NBA 2012-2013

[MarkGrace]

Every star in the league whines like mad. Hard to hate a dude based on that.

[FN Phat]

Every star in the league whines like mad. Hard to hate a dude based on that.

I agree but Timmy's body of work is second to none

[Pheidippides]

I agree but Timmy's body of work is second to none

It's the damn Large Marge googly eyes that get me.

[MartyFunkhouser]

I tend to root for LBJ as well. In fact, I've wondered sometimes why I'm such a fan of his. The best I can come up with is that it annoys me that so many basketball fans don't seem to appreciate what they have in him. I can sort of understand why the Funks of the world don't like him as a personality, but from a strictly basketball perspective, if we could create a basketball player, most of us would create something close to the following:

LeBron James

1) an athletic freak of nature
2) big and strong
3) excellent work ethic
4) high basketball IQ
5) a student of the game
6) an prolific scorer
7) an efficient scorer - (57% FGs)
8) a guy who is accurate from long range (41% 3pt)
9) a guy who rebounds
10) a willing and skilled passer who sets teammates up for easy shots
11) a guy who plays hard on both ends of the court
12) a guy who is a great defensive player
13) defends multiple positions
14) is unselfish
15) stays out of trouble off the court
16) a great FT shooter (19 out of 20 isn't bad)
17) a leader
18) clutch (leading scorer in NBA history in elimination games and game 7s)
19) consistent in his production and effort
20) can effectively play every position on the floor on offense and defense

Essentially, LeBron is as perfect a player as we've ever seen and there is a fairly significant portion of basketball fans who simply don't recognize it.

The only major flaw in his game I can think of is that he could be a better FT shooter.

I'll speak for the Bron Bron haters here. Bron Bron is the best player in the game right now. The debate right now is who is the 2nd best player, because no one really is playing at his level. I also think that when his career is over that he is going to be the 2nd best player of all time.

Here is the issue that I have when people are talking about his game, I disagree that he is the most perfect player that we have ever seen. Bron Bron has faults. He has quit in series when his team is down (Cavs v. Celtics), he has completely disappeared in series (Heat v. Mavs). His unselfishness also sometimes has become a problem. The guy seems so obsessed with proving himself to be different and a "good guy" (when he is very far from a good guy) that he sometimes hurts his team. If he just realized he is an asshole and embraced it, he would be a better player. Both Jordan and Bryant did this.

There tends to be binary thinking with Bron Bron it is either all his fault or never his fault. The truth is somewhere in the middle and it drives me nuts when people can't acknowledge when he has played poorly or let his team down.

The perfect player was Michael Jordan and I'm no Jordan fan either.

[smokymountainrain]

I'll speak for the Bron Bron haters here. Bron Bron is the best player in the game right now. The debate right now is who is the 2nd best player, because no one really is playing at his level. I also think that when his career is over that he is going to be the 2nd best player of all time.

Here is the issue that I have when people are talking about his game, I disagree that he is the most perfect player that we have ever seen. Bron Bron has faults. He has quit in series when his team is down (Cavs v. Celtics), he has completely disappeared in series (Heat v. Mavs). His unselfishness also sometimes has become a problem. The guy seems so obsessed with proving himself to be different and a "good guy" (when he is very far from a good guy) that he sometimes hurts his team. If he just realized he is an asshole and embraced it, he would be a better player. Both Jordan and Bryant did this.

There tends to be binary thinking with Bron Bron it is either all his fault or never his fault. The truth is somewhere in the middle and it drives me nuts when people can't acknowledge when he has played poorly or let his team down.

The perfect player was Michael Jordan and I'm no Jordan fan either.

If his faults are that he has bad games, even bad series, I agree. He is not a perfect player, of course. Even MJ wasn't perfect. But from a standpoint of consistent production, skill set and athleticism, it's hard to find any faults.

The two faults you mention:

1) disappearing against Mavs and "quitting" against Cs.
One of the things that is great about LeBron is that he is continously improving, breaking down his game and getting better. That's something that makes him the "perfect" player if you were to create a guy. Both of those "faults" happened 2+ years ago. I believe he saw those same things and worked his ass off both mentally and physically to ensure that doesn't happen again. If he loses tonight, he will go right back to the drawing board and fix whatever needs to be fixed. Again, from a basketball purists perspective, this makes him special.

Too unselfish:

First off, he while it's just one time, he is in fact, a champion now, working towards a second one, so whatever he's doing in this regard, it is working. Also, you're criticizing a guy who, despite not being known as a scorer in the same vein as MJ, Kobe, Carmelo, Durant, etc, is the leading scorer in NBA history in game 7s and elimination games. The point being, that despite having more facilitator in him than all those other guys and constantly being criticized for being too unselfish, when the stakes are highest, he scores more than they do. IOW, despite his reputation in the media and with some fans, the numbers and now success, simply doesn't support it.

Again, I want to stress I don't think he is perfect, nor do I think he the best of all time (I think we still have to say MJ is better), but from in terms of his attitude, work ethic, skill set, size athleticism, consistent effort and production, it's hard to find faults overall.

[clackamascoug]

I have a hard time separating players from their person. If you're going to have two children with a woman.... marry her! What the hell... you still want to fool around with other women because "you're not married" while you've got two kids at home wondering where you are?"

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

The too unselfish line is something that just baffles me. Too unselfish according to who? Us? Internet experts? For all intents and purposes, he has been his teams' point guard since he entered the league. And yet he has the 3rd highest career PPG in NBA history, and the 5th highest playoff ppg in history. But he's too unselfish in clutch situations, right? No. Complete malarky. The actual data, not contrived and jaded opinions formed by fans who have to be force fed their takes by unprepared and biased media, says James should be known as a cold killer in clutch situations, relative to pretty much everyone not named Jordan. And not only does he shoot much, much better, and more often, in clutch situations than he is given credit for, he also has set up his teammates, often mediocre teammates, in those same situations better than any other star that we have similar data for.

What do we think James should do differently? Drive willy-nilly into the teeth of the SA defense when breakdown clearly shows 4 defenders with a foot planted in the lane? Just shoot long jumpers when his shot is off, just for the sake of being aggressive? The guy is one of the greatest scorers in NBA history who happens to also use that to put the defense in a position where they leave his teammates open for very good shots. Just because LeBron is LeBron, is a contested 5 foot runner in the lane with 3 defenders around a higher percentage shot than Ray Allen in the corner for three?

And that doesn't even scratch the surface for what he gives his team on the court. Is it unselfish of him to bust his tail more than any other superstar on the defensive end? Should he be more selfish like Carmelo, Durant, Kobe, etc. and just coast on defense, so he has more energy to take crappy shots on offense? Selfish jerk trying to win defensive player of the year while also being the best offensive player in the league. Pompous, arrogant jerk that guy.

I've almost completely written that Magic Johnson guy off. He smiled way too much, tried to be the nice guy and have everyone like him, and he passed WAY too much. But at least he wasn't dumb enough to play any defense. He was selfish and saved that energy for offense. That is really what separates him and helps make him a legend and totally likable.

[The_Douger]

That about sums it up for me.

Nice analysis.

[MartyFunkhouser]

The actual data, not contrived and jaded opinions formed by fans who have to be force fed their takes by unprepared and biased media, says James should be known as a cold killer in clutch situations, relative to pretty much everyone not named Jordan. And not only does he shoot much, much better, and more often, in clutch situations than he is given credit for, he also has set up his teammates, often mediocre teammates, in those same situations better than any other star that we have similar data for.

I think that Bron Bron has developed into a clutch player over the past couple of years. This criticism of him as a player is completely outdated and not based on what he has done both this year and last year. Unless Bron Bron completes falls apart tonight, he will not be responsible for the loss. Plus, he is THE reason why the Heat are a great team. He has been amazing the past 2 years.

However, he did have serious issues against the Mavs 2-years ago. I have never seen a player that good get shut down that completely. He was a non-factor. Yes, the Mavs had a great plan, but nothing should turn the best player into the world into what Bron Bron showed in that series. At that time, the criticism was valid.

I will also be completely baffled that he continues to get a pass for his time in Cleveland. His impatience and forcing of terrible personnel moves to get washed up players with ridiculous contracts is what made him have a mediocre supporting cast. He was the de-facto GM in Cleveland. If he had some patience and let them build around him, he probably gets a championship in Cleveland before heading off with the super friends in Miami. I have never seen a player destroy a franchise for a longer period of time than he did in Cleveland.

And that doesn't even scratch the surface for what he gives his team on the court. Is it unselfish of him to bust his tail more than any other superstar on the defensive end? Should he be more selfish like Carmelo, Durant, Kobe, etc. and just coast on defense, so he has more energy to take crappy shots on offense? Selfish jerk trying to win defensive player of the year while also being the best offensive player in the league. Pompous, arrogant jerk that guy.

He is a pompous, arrogant jerk for a lot a reasons, but not because of how he plays the game of basketball. The way he plays the game of basketball is a thing of beauty.

[FN Phat]

Both teams sloppy with the ball to start off with (see: Allen) but shaped up to be a nice first half. Wade is looking in rhythm, sparked by solid defense. Leonard an obsolete beast on the boards. I am loving his game. He almost flushed a big dunk going baseline. Love his hustle. Should be an exciting second half.

[il Padrino Ute]

Both teams sloppy with the ball to start off with (see: Allen) but shaped up to be a nice first half. Wade is looking in rhythm, sparked by solid defense. Leonard an obsolete beast on the boards. I am loving his game. He almost flushed a big dunk going baseline. Love his hustle. Should be an exciting second half.

If he's obsolete, why is he on the floor? It seems that he would be a detriment to the team.

[FN Phat]

If he's obsolete, why is he on the floor? It seems that he would be a detriment to the team.

Dammit. I expect that from d-hole but you too ilPad?

[BGRTHNUMEGO]

Home teams are 14-3 in Game 7 in the Finals. But I wonder how many times those home teams were out shot at the FT line by 12 in the 1st half.

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

Wade came to play. Danny Green is as bad tonight as be was awesome earlier in the series, yikes.

[il Padrino Ute]

Dammit. I expect that from d-hole but you too ilPad?

Sorry, friend. But when a belt high fastball like that is thrown right over the plate, what can I do?