Obamacare cost...

[Uncle Ted]

Obama sez:

Knowing you can offer your family the security of health care –- that’s priceless. And now you can do it for less than your cell phone bill. That’s what change looks like.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2013/09/22/remarks-president-congressional-black-caucus-foundation-phoenix-awards-d

I am going to get $30/month health care for the entire family!

[imanihonjin]

And it just continues to get worse for Obamacare. . .

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapoth...rtner=yahootix

Nobody saw this coming.

[Uncle Ted]

And it just continues to get worse for Obamacare. . .

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapoth...rtner=yahootix

Nobody saw this coming.

Is my cell phone bill going up too?

[imanihonjin]

Apparently so. Sorry man.

[All-American]

How long had Ted Cruz been going now?

[Uncle Ted]

Apparently so. Sorry man.

But what if my Obamaphone is free?

Sometimes I wished you republicans would leave us alone and let us live in this democrat dreamland for a bit. Cheap healthcare, free cell phones, and government jobs for everyone!

[byu71]

But what if my Obamaphone is free?

Sometimes I wished you republicans would leave us alone and let us live in this democrat dreamland for a bit. Cheap healthcare, free cell phones, and government jobs for everyone!

I am a republican and it is just that the dreamland has to get more serious before I will jump on board. There just isn't enough income to be redistributed to accomplish all the dreams. When the dems get serious and start talking about not only redistributing income, but also redistributing assets, then I will start supporting them.

For starters I think 10.475 million is quite enough to have in assets. Anything over that should be confiscated by the government and handed out to those below the poverty line. That would be a good start.

[Uncle Ted]

I am a republican and it is just that the dreamland has to get more serious before I will jump on board. There just isn't enough income to be redistributed to accomplish all the dreams. When the dems get serious and start talking about not only redistributing income, but also redistributing assets, then I will start supporting them.

For starters I think 10.475 million is quite enough to have in assets. Anything over that should be confiscated by the government and handed out to those below the poverty line. That would be a good start.

Yes, President Obama knows when you've made enough money...

Also, they need to get those death panels going so we can kill off all those old farts that are draining our entitlements.

[byu71]

Yes, President Obama knows when you've made enough money...

Also, they need to get those death panels going so we can kill off all those old farts that are draining our entitlements.

Agreed. Look at the drain. How much money are they pulling from the SS system. It has to be huge. Next, I can't remember the number, but something like 70% (someone may have real number) of health care costs are spent on people in their last two months of life. Think of the savings!!!

[VirginiaCougar]

How long had Ted Cruz been going now?

Much too long... (he was done about 5 minutes after his first floor speech after his election).

It is a little off this topic, but still related so I will post it here. Tom notes quite well why it is time for the Lee/Cruz contingent to take a seat, for the betterment of America. We've got some serious issues to resolve, not their nonsense.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/25/op...homaslfriedman

[imanihonjin]

Much too long... (he was done about 5 minutes after his first floor speech after his election).

It is a little off this topic, but still related so I will post it here. Tom notes quite well why it is time for the Lee/Cruz contingent to take a seat, for the betterment of America. We've got some serious issues to resolve, not their nonsense.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/25/op...homaslfriedman

Yep, because the financial impact of Obamacare has been nothing but roses. Lee and Cruz just need to get out of the way and get with the program of running the already weak market to even weaker ground.

Good to see that you are on such casual terms with the schmuck Thomas Friedman (the man who actually thought that communist China's government is enviable) that you can refer to him as Tom.

[VirginiaCougar]

It is quite the comedy routine going on right now here among the right-wingers and in the public sphere as well. I will reiterate again that ACA has many problems. I agree with an earlier post that it doesn't do enough to reduce costs while increasing access. I do this as it is the usual response to saying anything against the collective mother of all childish fits regarding ACA is binary, black and white thinking (if you don't absolutely hate and loath ACA you must be a socialist marxist that absolutely loves it).

But the comedy is undeniable and it is worth noting a few of the highlights.

1) First is the collective confirmation bias of right wing infosphere where they continue to pass around disjointed and often false "facts." You see many of these infosphere posts throughout offering a lot of less than accurate info. I was going to respond to many of them individually, but there are so many. Just two examples: One special soul here argued that ACA was going to give 35 million Americans "free health care." (Just like their "Obamaphone" which really should be their "Reagan/Bush phone", but that is a different falsehood for another thread) It is true that a small percentage of that 35 million will receive subsidies that come close to "free." But overall, most of those 35 million will be buying insurance that was previously too expensive or they were free-riders. That is the purpose of the exchanges, and initial objective evidence is that health insurance on the exchanges will be less expensive than it would have been otherwise. ACA is expanding access as intended.

This latter point gets to a second example. Another post here referenced an op-ed (not an objective journalism piiece) arguing that everyone's health care was gong to increase a couple thousand dollars. The author of that op-ed rather deviously used a CBO number regarding new health care spending that he then divided across all Americans to come up with his figures. What he rather dishonestly didn't mention is that most of that new health care spending will come from those entering the system and paying premiums for the first time. That is a good portion of the new spending as is the new spending that will come form those now with insurance that will access health care when previously they didn't due to lack of insurance and cost. None of that has anything to do with your individual premiums, or the average Americans costs.

There are countless examples like this.

2) Perhaps the darkest comedic element is the argument now embraced by the Cruz/Lee anti-Obamacare clan is this nasty logic: "Obamacare harms the American economy and so we will purposefully destroy the American economy by threatening default and similar scorched earth approaches to keep it from happening." The lighter comedic logic from this bunch includes, "Nobody likes Obamacare so we have to stop it now because once implemented people will like Obamacare too much to stop it." I find this last one funny for a couple of reasons. First, its wrong. If you look at the polls, it is very true that a majority of Americans dislike Obamacare. BUT, the breakdown of that opposition is what makes it interesting. In poll after poll what you find is that a good portion of the opposition to Obamacare comes from the fact that it doesn't go far enough - they want MORE. If you take those folks and add them to the support Obamacare numbers, you actually have a decent majority that would say ACA is at least a start. The other interesting elements in those polls is that when you offer those opposed to Obamacare a potential list of specific health care policies to replace ACA - guess what they pick? They pick a number of policies which are at the core of ACA (or others that go even farther). They don't chose what the Lee/Cruz crew want to do.

3) It remains true that ACA is almost exactly what Heritage put forward in the Clinton administration as a Republican alternative to Hillarycare. It speaks volumes about the radicalization of the GOP by the tea party folks to note that the exchanges, individual mandate, and many other key elements of ACA are Republican ideas (also defined as Conservative back then.) The reason Obama went with that approach is that he really wanted a bipartisan "big win" early in his administration. He wanted GOP involvement. The GOP decided not to participate AT ALL, in the process. They decided back then to not give Obama any big win even if it was just to tell your mother you loved her on Mother's Day. I know a couple of GOP Senators/Congressmen who wanted to participate in that process but were told by leadership they couldn't.

Isn't it funny that a set of Republican ideas of a few decades ago has now become Socialism/Marxism "shoved down our throats"" when it was the same group of folks who said that who refused to participate in making a better law than what we got?

I could go on, but that is enough of a diatribe for one morning.

[Uncle Ted]

Much too long... (he was done about 5 minutes after his first floor speech after his election).

It is a little off this topic, but still related so I will post it here. Tom notes quite well why it is time for the Lee/Cruz contingent to take a seat, for the betterment of America. We've got some serious issues to resolve, not their nonsense.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/25/op...homaslfriedman

It was kind of nice that CSPAN was showing Mike and Ted's Excellent Adventure this morning instead of the crap they normally show...

bill-teds-excellent-adventure.jpg

Talking about things like actually creating a federal budget is so boring.

[dabrockster]

Its Ironic (Summon DDD for confirmation) to listen to Blow-hard Reid talk about wasting time talk while he goes on and one after Cruz.. What a buffoon...

[Katy Lied]

I've never listened to a word of Hannity, Beck, and all the right wingers. (I have read Beck's conversion story, and I listened to Rush a few times about 10 years ago when I was driving through the Mojave Desert and couldnt get any other station). I have no idea what they say from day to day. So I am always surprised when VirgCoug attributes something I post in this thread to the "right wing infosphere." As if no one could come to a conservative conclusion unless it was spoon fed to them by those fascist commentators. And, true liberal that he is, I am not to blame for my conservative leanings-- it's really all the fault of the right wing conspiracy that brain washes me. I am the ultimate victim here, let me keep some of my tax dollars to pay for my recovery.