On abortion

[Northwestcoug]

Sometimes I think the gestational period for legal abortion should be raised to approximately 18 years after birth.

You might find broad-based support for that. It’s well within the first trimester of life.

[All-American]

Sometimes I think the gestational period for legal abortion should be raised to approximately 18 years after birth.

[Moliere]

The talking point that the democrats should have concentrated on abortion instead of the ACA has almost become truth on social media. It is not, true. It's as if no one remembers how tenuous the 60 votes democrats had when debating it. Doesn't anyone remember the election of Scott Brown in Massachusetts that threatened to upend their filibuster proof majority, and the 'perfidy' of Harry Reid when he played cute with senate laws and passed ACA piece by piece? No? Well I do. I was so enraged with the democrats that I mailed 40 dollars to the RNC that day. And I paid dearly for that; I got RNC mail for the next decade asking for money

And everyone seems to forget that it wasn't just the senate; Pelosi had to work with the conservative wing of her party to make sure she had the votes. Guess what had to be sacrificed in the house to ensure passage? Increasing funding for abortion. So yeah, the idea that the dumb dems should have codified Roe v Wade into law rather than pass the ACA is pretty much fiction.

Here's a helpful guide for future reference:

https://khn.org/news/obamacares-hist...eriences-text/

And even if is was true that the democrats missed a golden opportunity to pass a national abortion law, it's still a stupid argument. There was little realistic reason to think Roe v Wade would be overturned, at that time ~30 years after the decision. It's just a dumb argument. Here's a similar analogy: congress should have foreseen the threat Trump would play in the future with the vagaries of the electoral college, and should have pushed for changes to shore up the law to prevent what happened in 2020.

I agree it’s dumb. I don’t point it out as I think it’s a viable scenario. I bring it up because it’s great evidence to show that support isn’t there with a supermajority not is it there for a simple majority. The support isn’t there regardless of how many people say that most Americans support abortion. Sure, a major Rory of Americans support limited abortion rights, but democrats don’t want to pass limited abortion rights.

[Northwestcoug]

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Andrew Yang gets it.

The talking point that the democrats should have concentrated on abortion instead of the ACA has almost become truth on social media. It is not, true. It's as if no one remembers how tenuous the 60 votes democrats had when debating it. Doesn't anyone remember the election of Scott Brown in Massachusetts that threatened to upend their filibuster proof majority, and the 'perfidy' of Harry Reid when he played cute with senate laws and passed ACA piece by piece? No? Well I do. I was so enraged with the democrats that I mailed 40 dollars to the RNC that day. And I paid dearly for that; I got RNC mail for the next decade asking for money

And everyone seems to forget that it wasn't just the senate; Pelosi had to work with the conservative wing of her party to make sure she had the votes. Guess what had to be sacrificed in the house to ensure passage? Increasing funding for abortion. So yeah, the idea that the dumb dems should have codified Roe v Wade into law rather than pass the ACA is pretty much fiction.

Here's a helpful guide for future reference:

https://khn.org/news/obamacares-hist...eriences-text/

And even if is was true that the democrats missed a golden opportunity to pass a national abortion law, it's still a stupid argument. There was little realistic reason to think Roe v Wade would be overturned, at that time ~30 years after the decision. It's just a dumb argument. Here's a similar analogy: congress should have foreseen the threat Trump would play in the future with the vagaries of the electoral college, and should have pushed for changes to shore up the law to prevent what happened in 2020.

[Moliere]

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Andrew Yang gets it.

[The_Tick]

Ted....your online persona is pretty insufferable.

[Uncle Ted]

Now the GOP'ers and liberals both hate Liz Cheney:

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She is a woman without a country.

[Uncle Ted]

Most European countries allow abortions in demand up to 14 weeks or around there. A 15 week ban on abortion would be right in line with Europe. It’s not crazy conservative to want a ban on abortion after 15 weeks, in fact it puts us squarely in the same group as those European atheist socialists.

But of course the liberals will make a ban on abortion after 15 weeks to sound like we are rounding up women and putting them into communes.

Yeah, it is 14 weeks in France yet Macaroni said this:

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C'mon man!

And the big dummy to the north said this:

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When his citizens travel to the US (or did travel to the US) for abortions:

Those who are this far into their pregnancy and looking for an abortion often travel to the United States for the procedure instead, which would be in jeopardy should Roe v. Wade be overturned.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/what-i...nada-1.5890266

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[Uncle Ted]

Well, at least there is this

So y'all in Utah are good if you need an abortion fix (and need to restock on weed)... You can go either east or west:



Us in Texas will have to travel a bit more.

[USUC]

Yeah, maybe Plan B access is in danger in Utah...


https://www.sltrib.com/news/politics...ublicans-take/

Well, at least there is this

Lisonbee said she does not foresee lawmakers taking additional steps to prevent women from traveling to other states where abortion is still legal, as Utah’s law punishes abortion providers, not pregnant women.
“I don’t think there’s any contemplation that we would try to control a woman’s ability to travel or to obtain an abortion elsewhere,” Lisonbee said. “Certainly, if someone wants to do that, it’s a free country and we wouldn’t be the type of authoritarian government that would prevent that.”

[Uncle Ted]

Moving away from the decision SCOTUS itself, what does the political fight look like now? I think this will be the classic dog that caught the car scenario for pro lifers. It's going to be nearly impossible to enforce what they want.

For Utah in particular, how does this shake out? Is Plan B access in danger now? Will they attempt to prosecute residents who go to other states for abortions? I kind of think Cox will prevent a Texas or Louisiana sitation hsppening here, but who knows now.

Yeah, maybe Plan B access is in danger in Utah...

GOP lawmaker says she trusts Utah women to control their ‘intake of semen’ as abortion trigger law goes into effect
Utah Senate President Stuart Adams said he would support the Supreme Court also reconsidering same-sex marriage.

Republican lawmakers and Utah politicos celebrated the Supreme Court’s decision to overturn Roe v. Wade on Friday, with one legislator saying she trusted Utah women “to control [their] intake of semen.”
[...]

https://www.sltrib.com/news/politics...ublicans-take/

[Uncle Ted]

Most European countries allow abortions in demand up to 14 weeks or around there. A 15 week ban on abortion would be right in line with Europe. It’s not crazy conservative to want a ban on abortion after 15 weeks, in fact it puts us squarely in the same group as those European atheist socialists.

But of course the liberals will make a ban on abortion after 15 weeks to sound like we are rounding up women and putting them into communes.

Yeah, the right to abort someone should be longer than just the first trimester... There are some liberals running around that should have been aborted in the first 14 weeks that could use to be aborted now. Better late than never.

[Northwestcoug]

Most European countries allow abortions in demand up to 14 weeks or around there. A 15 week ban on abortion would be right in line with Europe. It’s not crazy conservative to want a ban on abortion after 15 weeks, in fact it puts us squarely in the same group as those European atheist socialists.

But of course the liberals will make a ban on abortion after 15 weeks to sound like we are rounding up women and putting them into communes.

This has been said before, but even though most European countries technically have a 2nd trimester ban, a lot of them do not enforce it that rigidly. In reality they are closer to the US.

very soon we’ll see just how important the whole ‘let the states decide their own abortion laws’ is to the GOP. And by that I mean we’ll see the lie revealed. They will continue to push for federal abortion restrictions, and the most vocal pro life contingent will never be happy until a near total ban is in place. I’m not saying that’s going to happen (well, very unlikely to happen in case Clark is reading this 10 years from now). But if you were tired of the culture wars before, buckle up.

[Moliere]

What are the abortion laws like in other (non-China) countries?

Most European countries allow abortions in demand up to 14 weeks or around there. A 15 week ban on abortion would be right in line with Europe. It’s not crazy conservative to want a ban on abortion after 15 weeks, in fact it puts us squarely in the same group as those European atheist socialists.

But of course the liberals will make a ban on abortion after 15 weeks to sound like we are rounding up women and putting them into communes.

[Uncle Ted]

I guess some of my liberal friends may be moving...

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