Davies vs Miles

[jay santos]

I saw the thread on CB K-Dog was posting in on this. Here's my opinion.

They're completely different players. Miles is the typical big white stiff BYU is used to having as a center. Davies is the kind of center you see playing for a smaller athletic team like a UNLV or SDSU.

Davies has better moves. Davies has utilized more moves over the past two games than I've seen from Miles ever. The main difference being the jump hook and a little Kareem sky hook he pulled off last night. They both use the turn around bank shot and the rock your man to the middle/drop step. Davies has better footwork right now. He can get a lot better, but it doesn't take much in the way of footwork to beat Miles. Davies also looks like he has more range, being confident to knock down the free throw jumper or turn and face the basket with the ball.

Davies is a much better rebounder. He's nimble with long arms and can jump quickly.

Davies runs the floor better and creates a different dynamic with an athletic running big man that BYU's not used to having.

Though Davies has some offensive moves and a more aggressive mindset, he's not shown the ability to finish these shots AT ALL. And he's looked silly a lot bricking three foot jump hooks. He also will be turnover prone as he's just a little too aggressive for his own good right now.

Miles is smarter and more mature. He takes less risks and is less aggressive than Davies and therefore makes less mistakes.

Miles is a better passer and is more court aware. Davies only made one good pass and that was to an open Jimmer for a 3 because the coaches were SCREAMING at him to pass it back out.

Miles is a much better defender, being able to use his height and strength to keep posts off the block and body them up when they get the ball. Davies will be abused by skilled college big man right now.

Miles is a better player right now, but it will not take long for Davies to pass him. It's possible he even does it this year if Rose pushes him and allows him the PT to make mistakes and get better. But most likely it won't be until next season, as Harstock will justify minutes and Davies will likely be forgotten.

I'm very bullish on Davies, just not quite yet probably. Makes me wish Kaufusi was playing for BYU BB as he owned Davies in high school.

[WashingtonCoug]

Miles is a much better defender, being able to use his height and strength to keep posts off the block and body them up when they get the ball. Davies will be abused by skilled college big man right now.

Miles is a better player right now, but it will not take long for Davies to pass him. It's possible he even does it this year if Rose pushes him and allows him the PT to make mistakes and get better. But most likely it won't be until next season, as Harstock will justify minutes and Davies will likely be forgotten.

I think Miles is the better option to win games this year, but Davies will be miles (haha!) ahead when he finishes his college career. Davies has all the physical attributes. He just needs experience.

[Goatnapper'96]

I saw the thread on CB K-Dog was posting in on this. Here's my opinion.

They're completely different players. Miles is the typical big white stiff BYU is used to having as a center. Davies is the kind of center you see playing for a smaller athletic team like a UNLV or SDSU.

Davies has better moves. Davies has utilized more moves over the past two games than I've seen from Miles ever. The main difference being the jump hook and a little Kareem sky hook he pulled off last night. They both use the turn around bank shot and the rock your man to the middle/drop step. Davies has better footwork right now. He can get a lot better, but it doesn't take much in the way of footwork to beat Miles. Davies also looks like he has more range, being confident to knock down the free throw jumper or turn and face the basket with the ball.

Davies is a much better rebounder. He's nimble with long arms and can jump quickly.

Davies runs the floor better and creates a different dynamic with an athletic running big man that BYU's not used to having.

Though Davies has some offensive moves and a more aggressive mindset, he's not shown the ability to finish these shots AT ALL. And he's looked silly a lot bricking three foot jump hooks. He also will be turnover prone as he's just a little too aggressive for his own good right now.

Miles is smarter and more mature. He takes less risks and is less aggressive than Davies and therefore makes less mistakes.

Miles is a better passer and is more court aware. Davies only made one good pass and that was to an open Jimmer for a 3 because the coaches were SCREAMING at him to pass it back out.

Miles is a much better defender, being able to use his height and strength to keep posts off the block and body them up when they get the ball. Davies will be abused by skilled college big man right now.

Miles is a better player right now, but it will not take long for Davies to pass him. It's possible he even does it this year if Rose pushes him and allows him the PT to make mistakes and get better. But most likely it won't be until next season, as Harstock will justify minutes and Davies will likely be forgotten.

I'm very bullish on Davies, just not quite yet probably. Makes me wish Kaufusi was playing for BYU BB as he owned Davies in high school.

I think Davies will be very similar to Trent Plaisted. Perhaps he will have more offensive range and be a little better in a halfcourt set, but I see most of his points in transition and by beating the opposing bigs down the court. If he develops the inside skill of say Keena Young, he is likely to make a lot of money playing basketball professionally somewhere. If he doesn't he is likely to bounce around European/Asian leagues and make a decent living. I still think a redshirt year would serve him best but my guess is redshirting Plaisted might have done Plaisted some good but the program probably would have benefited more if he had played as a true freshman as then BYU would have gotten 4 years out of him instead of 3. My guess is that is a concern Rose has is that perhaps he thinks that once Davies develops he will jump to some pro contract after 4 years at BYU, regardless if his elgibility has been used or not.

I also think that Provo High's system did not play to Davies' strengths. Drury runs a very organized and disciplined half court game. Davies' strengths are better suited to BYU transition style of play. I think that most who watched Davies play AAU ball could see his potential and many who watched him play for Provo High could see his struggles....but athleticism is something that cannot be coached.

I think he plays and my guess is by conference play he touches the court less and less, barring injuries.

[KillerDog]

I haven't decided yet. I have not seen enough Davies. In my experience, fans are generally given to over excitement regarding young talent. They see potential as ability and want to cast aside a person who does good things but has been doing them for a while. In a few games, I will decide if Davies is better than Miles. For now, I'll rest soundly knowing that many thought Andersen was better than Miles last year.

I appreciate your analysis because it shows that you are thinking of the issues that make a big man. Miles is an excellent post defender. He passes well. He doesn't take a lot of shots (this is a positive on a team like ours where there aren't enough balls for all the shots guys want to take). He boxes out as well as anyone I've seen. He sets excellent screens. At the same time, he has small hands which hurt his abilit to finish in traffic, catch on the move, and rebound. He uses his arms to jump. He doesn't have his feet set when he catches the ball. He posts up with his butt instead of his hip. He has good feet and good footwork in some circumstances but terrible footwork in others. Basically, he is a similar or better player than 95% of the college bigs in the country.

[WashingtonCoug]

Is there any chance that Keena could come coach at BYU? I'm not sure I've seen better footwork by a low post player than Keena. How short was he? If Keena Young can play in the post at his height, imagine how good Davies could be.

[jay santos]

Is there any chance that Keena could come coach at BYU? I'm not sure I've seen better footwork by a low post player than Keena. How short was he? If Keena Young can play in the post at his height, imagine how good Davies could be.

Keena was coached by someone at BYU. He didn't have the post moves when he came here.

[jay santos]

I think Davies will be very similar to Trent Plaisted. Perhaps he will have more offensive range and be a little better in a halfcourt set, but I see most of his points in transition and by beating the opposing bigs down the court. If he develops the inside skill of say Keena Young, he is likely to make a lot of money playing basketball professionally somewhere. If he doesn't he is likely to bounce around European/Asian leagues and make a decent living. I still think a redshirt year would serve him best but my guess is redshirting Plaisted might have done Plaisted some good but the program probably would have benefited more if he had played as a true freshman as then BYU would have gotten 4 years out of him instead of 3. My guess is that is a concern Rose has is that perhaps he thinks that once Davies develops he will jump to some pro contract after 4 years at BYU, regardless if his elgibility has been used or not.

I also think that Provo High's system did not play to Davies' strengths. Drury runs a very organized and disciplined half court game. Davies' strengths are better suited to BYU transition style of play. I think that most who watched Davies play AAU ball could see his potential and many who watched him play for Provo High could see his struggles....but athleticism is something that cannot be coached.

I think he plays and my guess is by conference play he touches the court less and less, barring injuries.

I don't think anyone can be compared to Plaisted. He had top 1 percentile athleticism and bottom 1 percentile IQ. He's one of a kind.

[KillerDog]

I don't think anyone can be compared to Plaisted. He had top 1 percentile athleticism and bottom 1 percentile IQ. He's one of a kind.

LOL! He was definitely athletically gifted. I don't know if his IQ was the problem or if it was an inability to change when the shit hit the fan. Every year he would start the year with new post moves and improved technique. By the end of the year each year he had regressed to his fall back moves and techniques.

[WashingtonCoug]

Keena was coached by someone at BYU. He didn't have the post moves when he came here.

Does anyone know if that coach is there still? Who was the big man coach back then? Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying the coaches aren't good. I think they have excellent coaches. I'm just saying Keena Young definitely got it.

It could be that Keena just wanted it more than others. It's possible that he has put in the time that others didn't care to do.

[jay santos]

Does anyone know if that coach is there still? Who was the big man coach back then? Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying the coaches aren't good. I think they have excellent coaches. I'm just saying Keena Young definitely got it.

It could be that Keena just wanted it more than others. It's possible that he has put in the time that others didn't care to do.

It's perplexing to me also. I don't know who coached Keena or how he developed, but he is the model for how to develop post moves. I'm curious myself which coach is most attributable for his progression, or if it was just an inner thing. I point to Keena as evidence that BYU can and has developed big men, but I'm not sure exactly who's responsible.

[cougjunkie]

Does anyone know if that coach is there still? Who was the big man coach back then? Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying the coaches aren't good. I think they have excellent coaches. I'm just saying Keena Young definitely got it.

It could be that Keena just wanted it more than others. It's possible that he has put in the time that others didn't care to do.

The big man coach back then was Walter Roese who went to San Diego and is now at Nebraska. The big man coach currently is Terry Nashif

[jay santos]

The big man coach back then was Walter Roese who went to San Diego and is now at Nebraska. The big man coach currently is Terry Nashif

It would be nice to get Roese back if there was a way. The Brazilian pipeline was good for us while he was here.

[KillerDog]

The big man coach back then was Walter Roese who went to San Diego and is now at Nebraska. The big man coach currently is Terry Nashif

Nashif has our big men rely too much on shooting ability to get points. They don't focus enough on leverage, angles, and footwork. Basically, he is teaching them to get a good look over the defender's hands. Good interior offense isn't about looks over hands, it is about looks to the side of hands.

[smokymountainrain]

Nashif has our big men rely too much on shooting ability to get points. They don't focus enough on leverage, angles, and footwork. Basically, he is teaching them to get a good look over the defender's hands. Good interior offense isn't about looks over hands, it is about looks to the side of hands.

In other words, he's teaching them to play soft.

Good interior offense about those things you mentioned, establishing great position close to the hoop, crashing the offensive glass, running the floor, moving without the ball, once you've established position, muscling your opponent even closer to the hoop...in essence, good interior offense is about getting as many shots within 3 feet/lay-ups/dunks as possible. It is not about getting jumpshots over outstretched hands.

[WashingtonCoug]

Nashif has our big men rely too much on shooting ability to get points. They don't focus enough on leverage, angles, and footwork. Basically, he is teaching them to get a good look over the defender's hands. Good interior offense isn't about looks over hands, it is about looks to the side of hands.

The sad thing is neither Miles or Plaisted have been able to develop any kind of any outside shot. So if that is what Nashif is teaching them, he has failed in that aspect.