Europe's train wreck in slow motion

[EuropeanFootballMale]

Here's our chance. Let's trade Louisiana, Mississippi, West Virginia and Nevada for Greece, Italy, Spain and Portugal. I wonder how this would affect BCS realignment.

Give up 2 gumbo states? You're nuts.

[edward777]

And an increasing number of the few are now relocating to London.

Hollande is a huge problem.

Hollande is super rich himself. Of course he used the media very well to portray himself as one of the people. Romney could learn from how he did it.

Yet if I had been in France I am not entirely sure who I would have voted for. Sarkozy made corruption into an art form. He was also a modern-day Brutus. Look up how much Kadaffi did for Sarkozy and then what he did to him.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012...-2007-election

[Paperback Writer]

Here's our chance. Let's trade Louisiana, Mississippi, West Virginia and Nevada for Greece, Italy, Spain and Portugal. I wonder how this would affect BCS realignment.

You just want to swing the 2012 election for Obama. Three RED states and a possible fourth for four would-be BLUE states. And we don't even get France in the deal.

[byu71]

Real Estate and 401K plans. Both took a big hit. I think that's what is also hurting unemployment rates. People cannot afford to retire and are staying in the work force longer than planned leaving fewer openings for new college graduates and laid off workers.

My retirement is still a ways off but I thought I knew when I could retire based on historic stock market returns. Now, I just don't know.

Both took a hit, but are 401K plans still down much? Based on my experience they aren't. I will agree though plans on retirement in '07 were dramatically affected. Basically 5 years with no return isn't good for accumulating retirement assets.

[oxcoug]

Hollande is super rich himself. Of course he used the media very well to portray himself as one of the people. Romney could learn from how he did it.

Yet if I had been in France I am not entirely sure who I would have voted for. Sarkozy made corruption into an art form. He was also a modern-day Brutus. Look up how much Kadaffi did for Sarkozy and then what he did to him.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012...-2007-election

There are lots of pics of various world leaders shaking hands w/ various sketchy dictators - but is there any real evidence of Sarkozy being in that deep w/ Gadaffi?

When I read this article I see that (a) Gadaffi's son makes the allegation (super reliable source there) and (b) that the Guardian references one journalist who claims to have "seen" the documents - the article then waits until its last sentence to point out that Sarkozy's people deny the allegations.

So has any true evidence ever emerged?

As for Sarkozy making corruption an art - I'd be curious what you are referring to. Is there something other than this? Because corruption is an art in Moscow, Sofia and Bucharest - I'd say in France it's more of a gentleman's hobby.

[SeattleUte]

It's a fascinating article that confirms my belief that Alexander Hamilton was the most original, brilliant ahead of his time thinker among America's founders (Paine was no. 2).

The "Teutonic European nations'" banks were among those that over-lent to "Latin Europe". No? Why isn't it some solace to the Teutons that they are themselves substantially to blame for this mess.

Germany, for the first time in its life, needs to learn about sacrifices as well as rewards of belonging to a great multicultural nation or confederation.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I would rather not think about any European train wrecks this week.

[Moliere]

I would rather not think about any European train wrecks this week.

Now folks, this is how you do a humblebrag.

[Paperback Writer]

Both took a hit, but are 401K plans still down much? Based on my experience they aren't. I will agree though plans on retirement in '07 were dramatically affected. Basically 5 years with no return isn't good for accumulating retirement assets.

They [401K balances] were certainly down in the timeframe of the article (2007-2010). But you are correct to point out that the stock market has recovered to a large extent since 2010. More so earlier in 2012 then right now.

As you know, personal/family net worth depends on asset mix. Personally, stock market losses were more pronounced for me than real estate losses. Also, it's a lot easier to log into Fidelity to find out how much your net worth has declined then to get a real estate appraisal.

Also, a lot also depends on one's outlook. For me, my home is not really an investment in my mind although I realize it has significant value. My family needs a roof and owning a home is an alternative to renting. I don't include my home's value in my retirement planning since there's a good chance I might still live in it after I retire. So if real estate goes down 20-40%, I look at it as paying less in property taxes. Conversely, if my 401K goes down 20-40%, it means I will retire later than planned. That loss is more real to me. But that's just my situation, I realize others might be the opposite.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Now folks, this is how you do a humblebrag.

Yes! Moliere has the gift.

[edward777]

There are lots of pics of various world leaders shaking hands w/ various sketchy dictators - but is there any real evidence of Sarkozy being in that deep w/ Gadaffi?

When I read this article I see that (a) Gadaffi's son makes the allegation (super reliable source there) and (b) that the Guardian references one journalist who claims to have "seen" the documents - the article then waits until its last sentence to point out that Sarkozy's people deny the allegations.

So has any true evidence ever emerged?

As for Sarkozy making corruption an art - I'd be curious what you are referring to. Is there something other than this? Because corruption is an art in Moscow, Sofia and Bucharest - I'd say in France it's more of a gentleman's hobby.

The UK Guardian is usually pretty good about sources. Here is another article: http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/fea...142288147.html

One wonders the real reasons behind France being all too willing to kill Kadaffi with the excuse of protecting civilians. Seriously, does anyone actually believe Obama, Sarkozy and Cameron give a you-know-what about Middle Eastern people?

[oxcoug]

The UK Guardian is usually pretty good about sources.

- no offense Edward, but that's a pretty lazy comment. I've seen some very shoddy reporting from the Guardian over the years, starting when I lived in the UK for four years. But more important than source issues is the Guardian's very pronounced political bias - which is both anti-Sarkozy and anti-Cameron.

I'm sure you know that Al Jazeera isn't any better. And the fact that this story apparently doesn't get attention in any responsible centrist or center right publication is pretty telling.

One wonders the real reasons behind France being all too willing to kill Kadaffi with the excuse of protecting civilians. Seriously, does anyone actually believe Obama, Sarkozy and Cameron give a you-know-what about Middle Eastern people?

Well, first off - those three don't function as a unit or a block - in fact Sarkozy and Cameron are from political parties that sit across the aisle opposite Obama's natural allies in their respective countries.

Second - actually, yeah. I do. Why wouldn't they? What cause do you have to suggest they don't? Are you suggesting they're all just misanthropes...or?

[Moliere]

The UK Guardian is usually pretty good about sources. Here is another article: http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/fea...142288147.html

One wonders the real reasons behind France being all too willing to kill Kadaffi with the excuse of protecting civilians. Seriously, does anyone actually believe Obama, Sarkozy and Cameron give a you-know-what about Middle Eastern people?

France's history in northern Europe is quite extensive, although not so much in Libya. But when you are talking about Algeria and Morocco, France has had significant interests in those countries and, from what I understand, France gets a lot of oil from Libya. There is definitely economic interests and also interests in neighboring countries for France.

My hypothesize is that France ghostly pumped up Kadaffi for a long time as he stablized the country (and thus allowed France to trade with them) but when it became apparent Kadaffi was going down they obviously sided with the rebellion in an attempt to keep their own economic interests in tact.

[Paperback Writer]

France's history in northern Europe is quite extensive...

Well, I would hope so - it probably dates earlier than Charlemagne. I know you meant northern Africa but I couldn't resist

[Moliere]

Well, I would hope so - it probably dates earlier than Charlemagne. I know you meant northern Africa but I couldn't resist

.....I meant Northern Africa!!!

[I'm mad at myself]