Important Prop. 8 Ruling Today

[YOhio]

Dick Cheney had no stature?

IIRC, his support for SSM came after he left office.

[Pheidippides]

IIRC, his support for SSM came after he left office.

Way after.

[dabrockster]

What did I state that would be searchable?

Correction. This should of gone to SoCal not you. My bad...

I searched to see if there was any discussion on Rob Portman and found nothing.. Now calling SoCal a idiot. I got a few hits on that..

[SoCalCoug]

Correction. This should of gone to SoCal not you. My bad...

I searched to see if there was any discussion on Rob Portman and found nothing.. Now calling SoCal a idiot. I got a few hits on that..

Indy's pandering comment apparently got deleted, along with one of the threads. I was paraphrasing with the "idiot" comment - I'm confident I accurately captured the feelings of CB on this, though.

[Bruiserstone]

Are you guys serious? Romney said during the campaign he was against civil unions, let alone marriage. Good for Senator Portman!

[Bruiserstone]

Hey Indy, about Portman pandering, don't tell me, it was my man DS7.

[creekster]

Are you guys serious? Romney said during the campaign he was against civil unions, let alone marriage. Good for Senator Portman!

While this si true, I think Rmoney said a lot of things in the campaign that he doesnt feel in his bones. In fact, I think this was picked up o0n by many peoiple and is a big part of the reason that he lost. It wasnt that he flip-flopped so much as people felt like he was being disingenuous.

[Jacob]

IIRC, his support for SSM came after he left office.

Way after.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/...heney.samesex/

He may have been more clear in 2009 (which was not "way after"), but his position was pretty clear in 2004 and he publicly stated that he disagreed with Bush's position:

"At this point, my own preference is as I've stated," Cheney said. "But the president makes basic policy for this administration, and he's made it clear that he does in fact support a constitutional amendment on this issue."...

Cheney, the father of two adult daughters -- one of whom is a lesbian -- was asked for his views on "homosexual marriage" during a campaign rally here. (Special Report: America Votes 2004)

"Lynne and I have a gay daughter, so it's an issue that our family is very familiar with," Cheney said as he began to explain his view.

"With respect to the question of relationships, my general view is that freedom means freedom for everybody," said Cheney, who took the same stand during the 2000 presidential race.

"People ought to be free to enter into any kind of relationship they want to."

[Indy Coug]

Indy's pandering comment apparently got deleted, along with one of the threads. I was paraphrasing with the "idiot" comment - I'm confident I accurately captured the feelings of CB on this, though.

My reply wasn't deleted.

[Joe Public]

While this si true, I think Rmoney said a lot of things in the campaign that he doesnt feel in his bones. In fact, I think this was picked up o0n by many peoiple and is a big part of the reason that he lost. It wasnt that he flip-flopped so much as people felt like he was being disingenuous.

I agree completely. It's as if he was so concerned about saying something honest but unpopular - like his father - that he overcorrected and came across as phony (for lack of a better word).

[Moliere]

http://thinkprogress.org/lgbt/2013/0...B%5D&mobile=wp

[CardiacCoug]

http://thinkprogress.org/lgbt/2013/0...B%5D&mobile=wp

This Portman thing is really interesting. Yeah, you read those comments and just have to cringe at the anti-gay stuff.

Glad he came around on this, but as with Cheney, I think it's telling that conservatives with gay kids often decide that gay marriage is a good thing and isn't going to destroy civilization -- that it would actually improve civilization.

So does this mean that they only started to really empathize with the gay viewpoint when it's one of their kids? Does it mean that if you truly care about and know a gay person that you will realize gay marriage is OK and even a good thing? LAUte, any thoughts?

[Moliere]

This Portman thing is really interesting. Yeah, you read those comments and just have to cringe at the anti-gay stuff.

Glad he came around on this, but as with Cheney, I think it's telling that conservatives with gay kids often decide that gay marriage is a good thing and isn't going to destroy civilization -- that it would actually improve civilization.

So does this mean that they only started to really empathize with the gay viewpoint when it's one of their kids? Does it mean that if you truly care about and know a gay person that you will realize gay marriage is OK and even a good thing? LAUte, any thoughts?

A lot of liberals are coming after Portman and attacking him for this bolded piece. I honestly don't care how someone comes around on the issue as long as they come around. Most liberals, when exclaiming their support for gay marriage, will cite the number of people they know that are personally affected by the unfairness. I just don't see a difference between Portman and other liberals in how they came around, just that one came around a bit later in life.

I think (my opinion) that conservatives are sheltered from the issue. They don't have a lot of interaction with the gay community and part of that is by design. There are the extremes with families that kick out gay sons/daughters but there is also the "somewhat accepted" practice of exclusion that includes only allowing LDS families to rent your properties to censoring certain TV shows.

I also find it interesting that some people I know that watch Downton Abbey are repulsed by the gay servant but they are not repulsed by the rigid class structure. It's somewhat telling of the type of society in which we live, or which has been developed by the religious society in the US.

[SoCalCoug]

http://thinkprogress.org/lgbt/2013/0...B%5D&mobile=wp

I understand the Baptist minister's fear of AIDS, but throat cancer? That's a new one I haven't heard of as a consequence of homosexual behavior.

[SoCalCoug]

I watched that video with Jason Chaffetz. It was interesting how he dodged a couple of pointed questions.

"And if one of your children were to be gay, you would not change your perspective, is what you're saying?"
"I would love him with all my heart - all my heart - absolutely."
"But you would still not support marriage equality."
"I just believe in traditional marriage. That's what I believe in. I believe somebody who is gay can still be very happy and thrive, and I want nothing but the best for them, I don't want to discriminate against them, but I just happen to believe in traditional marriage."

I guess he answered the question without really answering it directly. You'd think if you truly feel strong in your position you'd have no problem giving a direct answer to a direct question.

I also think it's interesting how Portman changed his position after actually experiencing first hand the struggles of a homosexual son. Did the experience make him more enlightened or less enlightened?