Let's talk about AZ Senate Bill 1070...

[Commando]

This thing is an abortion. Period.




Really Arizona? State troopers are going to be enforcing and adjudicating immigration issues? What a windfall for defense attorneys! You thought your local law enforcement agency was bumbling? Arizona is about to dwarf it with the clusterf*** of the century! Not to mention the HUGE economic impact AZ is going to take in the midst of a recession! States usurping Congressional power does not bode well.

[LiveCoug]

My dad is super excited about this, so it must be a good thing.

[Commando]

Oh I get the feeling a lot of dads around the country are stoked. I don't have much experience with any dads ever getting too stoked about standing up for due process, though.

[SoonerCoug]

This thing is an abortion. Period.




Really Arizona? State troopers are going to be enforcing and adjudicating immigration issues? What a windfall for defense attorneys! You thought your local law enforcement agency was bumbling? Arizona is about to dwarf it with the clusterf*** of the century! Not to mention the HUGE economic impact AZ is going to take in the midst of a recession! States usurping Congressional power does not bode well.

I think the desired effect is to motivate illegal immigrants to move to other states, and I think it's going to work. The best-case scenario would be if they move up to Utah. I want to see the Utah legislature clash with the Church on this issue.

[RobinFinderson]

Just crazy. Citizens are now required to carry papers showing proof of citizenship. That is (Big Brother)^2.

[LiveCoug]

Just crazy. Citizens are now required to carry papers showing proof of citizenship. That is (Big Brother)^2.

How horrible!

[RobinFinderson]

How horrible!

Exactly. In AZ, you now have to be able to prove your citizenship, and can be stopped and questioned because of the color of your skin. Mind you, you can openly carry a gun, so freedom triumphs!

[frank ryan]

I think the desired effect is to motivate illegal immigrants to move to other states, and I think it's going to work. The best-case scenario would be if they move up to Utah. I want to see the Utah legislature clash with the Church on this issue.

And clash they would. Only the uninformed think the bretheren are anything but opposed to harsher immigration laws.

[Uncle Ted]

Exactly. In AZ, you now have to be able to prove your citizenship, and can be stopped and questioned because of the color of your skin.

Illegal immigrates come in all colors. In fact, I have seen Mexicans that have lighter skin than me and I'm not that tan. So, in short, police will be able to use this law to check anyone they want without cause.

Mind you, you can openly carry a gun, so freedom triumphs!

It's much better to carry concealed, my friend. People don't get nervous being around you and it preserves the element of surprise.

It is interesting that AZ also recently repealed the law that required a concealed handgun license. While I am all for concealed carry now it is harder for the AZ police to tell the good guys from the bad guys.

[beelzebabette]

And clash they would. Only the uninformed think the bretheren are anything but opposed to harsher immigration laws.

Is that a triple negative?

[LiveCoug]

Is that a triple negative?

Yeah, I'm still trying to figure out what he was trying to say....

[New Mexican Disaster]

This thing is an abortion. Period.




Really Arizona? State troopers are going to be enforcing and adjudicating immigration issues? What a windfall for defense attorneys! You thought your local law enforcement agency was bumbling? Arizona is about to dwarf it with the clusterf*** of the century! Not to mention the HUGE economic impact AZ is going to take in the midst of a recession! States usurping Congressional power does not bode well.

The economic impact is the undersold side of this thing. Arizona's economy for the last few decades has been based on in migration and construction. So now you have an overbuilt state that has just essentially told immigrants "if you come here you will be subject to police stops to ask for your papers". This will drive legal immigrants away from Arizona and worsen their economy and stretch out any housing recovery.

Just desserts.

[SoonerCoug]

Just crazy. Citizens are now required to carry papers showing proof of citizenship. That is (Big Brother)^2.

It's quite similar to my mission in Russia. We were frequently approached by police and asked to show our papers. We also had police come to our homes occasionally to inspect our apartment and check for bomb materials. (The latter was a response to the Chechen threat.)

It's not too uncommon for Mormon missionaries in Russia to be jailed when they don't carry a copy of their passports and visas. This happened several times while I was working in our mission office.

[Guest]

Exactly. In AZ, you now have to be able to prove your citizenship, and can be stopped and questioned because of the color of your skin. Mind you, you can openly carry a gun, so freedom triumphs!

It all evens out. For example, there are communities in the US where you can be cited for not sorting your garbage, but not for having entered the country illegally.

[Guest]

The economic impact is the undersold side of this thing. Arizona's economy for the last few decades has been based on in migration and construction. So now you have an overbuilt state that has just essentially told immigrants "if you come here you will be subject to police stops to ask for your papers". This will drive legal immigrants away from Arizona and worsen their economy and stretch out any housing recovery.

Just desserts.

There is irony on all sides of the immigration debate, i.e. Cesar Chaves would have supported this law.