're beat, but they must fight the good fight to satisfy their supporters.