Your best guess at tithing revenue

[scottie]

CI = Confidence Interval

Not sure what that means, but do you still think I'm low when you consider Utah's average?

[Moliere]

To keep this simple I'm only using U.S. membership numbers b/c I don't imagine non-U.S. countries are bringing in much (probably barely covering their expenses).

5.7 million U.S. members
1.71 million active members (30%)
513K full tithe payers (30%)
$30K ave income
513K members paying $3K per year = $1.539 bil

Cash money baby (jk).

Anybody want to take a stab at what operating expenses are?

If I remember correctly the article in Time magazine a while back estimated net revenue for the church at around $5 or $6 billion but I don't currently have a link to verify that. That might include tithing and all other donations and also revenue from the church's for-profit businesses but I'm not sure.

Revenues in excess of $5 billion would put the church into the Fortune 500 list.

[TripletDaddy]

I just texted a friend in the COB for confirmation, she is in the know. She said the annual overhead is "well over one billion."

please ask her how much OH is payroll. And how much payroll is for GAs.

[Indy Coug]

Not sure what that means, but do you still think I'm low when you consider Utah's average?

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confidence_interval"]Definition[/ame]

Yes, I think you are using conservative estimates.

[Moliere]

I think the LDS Church's fantastic wealth is one of its mythical elements. $1.539 billion hardly would qualify it as a medium-sized business. You hear about all these business interests it owns but where are they? It's like the mafia into all these legitimate businesses and you don't know it? So far I can tell, it's securities, and probably pretty dull ones at that.

I wonder how much of the wealth is really just a myth or speculation. I would expect that cash outflows of the church would be similar to cash inflows with the exception of any money they stash into for-profit businesses.

You cannot value a business based solely on revenues unless you do a market approach analysis using multipliers of similar businesses, which is obviously not available information for either the LDS church or any similar entities since I can't think of a church that is publicly traded.

I would love to do a discounted cash flow analysis of the church to estimate it's net worth. I really wouldn't care as to the result, but it would be fun to try.

[SeattleUte]

I wonder how much of the wealth is really just a myth or speculation. I would expect that cash outflows of the church would be similar to cash inflows with the exception of any money they stash into for-profit businesses.

You cannot value a business based solely on revenues unless you do a market approach analysis using multipliers of similar businesses, which is obviously not available information for either the LDS church or any similar entities since I can't think of a church that is publicly traded.

I would love to do a discounted cash flow analysis of the church to estimate it's net worth. I really wouldn't care as to the result, but it would be fun to try.

I'm not saying it's not $5 billion but I don't know why Time Mag is an authority. They print rubbish all the time. How would Time know?

[Art Vandelay]

. How would Time know?

They prayed about it.

[Moliere]

I'm not saying it's not $5 billion but I don't know why Time Mag is an authority. They print rubbish all the time. How would Time know?

And I'm saying revenues <> wealth. I personally think revenues for the church are well over $5 billion but that doesn't, on its own, make the church wealthy.

[Moliere]

I'm not saying it's not $5 billion but I don't know why Time Mag is an authority. They print rubbish all the time. How would Time know?

I just reread your post and realized that I misinterpreted it. I agree with you on this one although it is all speculation unless we can pin down the church's financial controller and get some real numbers out of him.

[TripletDaddy]

And I'm saying revenues <> wealth. I personally think revenues for the church are well over $5 billion but that doesn't, on its own, make the church wealthy.

It would be fun to check out the Church books.

I wonder if they have attempted to monetize goodwill. The LDS name is a strong brand and they have some amazing "client lists," but how do you assign it a worth? If they do manage to assign it a value, that could also explain some of the estimates of total net worth.

[JohnnyLingo]

So one day, 60 Minutes does an investigation and finds out the Church has been hoarding tithing money and using it to buy islands and jets and boats for GA's.

Your reaction?

[SeattleUte]

It would be fun to check out the Church books.

I wonder if they have attempted to monetize goodwill. The LDS name is a strong brand and they have some amazing "client lists," but how do you assign it a worth? If they do manage to assign it a value, that could also explain some of the estimates of total net worth.

When are the members going to raise hell about this? Gay marriage, make finances public, etc., it's all within the people's power to bring about. Ultimately, LDS leaders must bow to the will of the people. It's funny how they're so passive.

[Moliere]

It would be fun to check out the Church books.

I wonder if they have attempted to monetize goodwill. The LDS name is a strong brand and they have some amazing "client lists," but how do you assign it a worth? If they do manage to assign it a value, that could also explain some of the estimates of total net worth.

Your only option would be to use a discounted cash flow approach since there is no market data available. The problem is the DCF would be impossible since most often they go into perpetuity, however with a church DCF you would want to factor in the second coming and since no one knows when that is going to happen it would introduce an impossible terminal contingency.

[SeattleUte]

So one day, 60 Minutes does an investigation and finds out the Church has been hoarding tithing money and using it to buy islands and jets and boats for GA's.

Your reaction?

Not a chance. You'd sooner find me at a Dixie Chicks concert.

http://www.cougaruteforum.com/showpo...&postcount=332

[SeattleUte]

Your only option would be to use a discounted cash flow approach since there is no market data available. The problem is the DCF would be impossible since most often they go into perpetuity, however with a church DCF you would want to factor in the second coming and since no one knows when that is going to happen it would introduce an impossible terminal contingency.

Isn't the value of the goodwill just the discounted tithing revenue and other donations? That revenue is wholly a product of goodwill. But it can't be sold.