I guess Obama really dd pay for my gas

[doctorcoug]

I just did my taxes...wow, I'm getting a sizeable 5 figure refund (I only paid a little over $1000 due to it being a signon bonus and unavoidable tax).

I worked out my tax forecast and I don't start paying taxe until I make in the mid $90,000 range. So, this begs the question, who in this country is actually paying taxes? I mean, I'm a pretty average Joe and I don't have to pay until $95,000?

[RobinFinderson]

That sounds a little weird. We make less than $95k, we are a couple, with a child, with pretty decent tax write-offs (mortgage, education debt, etc), and our tax bill is still a significant positive number.

I'm not interested in disputing your claim. I would just say be careful and check again if you did the calcs yourself. But your question raises an interesting point about Republican politics regarding the taxation of the poor.

While the wording of the Republican message about taxes is 'Reduce taxes! Reduce government!' the meaning of the Republican message is 'Shift taxes to the poor! Reduce services to the poor!' At least the Flat Taxers have the cajones to say it pretty much like it is. The Republican party is a party that looks after the interests of the rich.

[cowboy]

That sounds a little weird. We make less than $95k, we are a couple, with a child, with pretty decent tax write-offs (mortgage, education debt, etc), and our tax bill is still a significant positive number.

I'm not interested in disputing your claim. I would just say be careful and check again if you did the calcs yourself. But your question raises an interesting point about Republican politics regarding the taxation of the poor.

While the wording of the Republican message about taxes is 'Reduce taxes! Reduce government!' the meaning of the Republican message is 'Shift taxes to the poor! Reduce services to the poor!' At least the Flat Taxers have the cajones to say it pretty much like it is. The Republican party is a party that looks after the interests of the rich.

You're kidding, right? Personal income taxes, including social security tax, accounts for around 80% of federal tax revenues, and they break down to around $7,000 for every man, woman, and child in the US. Are you telling me that you pay $21,000 in taxes? If so, then congratulations for pulling your weight.

The median household has around 2.5 people in it, and earns roughly $55k per year. I'll guaran-damn-tee you that the median household doesn't fork over 30% of their income to the feds. The high-income earners are already subsidizing the hell out of the rest of us, and you want them to pay more?

[il Padrino Ute]

You're kidding, right? Personal income taxes, including social security tax, accounts for around 80% of federal tax revenues, and they break down to around $7,000 for every man, woman, and child in the US. Are you telling me that you pay $21,000 in taxes? If so, then congratulations for pulling your weight.

The median household has around 2.5 people in it, and earns roughly $55k per year. I'll guaran-damn-tee you that the median household doesn't fork over 30% of their income to the feds. The high-income earners are already subsidizing the hell out of the rest of us, and you want them to pay more?

Amen brother Cowboy!

I'm certainly not anywhere near the high income bracket, but I think they pay more than their "fair share". If I think I'm paying too much in taxes, it's only logical to think they are as well.

[RobinFinderson]

You're kidding, right? Personal income taxes, including social security tax, accounts for around 80% of federal tax revenues, and they break down to around $7,000 for every man, woman, and child in the US. Are you telling me that you pay $21,000 in taxes? If so, then congratulations for pulling your weight.

The median household has around 2.5 people in it, and earns roughly $55k per year. I'll guaran-damn-tee you that the median household doesn't fork over 30% of their income to the feds. The high-income earners are already subsidizing the hell out of the rest of us, and you want them to pay more?

I didn't say that wealthy people should pay more. I was observing that if you follow the reasoning that you outline above to its logical conclusion, you would shift the tax burden more heavily onto the poor and you would reduce public services to the poor. That is the meaning of Republican politics. Reduce taxes (for the wealthy) and Reduce government (for the poor).

[CardiacCoug]

You're kidding, right? Personal income taxes, including social security tax, accounts for around 80% of federal tax revenues, and they break down to around $7,000 for every man, woman, and child in the US. Are you telling me that you pay $21,000 in taxes? If so, then congratulations for pulling your weight.

The median household has around 2.5 people in it, and earns roughly $55k per year. I'll guaran-damn-tee you that the median household doesn't fork over 30% of their income to the feds. The high-income earners are already subsidizing the hell out of the rest of us, and you want them to pay more?

Wow, so the average LDS family with 2 parents, 4 kids would have to pay $42K in federal taxes alone to be pulling their "fair share". Amazing.

[byu71]

That sounds a little weird. We make less than $95k, we are a couple, with a child, with pretty decent tax write-offs (mortgage, education debt, etc), and our tax bill is still a significant positive number.

I'm not interested in disputing your claim. I would just say be careful and check again if you did the calcs yourself. But your question raises an interesting point about Republican politics regarding the taxation of the poor.

While the wording of the Republican message about taxes is 'Reduce taxes! Reduce government!' the meaning of the Republican message is 'Shift taxes to the poor! Reduce services to the poor!' At least the Flat Taxers have the cajones to say it pretty much like it is. The Republican party is a party that looks after the interests of the rich.

Would you please define the rich for me. I am not saying this is me, but how about if I paid $70,000 in fed. income taxes. $14,000 in state taxes, 8,000 in Social Security and my company matched it. If I were that person would you put me in the rich category. I guess my other question would be, how much more do you want me to pay. Let's say my taxable income was $250,000..

[RobinFinderson]

Would you please define the rich for me. I am not saying this is me, but how about if I paid $70,000 in fed. income taxes. $14,000 in state taxes, 8,000 in Social Security and my company matched it. If I were that person would you put me in the rich category. I guess my other question would be, how much more do you want me to pay. Let's say my taxable income was $250,000..

I don't see how defining rich matters here. It is enough to say that Republicans want the wealthier people to carry less weight. You do that by either reducing programs for the poor (entitlements), or by shifting the cost of those entitlements onto the poor. No matter how you cut it, this is the MEANING of Republican politics.

[byu71]

I don't see how defining rich matters here. It is enough to say that Republicans want the wealthier people to carry less weight. You do that by either reducing programs for the poor (entitlements), or by shifting the cost of those entitlements onto the poor. No matter how you cut it, this is the MEANING of Republican politics.

Your empathy and desire to help the poor and downtrodden is admirable. Your solutions are simplistic. You want to take from the rich and redistribute to the poor, but you don't even know who the rich are.

[il Padrino Ute]

I believe taxes should be voluntary. That way, those who talk the most about taking care of the poor can put their own money where their mouth is.

[doctorcoug]

That sounds a little weird. We make less than $95k, we are a couple, with a child, with pretty decent tax write-offs (mortgage, education debt, etc), and our tax bill is still a significant positive number.

I'm not interested in disputing your claim. I would just say be careful and check again if you did the calcs yourself. But your question raises an interesting point about Republican politics regarding the taxation of the poor.

While the wording of the Republican message about taxes is 'Reduce taxes! Reduce government!' the meaning of the Republican message is 'Shift taxes to the poor! Reduce services to the poor!' At least the Flat Taxers have the cajones to say it pretty much like it is. The Republican party is a party that looks after the interests of the rich.

http://www.irs.gov/individuals/artic...=96196,00.html

that is what I used. Enter the hsa, 401k, home interest, student loan interest, taxes on the home, medical expenses, and lots of kids and I don't have to pay taxes. It isn't going to matter for a few years, as I don't make that much money.

[CardiacCoug]

http://www.irs.gov/individuals/artic...=96196,00.html

that is what I used. Enter the hsa, 401k, home interest, student loan interest, taxes on the home, medical expenses, and lots of kids and I don't have to pay taxes. It isn't going to matter for a few years, as I don't make that much money.

Did your medical expenses exceed 7.5% of your adjusted gross income?

Only the expenses above that amount can be deducted.

[doctorcoug]

Did your medical expenses exceed 7.5% of your adjusted gross income?

Only the expenses above that amount can be deducted.

Thankfully, no.

[cowboy]

I didn't say that wealthy people should pay more. I was observing that if you follow the reasoning that you outline above to its logical conclusion, you would shift the tax burden more heavily onto the poor and you would reduce public services to the poor. That is the meaning of Republican politics. Reduce taxes (for the wealthy) and Reduce government (for the poor).

And my argument is that the poor don't have a tax burden. Over half of all personal income tax revenues come from those with an adjusted gross income over $200k. Another 20% comes from those with an adjusted gross between $100 and $200k, and a whopping 80% of all income taxes come from the $75k tax bracket and up. AGI's under $50k, approximately the median household income, pay less than 10% of the total income taxes collected.

[il Padrino Ute]

And my argument is that the poor don't have a tax burden. Over half of all personal income tax revenues come from those with an adjusted gross income over $200k. Another 20% comes from those with an adjusted gross between $100 and $200k, and a whopping 80% of all income taxes come from the $75k tax bracket and up. AGI's under $50k, approximately the median household income, pay less than 10% of the total income taxes collected.

Don't use facts to confuse communists.