Reflecting on Bennett's Likely Demise

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  • VirginiaCougar
    Junior Member
    • Dec 2009
    • 331

    #1

    Reflecting on Bennett's Likely Demise

    There was an exceptional editorial from a very good historian in the NY Times recently.

    Political historian Gordon Wood offers a very good editorial in the NYTimes where he warned against having too many inexperienced politicians(throw all the bums out). He notes that just about all the founders were seasoned politicians with years of experience. He warns of the dangers of too many inexperienced elected officials.

    Our history is more complex than the image often portrayed of farmers setting down hoes to spend two years in the legislature and then returning. Politics is a science and the worst pieces of legislation (often within state legislature with a high number of new members) that cause the greatest damage tends to come from the most inexperienced legislators. They also tend to be the most extreme.

    Centrist policies and politicians, the ones that have served our nation best, generally (not always, there are always exceptions) have taken time to season. In today's complex world, this seems important to remember. It doesn't guarantee that a long-term politician is a good one by any means, but it seems important to remember the lesson that even the founder's discovered important.

    The article: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/03/op...ounders&st=cse


    Excerpts:

    1)Actually, our founders were not all that new at it: the men who led the revolution against the British crown and created our political institutions were very used to governing themselves. George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Samuel Adams and John Adams were all members of their respective Colonial legislatures several years before the Declaration of Independence. In fact, these Revolutionaries drew upon a tradition of self-government that went back a century or more. Virginians ran their county courts and elected representatives to their House of Burgesses. The people of Massachusetts gathered in town meetings and selected members of the General Court, their Colonial legislature.

    2) If one wanted to explain why the French Revolution spiraled out of control into violence and dictatorship and the American Revolution did not, there is no better answer than the fact that the Americans were used to governing themselves and the French were not.

    3) In the decade after the Declaration of Independence, however, many American leaders had second thoughts about what they had done (strong term limits) amid the popular enthusiasm of 1776. Since many of the state legislatures were turning over roughly 50 percent of their membership annually and passing a flood of ill-drafted and unjust legislation, stability and experience seemed to be what was most needed.

    As a consequence, many leaders in the 1780s proposed major changes to their constitutional structures, including the abolition of term limits . . . The new federal Constitution, itself a reaction to the excessive populism of 1776, also did away with any semblance of term limits, much to the chagrin of Thomas Jefferson and many others uneasy over the extraordinary power of the presidency.
    Last edited by VirginiaCougar; 05-04-2010, 05:18 PM.
    Tell Graham to see. And tell Merrill to swing away.
  • CardiacCoug
    вот так штука
    • Nov 2008
    • 11013

    #2
    That's a good article.

    Amazing that Bennett will lose the nomination for not being right-wing enough -- seems like anyone more right-wing than Bennett will get nothing done whatsoever.

    I like guys like Ron Paul, but do they actually accomplish anything?

    Comment

    • SeattleUte
      Faith crisis consultant
      • Nov 2008
      • 20837

      #3
      Electing Rex Lee's son, former Supreme Court clerk, etc. is a no brainer for Utah. An idiot test really.
      When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.

      --Jonathan Swift

      Comment

      • CardiacCoug
        вот так штука
        • Nov 2008
        • 11013

        #4
        Originally posted by SeattleUte View Post
        Electing Rex Lee's son, former Supreme Court clerk, etc. is a no brainer for Utah. An idiot test really.
        What do you like about Mike Lee besides his father and the fact that he worked for Justice Alito?

        Comment

        • All-American
          Right, as Usual
          • Nov 2008
          • 15646

          #5
          Originally posted by SeattleUte View Post
          Electing Rex Lee's son, former Supreme Court clerk, etc. is a no brainer for Utah. An idiot test really.
          With all due respect for Rex Lee and the Law School from which he graduated, I'd argue that in this country, you need qualifications somewhat more extensive than a good pedigree.
          τὸν ἥλιον ἀνατέλλοντα πλείονες ἢ δυόμενον προσκυνοῦσιν

          Comment

          • pellegrino
            miserere me
            • Jan 2009
            • 12100

            #6
            Originally posted by SeattleUte View Post
            Electing Rex Lee's son, former Supreme Court clerk, etc. is a no brainer for Utah. An idiot test really.
            then it looks like they're about to pass it with flying colors. Utahns are idiots.
            Dio perdona tante cose per un’opera di misericordia
            God forgives many things for an act of mercy
            Alessandro Manzoni

            Knock it off. This board has enough problems without a dose of middle-age lechery.

            pelagius

            Comment

            • Jeff Lebowski
              Corporate lackey for Jesus
              • Nov 2008
              • 69561

              #7
              Originally posted by pellegrino View Post
              then it looks like they're about to pass it with flying colors. Utahns are idiots.
              Exactly. This will be painful to witness.
              "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
              "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
              "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

              Comment

              • byu71
                Senior Member
                • Nov 2008
                • 22070

                #8
                Originally posted by pellegrino View Post
                Utahns are idiots.
                Sticks and stones. I have been called worse.

                Comment

                • SeattleUte
                  Faith crisis consultant
                  • Nov 2008
                  • 20837

                  #9
                  Originally posted by CardiacCoug View Post
                  What do you like about Mike Lee besides his father and the fact that he worked for Justice Alito?
                  I don't know anything else about him (BTW, I'm sure he had good grades at BYU, but likely the main reason he clerked for Alito was his father).
                  When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.

                  --Jonathan Swift

                  Comment

                  • SeattleUte
                    Faith crisis consultant
                    • Nov 2008
                    • 20837

                    #10
                    Originally posted by All-American View Post
                    With all due respect for Rex Lee and the Law School from which he graduated, I'd argue that in this country, you need qualifications somewhat more extensive than a good pedigree.
                    He is only the product of his father?
                    When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.

                    --Jonathan Swift

                    Comment

                    • pellegrino
                      miserere me
                      • Jan 2009
                      • 12100

                      #11
                      Originally posted by byu71 View Post
                      Sticks and stones. I have been called worse.
                      I thought after posting it that I should have clarified. They're idiots if they vote for Lee over Bennett.

                      Even then I guess it isn't fair because it's the wacko delegates that are waging this war against common sense, not the average Utahn. I'd venture to say that in a full election Bennett could beat Lee.
                      Dio perdona tante cose per un’opera di misericordia
                      God forgives many things for an act of mercy
                      Alessandro Manzoni

                      Knock it off. This board has enough problems without a dose of middle-age lechery.

                      pelagius

                      Comment

                      • SeattleUte
                        Faith crisis consultant
                        • Nov 2008
                        • 20837

                        #12
                        Interesting. He clerked for Alito on the Supreme Court nine years after graduating from law school. Unheard of. Also, clerkship with Dee Benson of the District of Utah isn't exactly an established path to Supreme Court clerkship. See, there is an aristocracy in our country. (Alito worked for his father at the SG's office.)
                        When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.

                        --Jonathan Swift

                        Comment

                        • byu71
                          Senior Member
                          • Nov 2008
                          • 22070

                          #13
                          Originally posted by pellegrino View Post
                          I thought after posting it that I should have clarified. They're idiots if they vote for Lee over Bennett.

                          Even then I guess it isn't fair because it's the wacko delegates that are waging this war against common sense, not the average Utahn. I'd venture to say that in a full election Bennett could beat Lee.
                          So far I see the arguments to vote for Bennett would be the same argument to vote for Boxer if I were a Californian. Show me where Bennett wasn't part of the free spending Washington folks during the Bush years.

                          I haven't made up my mind yet, nor will my opinion matter, but if I were a delegate, I would lean Lee just because I don't like the things the way they are and I think Bennett is part of that crowd. Go ahead, call me an idiot, I can take it.

                          Comment

                          • pellegrino
                            miserere me
                            • Jan 2009
                            • 12100

                            #14
                            Originally posted by byu71 View Post
                            So far I see the arguments to vote for Bennett would be the same argument to vote for Boxer if I were a Californian. Show me where Bennett wasn't part of the free spending Washington folks during the Bush years.

                            I haven't made up my mind yet, nor will my opinion matter, but if I were a delegate, I would lean Lee just because I don't like the things the way they are and I think Bennett is part of that crowd. Go ahead, call me an idiot, I can take it.
                            This only matters if you're a delegate. If you aren't you won't even have the chance to vote against him.
                            Dio perdona tante cose per un’opera di misericordia
                            God forgives many things for an act of mercy
                            Alessandro Manzoni

                            Knock it off. This board has enough problems without a dose of middle-age lechery.

                            pelagius

                            Comment

                            • byu71
                              Senior Member
                              • Nov 2008
                              • 22070

                              #15
                              Originally posted by pellegrino View Post
                              This only matters if you're a delegate. If you aren't you won't even have the chance to vote against him.
                              That is why I said my opinion won't matter, unless of course delegates call me for my opinion.

                              Comment

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