The Church

[SeattleUte]

I find that most people stop looking for truth when it becomes uncomfortable to them. I personally stopped looking for "the truth" when I started examining the New Testament with the same scrutiny that I did the Old testament and the BOM. I stopped looking because I didn't want to taint the last bastion of faith that I had.

The new Testament bespeaks carefully constructed fiction at virtually every line. There are also the deliberate ambiguity about authorship of the Gospels, and the curious circumstances of their composition and publication.

But I guess I'm the opposite of how you describe most people. I'm an amateur philologist and I love exegesis. I love to deconstruct and drill down and conjecture about sourece and inspiration.

In my opinion, true appreciation of the scriptures comes upon finding redemption and validation in them despite recognizing they are not history, and in some or virtually all respects are conscious fictions. Their authors were geniuses, and probably had good hearts. But they did not value truth for truth's sake as some of us do. One lesson we learn from these ancient books and their continuing vitality and role as the ultimate source of all we hold dear is that the power of story is matchless, even sublime.

[byu71]

The new Testament bespeaks carefully constructed fiction at virtually every line. There are also the deliberate ambiguity about authorship of the Gospels, and the curious circumstances of their composition and publication.

But I guess I'm the opposite of how you describe most people. I'm an amateur philologist and I love exegesis. I love to deconstruct and drill down and conjecture about sourece and inspiration.

In my opinion, true appreciation of the scriptures comes upon finding redemption and validation in them despite recognizing they are not history, and in some or virtually all respects are conscious fictions. Their authors were geniuses, and probably had good hearts. But they did not value truth for truth's sake as some of us do. One lesson we learn from these ancient books and their continuing vitality and role as the ultimate source of all we hold dear is that the power of story is matchless, even sublime.

Well said, even if I don't agree with all of it, it was well said.

[Jarid in Cedar]

The new Testament bespeaks carefully constructed fiction at virtually every line. There are also the deliberate ambiguity about authorship of the Gospels, and the curious circumstances of their composition and publication.

But I guess I'm the opposite of how you describe most people. I'm an amateur philologist and I love exegesis. I love to deconstruct and drill down and conjecture about sourece and inspiration.

In my opinion, true appreciation of the scriptures comes upon finding redemption and validation in them despite recognizing they are not history, and in some or virtually all respects are conscious fictions. Their authors were geniuses, and probably had good hearts. But they did not value truth for truth's sake as some of us do. One lesson we learn from these ancient books and their continuing vitality and role as the ultimate source of all we hold dear is that the power of story is matchless, even sublime.

While I typically agree and approach reading scripture in the same manner as you, the New testament was a sacred cow I wasn't willing to kill just yet, and may never want to.

[SeattleUte]

While I typically agree and approach reading scripture in the same manner as you, the New testament was a sacred cow I wasn't willing to kill just yet, and may never want to.

Ironically, one of the things the scriptures teach us is the importance of a search for truth for its own sake.

[Rosebud]

Recent discussions on CUF have me thinking about the relationship between the Church and God. Plenty of individuals here take issue with things the Church does or says (Family Proclamation, blacks and the priesthood, etc. etc. etc. etc.). Yet no one rails against God, not even SU.

I'm just wondering how everyone (this does not include SU) deals with the disconnect of believing the Church is God's church, yet disagreeing so intensely with what it does.

Because if God is the one calling the shots on said troubling aspects of the Church, then your argument is with Him, right?

And on the other hand, if God is not calling the shots, at what point is the Church going rogue and just making stuff up? When do you reach the point of Jarid in Cedar and just leave?

There was one time in my life when I railed against God. In the second year of my marriage, I strongly disagreed with Mr. Rosebud about a major life-decision. We couldn't reach reconciliation... so against my better judgement I agreed to support him because I thought that God and the temple demanded that I do so. As I had feared, the decision ended up being extremely negative for me.

For the five years preceding this decision I had subscribed to the philosophy that the doctrine of the church was God's doctrine and that any bad things I saw in the church were due to the weaknesses of members and leaders. I followed my husband because doctrinally I believed that God wanted me to. Then, when things got ugly for me I blamed God for trapping me against my will.

This personal crisis forced me to reevaluate my previous confidence in the doctrines of the church. I had previously felt close to God so my anger at him felt paradoxical. This paradox helped me realize that my belief that God was good was greater than my belief in any or all of the doctrines of the church. It hit me that I couldn't simultaneously believe that God had forced me into a hurtful situation and believe that he was good.

Now, I see God as a being who supports what is good and is angry or patiently displeased with what is bad. Therefore... I believe that hurtful "doctrines" are not his. I keep that in mind as I evaluate Mormonism or any other spiritual or temporal dogma. This belief helps me on a daily and weekly basis as I interact with church members and try to interpret truth from error.

When I hear doctrine over the pulpit that claims Mormon superiority, for example, I don't subscribe to the doctrine because I don't think that a good God would see it that way. With this reasoning, I doubt that God sees any one institution or group of people that he fully supports...

I think I'm in a different place than Sleeping in EQ, but I like his statement that "the search for truth is better than the search for who is right." I search for truth in Mormonism as well as in a myriad of other places. I don't see any reason to run from my religion when I'm not guaranteed to find all truth in any one location, anyhow. I doubt God is deceived by any Mormons trying to prove their own righteousness.... so why is it such a big deal if they're wrong about a lot of things? Even though Mormons don't have the patent on righteousness... it's not as if they have the patent on wickedness either.

[SoCalCoug]

People generally stop doing anything that becomes uncomfortable to them. Cognitive dissonance is not fun to deal with, but I think it's important to learn how to resolve it.

LOL!