Just wanted to give '71 another reason to complain about the Honor Code

[Moliere]

Haha. Yes. Makes no sense.

You want BYU to be a secular university with a strong football team. That's fine, but that is not what the BoT wants (the secular thing).

Maybe they’ll change their mind in 3-4 years

[Jeff Lebowski]

Maybe they’ll change their mind in 3-4 years

Ha!

[MartyFunkhouser]

I rest my case.

Again, not a single example of the good of the honor code.

It does hurt byu football, so I will acknowledge it does that good.

[myboynoah]

Again, not a single example of the good of the honor code.

WTF?

No doubt the honor code has been a deterent to alcohol and drug abuse. Now STFU and move on.

[falafel]

WTF?

No doubt the honor code has been a deterent to alcohol and drug abuse. Now STFU and move on.

Two pillars on which funk has built his life (he hasn't admitted to the drug use, but as someone who has left the church, it is certainly lurking under the surface).

[Jeff Lebowski]

Again, not a single example of the good of the honor code.

Every student at BYU gets a massive scholarship/subsidy from the church - tuition only covers 15% or so of the cost of the education. The only justification for a such a massive subsidy from a church is that provides a unique faith-based educational experience that is highly valued and has many positive long-term outcomes. Part of that immersive experience includes full activity in student wards and commitment to the honor code. Now, whether it is possible to have an honor code without an honor code office (sounds good in theory, but I don't think it would work) or how the honor code office can most optimally operate are valid points of discussion. But to much of the church membership, the honor code is a defining feature of the institution and one of the things people value and respect. Applications to BYU have never been higher. Thousands of highly qualified students are turned away each year.

I have zero problem with people who decide they don't want that kind of experience. I get it. I also have zero problem understanding why it is important to the Board of Trustees.

And to answer your broader question, I know countless people who value the honor code and have a life-changing experience at BYU and are loyal for life and want nothing more than to have their kids enjoy the same experience.

[Jeff Lebowski]

WTF?

No doubt the honor code has been a deterent to alcohol and drug abuse. Now STFU and move on.

BYU is one of the safest campuses in America due to extremely low levels of alcohol abuse.

[Moliere]

IMO, the honor code would exist and be effective even without the honor code office. It would help if they got rid of the dumb dress and grooming parts of the honor code. I mean, there’s no honor code office in my life telling me to not do drugs or have sex with someone other than my wife and I seem to do doing fine. Same with most of my ward.

But I get that the BoT May want it as another way to enforce the honor code. That’s fine and I bet 95% of most students never even deal with the honor code office during their four year stay on campus. I know I never did and I was there almost six years in a row.

[myboynoah]

BYU is one of the safest campuses in America due to extremely low levels of alcohol abuse.

Exactly. Such a dumb question.

As you noted so very well, no one is forcing anyone to stick around at BYU. There is no doubt room for improvement in honor code implementation. But if one doesn't want an honor code, then he/she should have the integrity to move on and seek his/her education elsewhere and open that spot up to someone who wants it. And don't stick around just to graduate so he/she can trash the university afterward. But if one does do that, then he/she can feel free to send a check for the balance of the education he/she received from the sponsoring institution.

[MartyFunkhouser]

BYU is one of the safest campuses in America due to extremely low levels of alcohol abuse.

Which isn't because of the honor code office.

Here, I will throw something out. I think the honor code provides good in that it delays alcohol use until after 25. I think waiting until that age before drinking is smart and avoiding binge drinking that is prevalent at other schools is good. I am going to encourage my son not to drink until 25 and certainly to avoid being drunk

Now these are benefits of the honor code, not the honor code office.

Of course, I am sure this post will be ignored and you will continue to tell me that I'm completely binary as it comes to issues related to byu.

[MartyFunkhouser]

WTF?

No doubt the honor code has been a deterent to alcohol and drug abuse. Now STFU and move on.

Omitted the word office. I'm asking for examples of the good of the honor code office.

[myboynoah]

Omitted the word office. I'm asking for examples of the good of the honor code office.

Yes, you did omit the word office. No worries. Here you go.

No doubt honor code enforcement has been a deterent to alcohol and drug abuse. Now STFU and move on.

[MartyFunkhouser]

Yes, you did omit the word office. No worries. Here you go.

So you think it is fear of punishment not a testimony that prohibits alcohol use? Seems pretty cynical

[Jeff Lebowski]

Funk, serious question: why do you care? You have left the church, you trash everything BYU/LDS constantly. I can't imagine you would send a child to BYU given the option. So why does debating stuff like this consume so much of your energy?

[Pelado]

So you think it is fear of punishment not a testimony that prohibits alcohol use? Seems pretty cynical

Why does it have to be mutually exclusive? I was never tempted to consume while at BYU whether because of my testimony or not. Others probably stayed dry primarily for fear of getting caught. And there's probably a segment of students who use both testimony and fear of punishment as an alcohol deterrent.