The Big 12 expansion groundswell

[TripletDaddy]

I don't think we can compare BYU's current situation to anything in CFB. It's rare to see a university choose to wallow in the midst of mediocrity and refuse an opportunity for a universal step up in conference, opponents, potential and money. Lavell era BYU always had something to prove because they were shut out of the Big Boy conferences, so fans adjusted accordingly and were able to play the victimized underdog role. Now, we have no card to play. We had the chance and blew it. Everyone knows it too and it will hurt everything; attendance, recruiting, fundraising, morale, national respect, etc. Utah will pounce on this and the gap will widen even more.

What gap, though? Utah is awful this season, be it due to injuries or otherwise. Expectations were high that this was the season to jump....no Farm, no Zeros....SC on SanCtions. Right now the Ute fanbase is hoping for bowl eligibility. There is also siginificant pressure on the Utes here in the state. It was a no brainer to make the jump but losing seasons will only reinforce the notion that theirs was a last-ditch invite, not a meritorious one. Hypothetically speaking, let's say Utah struggles similarly next season. You will hear less and less of this "we are just so happy to be here" nonsense.

BYU is facing pressure of its own, but for different reasons. The most recent decision to eschew the B12 invite is puzzling, to put it politely. There is unprecedented pressure on the school to show donors and fans alike wtf the plan is for the next 5 or so years. Current trends in home scheduling will not cut it, even if this current team does wind up winning 9 or so games (still very possible given the schedule).

This is a unique time in Utah. Both schools are facing new pressure never before seen along the Wasatch.

[Flystripper]

You're judging based on year one.

no I am basing it on the following:

1. Current and projected BCS access. Projection based on BCS response when we petitioned for better access.

2. The 3-5 years of schedules look horrible and recent efforts to schedule have yielded results wich are significantly below expectations even with fellow independent ND. Weber State in the first half of the season? really?

3. Three years of Bowls are scheduled and all three are shit

4. The Big 12 offers more money and it is a fact the once the ESPN contract is over the money in the future is uncertain.

5. Our other sports play in the WCC. The WCC is a joke.

[lambdacoug]

Some of you guys are really upset. I see one set of footprints in the sand right now....

That's all there ever is...

[TripletDaddy]

A little perspective here:

After watching the Utes play the likes of CSU, UNM, SDSU and BYU all these years, how can I not be excited about USC, ASU, etc.?

I'll concede that I'm not the norm here, but when I say I'm looking forward to seeing the Utes play Arizona, I mean it and I don't care that the bandwagoners will stop attending. Better for me if they don't attend, as I won't have to hear them talk about how much better Utah would be if they were the coach.

To be clear, Im not saying that fans shouldnt be thrilled. Of course they should. Heck, I am excited because I will get to see SC every other year here in utah. It is great, no doubt.

My point is that HFN is correct...winning will drive things over the long haul, not conference affiliation. Attendance is almost always a greater function of winning than opponent. There are exceptions, of course, but in general, which is the tougher ticket to get...a home team that is undefeated or a lousy home team playing a ranked visiting team?

Most BCS schools do not sell out their home schedule. This means that after awhile, yes, it is less exciting playing Oregon or Michigan or whatever marquee team happens to be in your conference. It is no longer a novelty.

Winning never loses its luster, however.

[lambdacoug]

You're judging based on year one.

Which also happens to be all available evidence...

[Portland Ute]

I would most definitely go independent rather than having losing season after losing season. I would rather be BYU and independent and winning games than Arizona, Colorado or Utah.

For the record I still think we end up in the Big 12, but we can definitely make independence work. I would rather be in the Big 12, but we'll be fine either way. I don't think we would be Arizona or Colorado in the Big 12. We have the ability to be a top tier team in any league except probably the SEC.

:timeout:

[TripletDaddy]

That's all there ever is...

ha. that is actually pretty funny. (should be in the Foyer, though)

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

All fans expect SEC fans....so maybe stupid was the wrong word

Just going from sources I can find with Google.
http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/...8ffc9080650d5b
SEC teams with losing records last year that didn't fill the stadium.

Ole Miss stadium capacity 60,508, last years average attendance 55,898.
Vandy stadium capacity 39,780, last years average attendance 33,269
Kentucky stadium capacity 67,606, last years average attendance 66,070.
Tennessee stadium capacity 102,455, last years average attendance 99,781.

Georgia did average exact capacity despite going 6-7. Stadium capacity is listed at 92,746 and that is the reported average attendance.

One SEC team with a winning record Miss St, failed to reach an average capacity, but barley. Capacity 55,082, 2010 avg 54,999.

This is in the SEC. Which all we hear is that football isn't a part of life it is a way of life. When they don't win they don't fill the stadium.

[Omaha 680]

That's all there ever is...

LOL. You kill me, AC. You couldn't leave a joke like that alone if you tried.

[lambdacoug]

ha. that is actually pretty funny. (should be in the Foyer, though)

Really? Then the original should be as well.

[SeattleUte]

What gap, though? Utah is awful this season, be it due to injuries or otherwise. Expectations were high that this was the season to jump....no Farm, no Zeros....SC on SanCtions. Right now the Ute fanbase is hoping for bowl eligibility. There is also siginificant pressure on the Utes here in the state. It was a no brainer to make the jump but losing seasons will only reinforce the notion that theirs was a last-ditch invite, not a meritorious one. Hypothetically speaking, let's say Utah struggles similarly next season. You will hear less and less of this "we are just so happy to be here" nonsense.

BYU is facing pressure of its own, but for different reasons. The most recent decision to eschew the B12 invite is puzzling, to put it politely. There is unprecedented pressure on the school to show donors and fans alike wtf the plan is for the next 5 or so years. Current trends in home scheduling will not cut it, even if this current team does wind up winning 9 or so games (still very possible given the schedule).

This is a unique time in Utah. Both schools are facing new pressure never before seen along the Wasatch.

The fact that you automatically swallow the BS that BYU rejected a Big 12 invitation is really disappointing. I always regarded you as a healthy skeptic. THERE IS NO EVIDNECE BYU RECEIVED ANY OFFER. SOONER, CARDIAC, WOOT, HELP ME OUT HERE.

Also, no one will know whether the sweeping conclusions you draw in your first paragraph are accurate for perhaps 5-7 years at least. Shall we conclude that USC can't compete in the Pac 12 based on this season?

It turns out you're just like the idiot masses on CB. A pod person. I feel like I'm in that chilling scene in the Stepford Wives. You've really lost it over this Utah to the Pac 12, BYU to irrelevance turn of events. Shame on you.

[lambdacoug]

LOL. You kill me, AC. You couldn't leave a joke like that alone if you tried.

*shrug*

[Jeff Lebowski]

The fact that you automatically swallow the BS that BYU rejected a Big 12 invitation is really disappointing. I always regarded you as a healthy skeptic. THERE IS NO EVIDNECE BYU RECEIVED ANY OFFER. SOONER, CARDIAC, WOOT, HELP ME OUT HERE.

Also, no one will know whether the sweeping conclusions you draw in your first paragraph are accurate for perhaps 5-7 years at least. Shall we conclude that USC can't compete in the Pac 12 based on this season?

It turns out you're just like the idiot masses on CB. A pod person. I feel like I'm in that chilling scene in the Stepford Wives. You've really lost it over this Utah to the Pac 12, BYU to irrelevance turn of events. Shame on you.

Wow. Shot birds flutter.

[TripletDaddy]

Really? Then the original should be as well.

this isnt a religious thread.

[Donuthole]

We have relatively recent data on this too. Crowton gets all the blame, but that first year that things slid downhill we had probably the toughest schedule BYU ever played. I think there were 3 undefeated teams in the country that year and we played all 3. Fans were hopping off the bandwagon in droves.

That first year things slid downhill we played Syracuse, Hawaii, Nevada, Georgia Tech, and Utah State as our OOC schedule.