Healing Objects

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  • LA Ute
    Receiver of Memory
    • Nov 2008
    • 19512

    #16
    I found this bit on consecrated oil:
    Anointing the Sick

    It is common for Latter-day Saints to follow the admonition of James: "Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord: And the prayer of faith shall save the sick . . . ." (James 5:14-15) Accordingly, Latter-day Saint elders consecrate olive oil for use in blessing the sick. And while people of other denominations also anoint the sick on occasion, the consecration of the oil in early Christianity is not found in the New Testament, but is consistent with LDS practice.

    Specifically, there was a clear demarcation in the early church as to who could and who could not bless the oil. While bishops and elders could consecrate oil, those in the lower echelons of the priesthood, such as deacons, could not. The Apostolic Constitutions described the practice:
    Concerning the water and the oil, I Matthias make a constitution. Let the bishop bless the water, or the oil. But if he be not there, let the presbyter bless it, the deacon standing by. But if the bishop be present, let the presbyter and deacon stand by, and let him say thus: O Lord of hosts, the God of powers, the creator of the waters, and the supplier of oil, who art compassionate, and a lover of mankind, who hast given water for drink and for cleansing, and oil to give man a cheerful and joyful countenance; do Thou now also sanctify this water and this oil through Thy Christ, in the name of him or her that has offered them, and grant them a power to restore health, to drive away diseases, to banish demons, and to disperse all snares through Christ our hope, with whom glory, honour, and worship be to Thee, and to the Holy Ghost, for ever. Amen.65

    Gradually the rite of anointing the sick was corrupted. For example, John Chrysostom advocated using oil taken from church lamps and from martyrs' shrines, while some others suggested the use of oil filtered through martyrs' relics.66 Finally, J. Halliburton notes that after the patristic period, anointing of the sick became restricted to those who were deemed incurably ill and needed a ritual preparation for purgatory.67

    This is from FAIR. The footnote links did not come through, but they are here. Scroll about 2/3 of the way down.
    Last edited by LA Ute; 03-18-2010, 02:29 PM.
    “There is a great deal of difference in believing something still, and believing it again.”
    ― W.H. Auden


    "God made the angels to show His splendour - as He made animals for innocence and plants for their simplicity. But men and women He made to serve Him wittily, in the tangle of their minds."
    -- Robert Bolt, A Man for All Seasons


    "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
    --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    Comment

    • wuapinmon
      Soul Plumber
      • Dec 2008
      • 30711

      #17
      LA Ute,

      I'd wager, un poquito, that if you asked the average LDS missionary what he thought about holy water, the level of scorn wouldn't vary much, and it would be strong.

      I also reckon that if you asked the average LDS male priesthood holder his thoughts on the matter, the scorn might only vary a shade or two.

      How odd then that we think it's totally normal to consecrate oil, but mock those who consecrate water, or pass holy smoke around something to sanctify it.

      There's a certain, "We're the only true church" cockiness that I first observed as a recent-convert missionary in our membership (those not from a Catholic tradition) that manifests some more of those 'norms' that pelagius was talking about in the "horsey" thread.
      "Wuap's "problem" is that he is smart & principled & committed to a moral course of action. His actions are supposed to reflect his ethical code.
      The rest of us rarely bother to think about our actions." --Solon

      Comment

      • LA Ute
        Receiver of Memory
        • Nov 2008
        • 19512

        #18
        Originally posted by wuapinmon View Post
        LA Ute,

        I'd wager, un poquito, that if you asked the average LDS missionary what he thought about holy water, the level of scorn wouldn't vary much, and it would be strong.

        I also reckon that if you asked the average LDS male priesthood holder his thoughts on the matter, the scorn might only vary a shade or two.

        How odd then that we think it's totally normal to consecrate oil, but mock those who consecrate water, or pass holy smoke around something to sanctify it.

        There's a certain, "We're the only true church" cockiness that I first observed as a recent-convert missionary in our membership (those not from a Catholic tradition) that manifests some more of those 'norms' that pelagius was talking about in the "horsey" thread.
        We are on the same page, wuap. I am horrified at a lot of the things I thought and said as a 19 year-old punk with good intentions. From talking to my own son and to the missionaries who serve in our ward, I have the impression that we are doing better with the problem you identify. I hope so, anyway.

        BTW, I cited to the FAIR stuff because I thought it was interesting. I wasn't trying to make any point. I should have said so!
        “There is a great deal of difference in believing something still, and believing it again.”
        ― W.H. Auden


        "God made the angels to show His splendour - as He made animals for innocence and plants for their simplicity. But men and women He made to serve Him wittily, in the tangle of their minds."
        -- Robert Bolt, A Man for All Seasons


        "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
        --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

        Comment

        • UtahDan
          *
          • Nov 2008
          • 14496

          #19
          Originally posted by LA Ute View Post
          BTW, I cited to the FAIR stuff because I thought it was interesting. I wasn't trying to make any point. I should have said so!
          Oh, and not because you are a koolaid drinker and a shill for FAIR? Like anyone will believe that!

          Comment

          • LA Ute
            Receiver of Memory
            • Nov 2008
            • 19512

            #20
            Originally posted by UtahDan View Post
            Oh, and not because you are a koolaid drinker and a shill for FAIR? Like anyone will believe that!
            I'm trying to mute my Philistinism. (Is that a word?)
            “There is a great deal of difference in believing something still, and believing it again.”
            ― W.H. Auden


            "God made the angels to show His splendour - as He made animals for innocence and plants for their simplicity. But men and women He made to serve Him wittily, in the tangle of their minds."
            -- Robert Bolt, A Man for All Seasons


            "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
            --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

            Comment

            • Viking
              Banned
              • Jun 2009
              • 6470

              #21
              Originally posted by creekster View Post
              The function being what? AN object through which healing power is bestowed or an object upon which the subject's faith can be fixed to effect a powerful result? Or something else?
              Faith affixed to oil? Who affixes their faith to oil when receiving a blessing?

              Comment

              • Viking
                Banned
                • Jun 2009
                • 6470

                #22
                Originally posted by LA Ute View Post
                I'm trying to mute my Philistinism. (Is that a word?)
                Grammar-wise, it's equivalent to any other word with -wise affixed to it.

                Meaning, it's not a word in all likelihood.

                Philistinian. I like that better

                Comment

                • LA Ute
                  Receiver of Memory
                  • Nov 2008
                  • 19512

                  #23
                  Originally posted by Viking View Post
                  Grammar-wise, it's equivalent to any other word with -wise affixed to it.

                  Meaning, it's not a word in all likelihood.

                  Philistinian. I like that better
                  To my surprise I have learned that "philistinism" is indeed a recognized word. Amazing what knowledge a guy can pick up on CUF.

                  (The accent's on the first syllable.)
                  “There is a great deal of difference in believing something still, and believing it again.”
                  ― W.H. Auden


                  "God made the angels to show His splendour - as He made animals for innocence and plants for their simplicity. But men and women He made to serve Him wittily, in the tangle of their minds."
                  -- Robert Bolt, A Man for All Seasons


                  "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
                  --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

                  Comment

                  • wuapinmon
                    Soul Plumber
                    • Dec 2008
                    • 30711

                    #24
                    Has anyone ever gotten these paper prayer handkerchiefs in the mail? You're supposed to put a sheet of paper with a drawing of a handkerchief on top of your head, say a prayer to be healed, and then donate to this church who sends stuff to you.
                    "Wuap's "problem" is that he is smart & principled & committed to a moral course of action. His actions are supposed to reflect his ethical code.
                    The rest of us rarely bother to think about our actions." --Solon

                    Comment

                    • Solon
                      Lost in the flood
                      • Nov 2008
                      • 5747

                      #25
                      Originally posted by wuapinmon View Post
                      Has anyone ever gotten these paper prayer handkerchiefs in the mail? You're supposed to put a sheet of paper with a drawing of a handkerchief on top of your head, say a prayer to be healed, and then donate to this church who sends stuff to you.
                      That's awesome. I'd at least spring for a cloth handkerchief.

                      I was thinking about this issue recently. The names on lists in LDS temples are another example of "sympathetic magic" (for lack of a better term; I mean no offense).

                      It's telling that LDS temple officials don't just write "Everyone" on the temple prayer-roll.
                      "More crazy people to Provo go than to any other town in the state."
                      -- Iron County Record. 23 August, 1912. (http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/lc...23/ed-1/seq-4/)

                      Comment

                      • NorthwestUteFan
                        אלוף
                        • Oct 2010
                        • 3384

                        #26
                        Originally posted by Solon View Post
                        That's awesome. I'd at least spring for a cloth handkerchief..
                        Economics of scale will preclude that option. Spam mail must be cheap up front, or it will be too inefficient to return the expected 'returns '.

                        Comment

                        • LA Ute
                          Receiver of Memory
                          • Nov 2008
                          • 19512

                          #27
                          Originally posted by Solon View Post
                          That's awesome. I'd at least spring for a cloth handkerchief.

                          I was thinking about this issue recently. The names on lists in LDS temples are another example of "sympathetic magic" (for lack of a better term; I mean no offense).

                          It's telling that LDS temple officials don't just write "Everyone" on the temple prayer-roll.
                          I am guessing that the Austin Collie magic would be of the unsympathetic kind?
                          “There is a great deal of difference in believing something still, and believing it again.”
                          ― W.H. Auden


                          "God made the angels to show His splendour - as He made animals for innocence and plants for their simplicity. But men and women He made to serve Him wittily, in the tangle of their minds."
                          -- Robert Bolt, A Man for All Seasons


                          "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
                          --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

                          Comment

                          • RobinFinderson
                            Banned
                            • Nov 2008
                            • 10548

                            #28
                            Originally posted by wuapinmon View Post
                            Has anyone ever gotten these paper prayer handkerchiefs in the mail? You're supposed to put a sheet of paper with a drawing of a handkerchief on top of your head, say a prayer to be healed, and then donate to this church who sends stuff to you.
                            Wow, wuap, you truly have a photographic memory for these old threads. I will sometimes start skimming a thread like this, experiencing it as if it were completely new, only to come across MY OWN POST.

                            Comment

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