Brother Brigham Speaks

[Sleeping in EQ]

"it is not the place for any person to correct any person who is superior to them but ask the Father in the name of Jesus to bind him up from speaking false principles I have known many times I have preached rong but I asked the Father in the name of Jesus to take it from the minds of the people and I believe he always did drop the vail over it let your faith be for that man but do not oppose and get up a division between them..."

Brigham Young, in Thomas Bullock Minutes (HDC)

Spelling, grammar, and mechanics in original

[LVAllen]

"it is not the place for any person to correct any person who is superior to them but ask the Father in the name of Jesus to bind him up from speaking false principles I have known many times I have preached rong but I asked the Father in the name of Jesus to take it from the minds of the people and I believe he always did drop the vail over it let your faith be for that man but do not oppose and get up a division between them..."

Brigham Young, in Thomas Bullock Minutes (HDC)

Spelling, grammar, and mechanics in original

Dear Lord:
Please make this high councillor stop talking.

Amen.

[pellegrino]

"it is not the place for any person to correct any person who is superior to them but ask the Father in the name of Jesus to bind him up from speaking false principles I have known many times I have preached rong but I asked the Father in the name of Jesus to take it from the minds of the people and I believe he always did drop the vail over it let your faith be for that man but do not oppose and get up a division between them..."

Brigham Young, in Thomas Bullock Minutes (HDC)

Spelling, grammar, and mechanics in original

How does that really work? It doesn't make any sense.

"Dear Lord, please let this man who is preaching principles (that few in his congregation see as such) understand that he is wrong and that he will stop speaking them. I ask this even though this man has nobody above him to correct him, which means he has no incentive to seek a different path and in order to do so he would have to be overcome with some revelation to show him that he is wrong. Oh, and while you're at it, maybe he could acknowledge that he was wrong and correct them?"

[scottie]

Is this really a thread for offensive statements by Brother Brigham?

"You may inquire of the intelligent of the world whether they can tell why the aborigines of this country are dark, loathsome, ignorant, and sunken into the depths of degradation ...When the Lord has a people, he makes covenants with them and gives unto them promises: then, if they transgress his law, change his ordinances, and break his covenants he has made with them, he will put a mark upon them, as in the case of the Lamanites and other portions of the house of Israel; but by-and-by they will become a white and delightsome people" (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 7:336).

"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind....Cain slew his brother. Can might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 7, page 290).

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Volume 10, page 110.)

[Goatnapper'96]

Is this really a thread for offensive statements by Brother Brigham?

"You may inquire of the intelligent of the world whether they can tell why the aborigines of this country are dark, loathsome, ignorant, and sunken into the depths of degradation ...When the Lord has a people, he makes covenants with them and gives unto them promises: then, if they transgress his law, change his ordinances, and break his covenants he has made with them, he will put a mark upon them, as in the case of the Lamanites and other portions of the house of Israel; but by-and-by they will become a white and delightsome people" (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 7:336).

"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind....Cain slew his brother. Can might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 7, page 290).

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Volume 10, page 110.)

Sometimes he preached rong.

[Sleeping in EQ]

Is this really a thread for offensive statements by Brother Brigham?

"You may inquire of the intelligent of the world whether they can tell why the aborigines of this country are dark, loathsome, ignorant, and sunken into the depths of degradation ...When the Lord has a people, he makes covenants with them and gives unto them promises: then, if they transgress his law, change his ordinances, and break his covenants he has made with them, he will put a mark upon them, as in the case of the Lamanites and other portions of the house of Israel; but by-and-by they will become a white and delightsome people" (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 7:336).

"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind....Cain slew his brother. Can might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 7, page 290).

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Volume 10, page 110.)

My intention is not to discuss "offensive" statements per se (although there are plenty of those). I had "provocative" statements in mind.

[Katy Lied]

who would define this statement as inoffensive?

[Uncle Ted]

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Volume 10, page 110.)

BY goes on to say in that same discourse above...

"For their abuse of [the Black African] race, the whites will be cursed..."

BY was the "Reverend Al" of his day.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Is this really a thread for offensive statements by Brother Brigham?

"You may inquire of the intelligent of the world whether they can tell why the aborigines of this country are dark, loathsome, ignorant, and sunken into the depths of degradation ...When the Lord has a people, he makes covenants with them and gives unto them promises: then, if they transgress his law, change his ordinances, and break his covenants he has made with them, he will put a mark upon them, as in the case of the Lamanites and other portions of the house of Israel; but by-and-by they will become a white and delightsome people" (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 7:336).

"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind....Cain slew his brother. Can might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 7, page 290).

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Volume 10, page 110.)

I read this and I thought, "I wonder how many times these quotes have been posted here." I am bored so I did a little research. That last quote has been posted here at least ten times, the first being by Scottie in 2009. Both wuap and Uncle Ted have posted it multiple times.

[Uncle Ted]

My intention is not to discuss "offensive" statements per se (although there are plenty of those). I had "provocative" statements in mind.

How does this one rank on the provocative but not offensive scale?

Suppose you found your brother in bed with your wife, and put a javelin through both of them, you would be justified, and they would atone for their sins, and be received into the kingdom of God. I would at once do so in such a case; and under such circumstances, I have no wife whom I love so well that I would not put a javelin through her heart, and I would do it with clean hands.

Brigham Young, “Instructions to the Bishops, Etc.,” Journal of Discourses, reported by G.D. Watt 16 March 1856, Vol. 3

Now suppose you found a bunch of Arkansans and their wives in your backyard...

[snowcat]

Is this really a thread for offensive statements by Brother Brigham?

"You may inquire of the intelligent of the world whether they can tell why the aborigines of this country are dark, loathsome, ignorant, and sunken into the depths of degradation ...When the Lord has a people, he makes covenants with them and gives unto them promises: then, if they transgress his law, change his ordinances, and break his covenants he has made with them, he will put a mark upon them, as in the case of the Lamanites and other portions of the house of Israel; but by-and-by they will become a white and delightsome people" (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 7:336).

"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind....Cain slew his brother. Can might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 7, page 290).

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Volume 10, page 110.)

Every time I try to read this my mind goes blank.

[scottie]

Sometimes he preached rong.

Every time I try to read this my mind goes blank.

[Sleeping in EQ]

How does this one rank on the provocative but not offensive scale?


Brigham Young, “Instructions to the Bishops, Etc.,” Journal of Discourses, reported by G.D. Watt 16 March 1856, Vol. 3

Now suppose you found a bunch of Arkansans and their wives in your backyard...

Yes, I'm familiar with that one too. It won't be slipping past correlation any time soon.

[ERCougar]

Did anyone hear the RadioWest episode called "The Mormon Struggle For Whiteness"?

It's a great listen. I'm going from memory here, but essentially, this professor says that the common theory of the nineteenth century held that the supreme race was Anglo-Saxon and that all other races were inferior in some degree. It was thought that only Anglo-Saxon cultures were capable of democracy and monogamy, to name a few specifics that apply here. So 19th century America saw Mormons, who were led by a despot and practiced polygamy, as a literally fallen race. Add to that their willingness to initially worship with black people and there was an extreme distrust and wariness towards Mormons, which eventually culminated in the Reed Smoot hearings after his election to the Senate--people had serious concerns about Utah's abilities to participate in a democracy. So the ironic challenge of 19th and early 20th century Mormons was to demonstrate to the world that they were "white enough". It doesn't excuse mid 20th century racism, and really only underlines the inadequacy of relying on past prophets' statements as gospel (something the Church still stubbornly clings to), but it does add some background to some of these comments by BY (and others).

[Uncle Ted]

JS Jr didn't follow the spirit of revelation... and that is why he died an unnecessary martyr. Also, men shouldn't follow their women. It is disgraceful to men for someone to do so.

I will deviate from my subject a little, and say a few words with regard to br. Joseph that some, perhaps, have not understood. If Joseph Smith, jun., the Prophet, had followed the Spirit of revelation in him he never would have gone to Carthage. Do you understand that? [Voices, ‘Yes.’] A great many do, and some do not. Many of the first Elders of this church have a different understanding; they are under the impression that he went there according to his own choice. Joseph intended to go West; he designed to raise a company to come to the very country we now occupy. [p.113]He said, “I can see life and liberty and salvation in that course, but if I return to give myself up, it is death and darkness to the full; I am like a lamb led to the slaughter,” and never for one moment did he say that he had one particle of light in him after he started back from Montrose to give himself up in Nauvoo. This he did through the persuasion of others. I want you to understand that.


With regard to myself I cannot say what I will do.I do not know precisely in what manner the Lord will lead me, but were I thrown into the situation Joseph was, I would leave the people and go into the wilderness, and let them do the best they could. Will I run from the sheep? No. Will I forskae the flock? No. But if Joseph had followed the revelations in him he would have been our earthly shephard to-day, and we would have heard his voice and followed the shepherd instead of the shepherd’s following the sheep. When the shepherd follows the sheep it reverses the natural order, for the sheep are to follow the shepherd.

I want you to understand that if I am your earthly shepherd you must follow me, or else we shall be separated. As I told the people after Joseph’s death, they might cling to the Twelve and receive salvation and be led in the way of truth and holiness, or go to hell if they pleased, for we asked no odds of them. I feel so to-day.


That is the way I feel about many families in the church. A great many parents follow off their children, and men follow their women. For a man to follow a woman is, in the sight of heaven, disgraceful to the name of a man. It is a disgrace for parents to follow their children. I am your leader, Latter Day Saints, and you must follow me; and if you do not follow me you may expect that I shall go my way and you may take yours, if you please. I shall do as the Spirit dictates me. What does it now direct me to dictate to you?

http://signaturebookslibrary.org/essential-brigham-young-11/

The last part is a good quote to bring up in priesthood meeting.