With some new blood on the board

[pellegrino]

I think Alan Ashton's already fractured his fortune enough that he couldn't afford it.

I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't have a hand in SVU in Buena Vista VA, which tells me that he couldn't possibly buy BYU.

[Goatnapper'96]

I think Alan Ashton's already fractured his fortune enough that he couldn't afford it.

The whole LDS Church and secular education is an interesting model. It has its limitations and we can allow SeattleUte to be the chief spokesman concerning that matter. He is knowledgeable and a complete asshole so he has the chilling effect of mobilizing support for the BYU even from those predisposed to agreeing with him. Saying all that, the fact of the matter is that the LDS experience is not significant enough to warrant the attention neccesary for any decent scholastic support or study. I think having the BYU has helped the Church to bridge that challenge. Members have benefited from having an institution of higher learning dedicated to the LDS experience.

[Mr. Crimson]

Since I'm not LDS but I have in fact been through all of the discussions, where does this place me on the BYU fan-ALUF-Drunken Ute continuum?

[Goatnapper'96]

If that ever happens, you wake me up and I will in fact start worrying.

BYU wants to win but within its framework. Hence, I am trying to figure out what USS Utah is getting at. Clearly any objective and reasonable person can see that BYU has self imposed limitations that are not real negotiable. However, what is wrong with fans wanting success? There are those who lament BYU's position on many subjects and would like to see it changed but for the most part I see very few advocating a win at all cost philosophy.

[Goatnapper'96]

Since I'm not LDS but I have in fact been through all of the discussions, where does this place me on the BYU fan-ALUF-Drunken Ute continuum?

In serious jeapordy. You have been warned, my brother.

[Flattop]

If folks in the media can occassionally throw out BYU as a dark horse to playing in some BCS MNC game, why shouldn't BYU fans discuss it?

Is that like a chicken and the egg question? Who discussed it first after the Heeps announcement, BYU fans or the local media?

Are you bothered that BYU puts an emphasis on winning?

Do they? I wish you guys would make up your minds. Is it priority #1 or #5?

Look, obviously no one wants to be Army right now. I'm sure even the academies want to win the games.

As far as the AFA fans I think the answer would be mid October 2002 or perhaps early November 1985.

Really? But then, I don't actually spend much time with AFA fans.

[PaloAltoCougar]

Since I'm not LDS but I have in fact been through all of the discussions, where does this place me on the BYU fan-ALUF-Drunken Ute continuum?

We've still got the printed programs ready to go for you baptism (I believe Landpoke was going to help officiate). It would be great to have you become a Drunken BYU Fan, perhaps the best of all worlds.

[I.J. Reilly]

BYU wants to win but within its framework. Hence, I am trying to figure out what USS Utah is getting at. Clearly any objective and reasonable person can see that BYU has self imposed limitations that are not real negotiable. However, what is wrong with fans wanting success? There are those who lament BYU's position on many subjects and would like to see it changed but for the most part I see very few advocating a win at all cost philosophy.

The point is, BYU can't expect success when it doesn't even let its athletes have premarital sex, use illegal drugs, and drink alcohol.

On top of all of that, they expect them to be "ecleastically endorsed".

If that's not a receipe for disaster in sports then I don't know what is.

[Flattop]

Clearly any objective and reasonable person can see that BYU has self imposed limitations that are not real negotiable. However, what is wrong with fans wanting success?

Nothing wrong with wanting success. As I just said, I'm sure the academies want to win the games they play, too.

I think, instead, its about expectations. It seems that BYU fans expect to dominate the MWC every year and compete for a national title at least occasionally. Never mind that the 80s were a long time ago and this isn't the old WAC where the other schools weren't willing to expend the resources to actually compete with BYU.

But I have to say, I don't know what AFA fans expect.

[Goatnapper'96]

Is that like a chicken and the egg question? Who discussed it first after the Heeps announcement, BYU fans or the local media?



Do they? I wish you guys would make up your minds. Is it priority #1 or #5?

Look, obviously no one wants to be Army right now. I'm sure even the academies want to win the games.



Really? But then, I don't actually spend much time with AFA fans.

I don't know anything about local SLC media as I only pay attention to the folks who give information about BYU that is useful. However, I did read BYU mentioned as a darkhorse for the MNC game before the 2008 season in various national publications. Whether or not it was informed is another story, I am just trying to figure out what your point is with respect to the AFA. I think BYU football should have much higher expectations than AFA football and I am trying to understand how BYU expectations aligning with AFA expectations is something you think should happen. Exactly how would that further the mission of BYU or the Mormon Church? As far as BYU making up its mind, I think one can see that winning is a priority, losing coaches tend to get fired, but winning must be accomplished within BYU's framework. How that works out to a numerical priority is a silly errand to figure out, my guess is Mendenhall is learning that.

As far as 2002 and 1985 the AFA was off on good runs to start both years. In 1985 the Zoomies got as high as #3 nationally and they lost to BYU in Provo on the same weekend that #'s 1 and 2 were beaten, I believe. In 2002 they ran out to 6-0 and lost a tough one to Notre Dame that ended their BCS dreams.

[Mr. Crimson]

We've still got the printed programs ready to go for you baptism (I believe Landpoke was going to help officiate). It would be great to have you become a Drunken BYU Fan, perhaps the best of all worlds.

Well the funny thing with my upcoming surgery, it will require me to give up alcohol. First this may mean my banishment from the Pirate Ship and since I am married with a child coming, it seems that all I have left to do is to learn the location of secret underground vault at the BYU Creamery where the best flavors are kept and I'm in.

However the difficulty comes with this. I took my bride to Provo for the last Utah-BYU game (she's a good Catholic gal, Jesuit educated). She when from having never met a BYU fan to screaming at a guy after the game, "what makes you think its ok to act the way you do?" (In defense of BYU since we've won our 2nd BCS bowl I'm not sure what makes us think its ok to act the way we do either, it has to do with a Goatnapper theorm and I've always been pissed he was right)

I think when I have that answer, we may move forward.

[byu71]

Is that like a chicken and the egg question? Who discussed it first after the Heeps announcement, BYU fans or the local media?



Do they? I wish you guys would make up your minds. Is it priority #1 or #5?

Look, obviously no one wants to be Army right now. I'm sure even the academies want to win the games.



Really? But then, I don't actually spend much time with AFA fans.

Why would you as a UTE FAN worry about us making up our minds? I don't worry about folks who believe in BYU's "the honor code" cheering for the Utes.

One thing I should point out is that BYU has a very diverse fan base. Such diversity is probably why in numbers it dwarfs the Ute fan base. You want us to make up our minds and choose? Why, so we can eliminate 1/2 the fan base to put us at equal numbers with the Utes. I don't think so.

[byu71]

Well the funny thing with my upcoming surgery, it will require me to give up alcohol. First this may mean my banishment from the Pirate Ship and since I am married with a child coming, it seems that all I have left to do is to learn the location of secret underground vault at the BYU Creamery where the best flavors are kept and I'm in.

However the difficulty comes with this. I took my bride to Provo for the last Utah-BYU game (she's a good Catholic gal, Jesuit educated). She when from having never met a BYU fan to screaming at a guy after the game, "what makes you think its ok to act the way you do?" (In defense of BYU since we've won our 2nd BCS bowl I'm not sure what makes us think its ok to act the way we do either, it has to do with a Goatnapper theorm and I've always been pissed he was right)

I think when I have that answer, we may move forward.

OUt of curiosity, how was the fan acting. I hope he wasn't looking at your bride with lust. Actually if he was, congrats, but still that isn't a way for a BYU fan to act.

[DU Ute]

The point is, BYU can't expect success when it doesn't even let its athletes have premarital sex, use illegal drugs, and drink alcohol.

On top of all of that, they expect them to be "ecleastically endorsed".

If that's not a receipe for disaster in sports then I don't know what is.

They really should loosen these rules up for the non LDS kids. Maybe no drugs, no underage drinking or alcohol related arrests and no premarital sex with LDS girls.

[byu71]

They really should loosen these rules up for the non LDS kids. Maybe no drugs, no underage drinking or alcohol related arrests and no premarital sex with LDS girls.

I wish you had donated 1 million bucks to BYU and had some influence with them. A definite overhaul is needed, but I think you have to give them that much before they will listen.