Bronco and recruiting

[creekster]

I gotta say that, although I haven't read the quote in its context (having only seen it here), I respect Bronco more for this approach. Let's be honest: football is not the most important thing in life, especially for people who consider mortality some kind of probationary period leading up to a happily-ever-after.

Maybe Bronco could have been more nuanced - football is priority number one during practice and games - or explained his position better (for the sake of fundraising, at least), but I respect this approach from a religious school. Ideally, a school would produce good students, good citizens, good spouses/parents, good church-members, and good football players, but Bronco is just putting it all into perspective.

It's a gutsy position that many people don't agree with, and I'm glad he's not coaching my favorite team, but at least Bronco is a man of principle. I find that commendable.

I used to feel the same way about MAFU

[TripletDaddy]

I gotta say that, although I haven't read the quote in its context (having only seen it here), I respect Bronco more for this approach. Let's be honest: football is not the most important thing in life, especially for people who consider mortality some kind of probationary period leading up to a happily-ever-after.

Maybe Bronco could have been more nuanced - football is priority number one during practice and games - or explained his position better (for the sake of fundraising, at least), but I respect this approach from a religious school. Ideally, a school would produce good students, good citizens, good spouses/parents, good church-members, and good football players, but Bronco is just putting it all into perspective.

It's a gutsy position that many people don't agree with, and I'm glad he's not coaching my favorite team, but at least Bronco is a man of principle. I find that commendable.

I get what Bronco is saying and you are correct, I think his misstep was a matter of semantics. If you asked JoePa to choose between God, his children and spouse, or football, I am pretty sure he would not choose football. Most people are that way.

But such a statement by Bronco is really just an excuse. It is an excuse for losing. It is an excuse for falling short. And that bugs me. Just as you would never admit to your boss that your job isn't your top priority, nor should Bronco be saying stuff like that. It reflects an inner mindset and attiude that I don't like. The one thing about LaVell that always annoyed me besides those rad checkered gabardine slacks he would wear on game day was his "Win your Conference, go to a Bowl game" mantra. I remember an interview with Bobby Bowden once wherein he stated to the effect, "at FSU, our goal every year is to win the national championship. It isn't to win the conferece or to go to a bowl game. We aren't satisfied with those things." It would be nice to hear that sort of talk from BYU coaches.

[byu71]

Why the need to state these things at BYU. I maintain it is for the same reason the father in the ward tells his kids he doesn't make as much money as the other father because he, "puts his family and church first".

It very well could be my personality and that is why I pick up on it. I have always been big on don't tell me how smart, good, rich or talented you are. I am smart enough to figure it out for myself.

WE all know their are two constituencies one has to appeal to at BYU. The religious element and the football fan element. The clash comes when the religious element feels their right to ask for things comes from their spiritualness. You then have those who actually fund the program who feel much like they would an investment they put money into. They don't want the company telling people their charitable goals are more important than making stockholders money.

If we were using tithing money for the athletic programs I could be persuaded to be more sympathetic to the spiritual element.

[jay santos]

I get what Bronco is saying and you are correct, I think his misstep was a matter of semantics. If you asked JoePa to choose between God, his children and spouse, or football, I am pretty sure he would not choose football. Most people are that way.

But such a statement by Bronco is really just an excuse. It is an excuse for losing. It is an excuse for falling short. And that bugs me. Just as you would never admit to your boss that your job isn't your top priority, nor should Bronco be saying stuff like that. It reflects an inner mindset and attiude that I don't like. The one thing about LaVell that always annoyed me besides those rad checkered gabardine slacks he would wear on game day was his "Win your Conference, go to a Bowl game" mantra. I remember an interview with Bobby Bowden once wherein he stated to the effect, "at FSU, our goal every year is to win the national championship. It isn't to win the conferece or to go to a bowl game. We aren't satisfied with those things." It would be nice to hear that sort of talk from BYU coaches.

Finally a relevant post from DDD. Good job.

This reasoning is the exact kind I have, and why I'm frustrated with BYU football right now.

[Goatnapper'96]

Why the need to state these things at BYU. I maintain it is for the same reason the father in the ward tells his kids he doesn't make as much money as the other father because he, "puts his family and church first".

It very well could be my personality and that is why I pick up on it. I have always been big on don't tell me how smart, good, rich or talented you are. I am smart enough to figure it out for myself.

WE all know their are two constituencies one has to appeal to at BYU. The religious element and the football fan element. The clash comes when the religious element feels their right to ask for things comes from their spiritualness. You then have those who actually fund the program who feel much like they would an investment they put money into. They don't want the company telling people their charitable goals are more important than making stockholders money.

If we were using tithing money for the athletic programs I could be persuaded to be more sympathetic to the spiritual element.

The issue comes down to one thing. Utah had such a great year. If Utah had lost to TCU there would not be near the bit from donors who want wins as there is. That is not to say that Bronco did not have some huge PR issues this past year, but all in all and in comparison to BYU historically it was a good year. Bronco has had 3 straight good years. In many ways those of us who understand the sport are relatively impressed that given his defensive woes he might have actually overachieved, but being in Utah's shadow is not something BYU fans can tolerate.

Saying all that if there are genuinely players concerned about football not being a priority then I am concerned. But Mendenhall strikes me as someone who gets "it," and I doubt he will be too pridefull to not tweak things in areas that are issues.

He can say all he wants about football, priorities or firesides. The proof is in the pudding and when one removes oneself from the chill of Utah's shadow the year was not a bad year for BYU football. Certainly it didn't meet the expectations with all the returning talent on offense, it didn't meet the hype and the team failed to show up in some big games. Not showing up in big games in a year you practice less is not a wise move for a coach to make. Stating that football is not a priority publicly after getting annhilated by your rival is a similar stupid PR move. Having your team perform in big games like the big games are not a priority follows the same similar pattern of stupidity. But in the end when one recognizes who and what BYU is, and what the body of evidence for year 2008 is it wasn't a bad year....save those damn Utes had such a fabulous one.

Regardless, I tend to think Mendenhall cares very deeply and I am interested to see how he and his team react to the disapointment of 2008. I believe in the guy as long as it really is his priority to win. If these same issues are obvious next year, I will probably begin to wonder like many of you.

[jay santos]

In many ways those of us who understand the sport are relatively impressed that given his defensive woes he might have actually overachieved, but being in Utah's shadow is not something BYU fans can tolerate.

Come on, Goat. The smart guys believe Mendenhall overachieved, and the dumb guys are dissatisfied?

[TripletDaddy]

If we were using tithing money for the athletic programs I could be persuaded to be more sympathetic to the spiritual element.

This is the hammer smashing the nail on the head.

The football team is entirely self-funded through revenue and donations, zero tithing.

I don't want to concede the religious aspect when it comes to football. Why would I donate money to a charity that tells me that the stated goals of the charity are actually fairly low on the priority list?

[Goatnapper'96]

Finally a relevant post from DDD. Good job.

This reasoning is the exact kind I have, and why I'm frustrated with BYU football right now.

I don't think it is an excuse when it is the same mantra he has been publicly stating from day 1. The difference was that it was the first time when there was available evidence that the rhetoric was reality. When he said that before and went out and went undefeated in the conference, won a bowl game and led the team to a top 25 ranking we all chuckled about how he was pacifying the mullahs. The difference was that there were performances on the field of play that appeared like football was not the priority we felt it should be. That was what changed. My belief is that next year Mendenhall's rhetoric will be similar but I am hopefull the performance on the field will once again leave me chuckling at how he pretends to be a monkey so he can catch a monkey.

[Goatnapper'96]

Come on, Goat. The smart guys believe Mendenhall overachieved, and the dumb guys are dissatisfied?

I think there is merit to the overachieving. I saw plenty of Edwards teams with similar offenses to this year and similar defenses who did not only lose to the good teams on the schedule. The issue to me is not so much in Mendenhall's coaching as it was in recruiting. It is his job to make sure that the talent level at LB, a position that BYU should be able to consistently provide adequate talent, is not as poor as it was this past year. The mistake IMO was not recognizing this issue and heading it off in 2006 and 2007.

[TripletDaddy]

I think there is merit to the overachieving. I saw plenty of Edwards teams with similar offenses to this year and similar defenses who did not only lose to the good teams on the schedule. The issue to me is not so much in Mendenhall's coaching as it was in recruiting. It is his job to make sure that the talent level at LB, a position that BYU should be able to consistently provide adequate talent, is not as poor as it was this past year. The mistake IMO was not recognizing this issue and heading it off in 2006 and 2007.

Just at LB?

Howard thanks you for your kindness.

[SeattleUte]

I gotta say that, although I haven't read the quote in its context (having only seen it here), I respect Bronco more for this approach. Let's be honest: football is not the most important thing in life, especially for people who consider mortality some kind of probationary period leading up to a happily-ever-after.

Maybe Bronco could have been more nuanced - football is priority number one during practice and games - or explained his position better (for the sake of fundraising, at least), but I respect this approach from a religious school. Ideally, a school would produce good students, good citizens, good spouses/parents, good church-members, and good football players, but Bronco is just putting it all into perspective.

It's a gutsy position that many people don't agree with, and I'm glad he's not coaching my favorite team, but at least Bronco is a man of principle. I find that commendable.

Triplet and Goatnapper nailed it. It wasn't a gutsy statement. It was a stupid statement. It's the kind of thing you say after annihilating your rival and expressing humble gratitude for your good fortune.

It's not the kind of thing you say shivering in the chill of Utah's giant shadow. That sounds like an excuse.

Crais Esherick, who graduated from Georgetown law school and was John Thompson Jr.'s successor and JT III's predecessor, made a very similar statement once. He said in effect, "You know what, the administration loves me, because all our kids graduate and go on to graduate schools; Georgetwon is about academics not basketball and this is what they want. I'm here to stay." The alumni (some of them fat cats who help build library additions and student centers) went absolutely crazy. They wanted to tear him limb from limb. They wanted to cave his head in; kill him. Seriously. He was fired within the same week.

[Goatnapper'96]

Just at LB?

Howard thanks you for your kindness.

I believe that for BYU the cornerbacks were adequate. I have seen BYU put good college football teams on the field with similar cb play. The safeties were poor, but I still believe that if BYU had its normal stout LB play across all 4 LBs this team would have been much better. The point is that for BYU to be successful its LBs are going to have to routinely be good enough to compensate for average defensive backfield. That is how the defensive system is designed because it is more likely for BYU to recruit linebackers that are good than it that they will recruit cornerbacks that are average. In fact I think next year's defensive secondary is going to be average but the LBs concern me. I think next year's defensive secondary will be as good if not better than the 2006 or 2007 secondaries.

[creekster]

Crais Esherick, who graduated from Georgetown law school and was John Thompson Jr.'s successor and JT III's predecessor, made a very similar statement once. He said in effect, "You know what, the administration loves me, because all our kids graduate and go on to graduate schools; Georgetwon is about academics not basketball and this is what they want. I'm here to stay." The alumni (some of them fat cats who help build library additions and student centers) went absolutely crazy. They wanted to tear him limb from limb. They wanted to cave his head in; kill him. Seriously. He was fired within the same week.

I guess you would agree, then, that you don't need to be very smart to graduate from G-town LS.

[byu71]

The issue comes down to one thing. Utah had such a great year. If Utah had lost to TCU there would not be near the bit from donors who want wins as there is. That is not to say that Bronco did not have some huge PR issues this past year, but all in all and in comparison to BYU historically it was a good year. Bronco has had 3 straight good years. In many ways those of us who understand the sport are relatively impressed that given his defensive woes he might have actually overachieved, but being in Utah's shadow is not something BYU fans can tolerate.

Saying all that if there are genuinely players concerned about football not being a priority then I am concerned. But Mendenhall strikes me as someone who gets "it," and I doubt he will be too pridefull to not tweak things in areas that are issues.

He can say all he wants about football, priorities or firesides. The proof is in the pudding and when one removes oneself from the chill of Utah's shadow the year was not a bad year for BYU football. Certainly it didn't meet the expectations with all the returning talent on offense, it didn't meet the hype and the team failed to show up in some big games. Not showing up in big games in a year you practice less is not a wise move for a coach to make. Stating that football is not a priority publicly after getting annhilated by your rival is a similar stupid PR move. Having your team perform in big games like the big games are not a priority follows the same similar pattern of stupidity. But in the end when one recognizes who and what BYU is, and what the body of evidence for year 2008 is it wasn't a bad year....save those damn Utes had such a fabulous one.

Regardless, I tend to think Mendenhall cares very deeply and I am interested to see how he and his team react to the disapointment of 2008. I believe in the guy as long as it really is his priority to win. If these same issues are obvious next year, I will probably begin to wonder like many of you.

Amongst my friends, no one is even close to calling for Bronco's head. The conversation about play calling and practice time is pretty mute too. We have been saying for a couple of years we think the religion thing is a little overboard, but who cares, so far it seems magic does happen. Well the play down football and play up the mission of BYU on and off the field, remember quest for perfection is about off the field, increased this year and the team didn't get better. As a matter of fact, those non spiritual, off the field bad guys had the magic happen this year.

Bronco's body of work to the present and including last year has him in good stead. Just a little of the, we will put the soldiers of God on the field and they will bring us victory, has taken a bit of a hit.

[SeattleUte]

I guess you would agree, then, that you don't need to be very smart to graduate from G-town LS.

Every school has its dumb graduates, even Harvard. He's one of GU Law's. He said, "I ain't going anywhere -- I may be here for another 30 years." I think he was gone the next day.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Esherick