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  • The Heart of Christianity

    I was going to put this in the “Scriptural Historicity” thread, but I think it deserves a thread of its own. I am reading a book called “The Heart of Christianity” by Marcus Borg. Outstanding book and I thought I would share a few thoughts here.

    http://www.amazon.com/Heart-Christia...qid=1431493002

    Borg is a world-renowned biblical scholar and in this book he makes a case for how Christianity become relevant and transformative again in an age where increasing numbers are abandoning faith (see Uncle Ted post on recent Pew study of dwindling numbers). Borg outlines a traditional approach to christianity that is failing and a new approach. He does not like the terms “liberal” and “conservative” so he prefers to call them “the earlier paradigm” and “the emerging paradigm” (he does a good job using language and expressions designed to unite rather than divide). The earlier paradigm is characterized by a literal view of scriptural accounts, a requirement to believe a set of truth claims, and a notion of only one truth religion or church or only one legitimate pathway to God. The emerging paradigm represents a less rigid approach to scripture, a more metaphorical approach to truth, and a tolerance for a broad number of ways to experience the divine.

    In some ways, this book shares some similarities with a book I reviewed a month or two ago called “Saving Jesus from the Church: How to Stop Worshipping Christ and Start Following Jesus” by Robin Meyers. Both books attempt to outline a modern approach to faith that is compatible with contemporary biblical scholarship and does not require believing things that are directly at odds with science and the post-enlightenment world. Meyers argues that we should drill down to find the actual teachings of the historical Jesus and follow those teachings and jettison all the mythical baggage (miracles, resurrection, jesus as god, etc) that was layered on in subsequent centuries by the believers. Borg seems less eager to jettison these elements. Rather he advocates a more metaphorical approach that utilizes a different definition of “truth” in a life of faith.

    Borg argues that we have developed an unrealistically rigid definition of truth. If something is not historically factual, we classify it as a type of lie. He argues that this is a fairly recent way of thinking that has not been shared by most of humanity throughout history. He references an old saying that "Myth is something that never was, but always is.” He argues that we should stop thinking of religion as “science minus” and start thinking of it as “poetry plus”.

    Borg outlines four types of faith (good summary here):

    Faith as Assensus: This type of faith is agreeing that something is factual or “true” in the modern sense. He argues that this is only type of faith most people consider when they think of faith and belief, but he makes a compelling case that this is a way of viewing faith that has only been around for the last century or two.

    Faith as Fiducia: This is faith as a form of trust. The opposite of this kind of faith is anxiety or worry.

    Faith as Fidelitas: This is faith as allegiance or loyalty.

    Faith as Visio: This if faith as a means of seeing the divine in the world. I.e. a Godly worldview.

    Borg argues that all four definitions are valid and important and healthy, but most people are stuck with viewing faith solely as assensus where you have to mentally assent to certain truth claims in order to be considered a believer. He also argues that the ultimate foundation of our faith should be “love God and love your neighbor”.

    Finally, Borg argues that we should stop viewing scripture as the word of God and start viewing it as the record of an ancient culture’s experience with the divine. Yes, it is the same God we worship, but it was their experience and it was perceived, interpreted, passed down, and eventually recorded through the unique lens of their culture and worldview. He argues that scripture is still sacred and incredibly powerful and important, but this change in approach makes a huge difference. For example when we encounter stories like tribal genocide in the OT, it is pointless to try to figure out or explain why God would do such a thing. Rather, we view these things as a set of stories and myths (which may have some element of factualness, but may not) developed by an ancient people as a mechanism for explaining their experience with the divine. And other cultures and other religions have their own experiences and traditions and it is all good because we all search for God.

    Anyway, that is my quick and sloppy attempt at a review. I may share a few more thoughts as I go along if anyone is interested.
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

  • #2
    I loved this book. I swear I posted on it somewhere on here, although not as completely and as well done as yours. My search skills aren't up to finding it though.

    EDIT: Never mind! My search skillz ARE up to finding it!
    http://www.cougarstadium.com/showthr...=1#post1121495
    Last edited by ERCougar; 05-13-2015, 03:00 AM.
    At least the Big Ten went after a big-time addition in Nebraska; the Pac-10 wanted a game so badly, it added Utah
    -Berry Trammel, 12/3/10

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    • #3
      Originally posted by ERCougar View Post
      I loved this book. I swear I posted on it somewhere on here, although not as completely and as well done as yours. My search skills aren't up to finding it though.

      EDIT: Never mind! My search skillz ARE up to finding it!
      http://www.cougarstadium.com/showthr...=1#post1121495
      Hey, I remember reading your post. Forgot the connection.
      "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
      "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
      "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
        Finally, Borg argues that we should stop viewing scripture as the word of God and start viewing it as the record of an ancient culture’s experience with the divine. Yes, it is the same God we worship, but it was their experience and it was perceived, interpreted, passed down, and eventually recorded through the unique lens of their culture and worldview. He argues that scripture is still sacred and incredibly powerful and important, but this change in approach makes a huge difference. For example when we encounter stories like tribal genocide in the OT, it is pointless to try to figure out or explain why God would do such a thing. Rather, we view these things as a set of stories and myths (which may have some element of factualness, but may not) developed by an ancient people as a mechanism for explaining their experience with the divine. And other cultures and other religions have their own experiences and traditions and it is all good because we all search for God.
        I kind of butchered this, so here are some direct quotes:

        The Bible is the product of two historical communities, ancient Israel and the early Christian movement. As such, it is a human product, not a divine product. This claim in no way denies the reality of God. Rather, it sees the Bible as the response of these two ancient communities to God.

        As their response to God, the Bible tells us how they saw things. Above all, it tells us how they saw their life with God. It contains their stories about God’s involvement in their lives, their laws and ethical teachings, their prayers and praises, their wisdom about how to live, and their hopes and dreams. It is not God’s witness to God (not a divine product), but their witness to God.

        As a human product, the Bible is not “absolute truth” or “God’s revealed truth,” but relative and culturally conditioned. To many, “relative” and “culturally conditioned” mean something inferior, even negative. But “relative” means “related”: the Bible is related to their time and place. So also “culturally conditioned” means that the Bible uses the language and concepts of the cultures in which it took shape. ...

        When the Bible is approached in this way, many of the problems that people have with the Bible largely disappear. The conflict between the Genesis creation stories and science vanishes. The laws of the Bible need not be understood as God’s laws for all time, but as the laws and ethical teachings of these communities. The stories of God destroying Israel’s enemies are Israel’s way of telling its story, just as a violent destruction of the enemies of Christ is what some early Christians hoped for. Of course, this realization doesn’t make these “good stories”; but at least the problem of thinking of them as expressing the will of God disappears. In general, the literal and absolute reading of the Bible as infallible words of God disappears and is replaced by a historical and metaphorical reading, which I will soon describe.
        Just as this view of the Bible does not deny the reality of God, it does not deny that the Bible is “inspired by God.” But it understands inspiration differently. In recent centuries, some Christians have understood it to mean “plenary inspiration”: that every word is inspired by God, and thus has the truth and authority of God standing behind it. For them, inspiration effectively means that the Bible is a divine product. Within the emerging paradigm, inspiration refers to the movement of the Spirit in the lives of the people who produced the Bible. The emphasis is not upon words inspired by God, but on people moved by their experience of the Spirit, namely, these ancient communities and the individuals who wrote for them.

        Viewing the Bible this way also has implications for how we see religious pluralism. It enables us to affirm the Bible as the response to God in our particular cultural stream, even as it enables us to recognize the sacred texts of the other enduring religious traditions as the response to the sacred in their particular cultural streams.
        It seems to me that the reason traditional LDS apologetics (Dan Peterson, et al) have failed so miserably is that they are operating under the wrong paradigm. They view everything as literal historical truth and operate as if part of the official narrative ends up getting disproven, the entire structure will collapse. Thus you see them not willing to concede an inch, even arguing against things like the documentary hypothesis for the OT. Such an approach is doomed to failure.
        "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
        "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
        "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

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        • #5
          Ugh. Talking about church stuff. Football can't come soon enough.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by YOhio View Post
            Ugh. Talking about church stuff. Football can't come soon enough.
            In my 16 years of BYU message boards (that sounds depressing) I don't recall a spring football camp with less discussion that this one. Maybe it's because our spring QB is a guy who doesn't have any elgibility.
            "Sure, I fought. I had to fight all my life just to survive. They were all against me. Tried every dirty trick to cut me down, but I beat the bastards and left them in the ditch."

            - Ty Cobb

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
              It seems to me that the reason traditional LDS apologetics (Dan Peterson, et al) have failed so miserably is that they are operating under the wrong paradigm. They view everything as literal historical truth and operate as if part of the official narrative ends up getting disproven, the entire structure will collapse. Thus you see them not willing to concede an inch, even arguing against things like the documentary hypothesis for the OT. Such an approach is doomed to failure.
              Thanks for sharing. I always find these book snippets enlightening. I wonder if part of the problem to traditional LDS apologetics and Biblical literalism is if a different paradigm is embraced, what would that mean to the Book of Mormon? Is the Book of Mormon literal? How literal? Could Mormonism adopt an emerging paradigm to the Bible and keep an earlier paradigm to the Book of Mormon? Lots to think about.
              “Not the victory but the action. Not the goal but the game. In the deed the glory.”
              "All things are measured against Nebraska." falafel

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Paperback Writer View Post
                Thanks for sharing. I always find these book snippets enlightening. I wonder if part of the problem to traditional LDS apologetics and Biblical literalism is if a different paradigm is embraced, what would that mean to the Book of Mormon? Is the Book of Mormon literal? How literal? Could Mormonism adopt an emerging paradigm to the Bible and keep an earlier paradigm to the Book of Mormon? Lots to think about.
                Absolutely, it is more challenging to adopt the "emerging paradigm" within Mormonism due to our unique origins and scripture. However, I think the overall concept of approaching religion through a practical/metaphorical lens is healthy (and more sustainable) for any belief system.
                "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
                "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
                "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by YOhio View Post
                  Ugh. Talking about church stuff. Football can't come soon enough.
                  You are in luck, my friend! It turns out that the Topper is leading a fascinating discussion about the Quincy Lewis hire over in the b-ball forum. If you are lucky, BYU71 will weigh in with his opinion on the Honor Code.
                  "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
                  "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
                  "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    How about something like, The Book of Mormon is the literal translation of the culturally colored relationship between an ancient people and their/our God?

                    You would think that mormons, of all people, understand the potential risk of the tradition of plenary inspiration, as far as the works are translated correctly.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
                      You are in luck, my friend! It turns out that the Topper is leading a fascinating discussion about the Quincy Lewis hire over in the b-ball forum. If you are lucky, BYU71 will weigh in with his opinion on the Honor Code.
                      If it will help, I can "weigh in" with commentary on BYU's opening day opponent in a thread titled "The Heart of Christianity". That always seems to be well received on CS.
                      “Not the victory but the action. Not the goal but the game. In the deed the glory.”
                      "All things are measured against Nebraska." falafel

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
                        It seems to me that the reason traditional LDS apologetics (Dan Peterson, et al) have failed so miserably is that they are operating under the wrong paradigm. They view everything as literal historical truth and operate as if part of the official narrative ends up getting disproven, the entire structure will collapse. Thus you see them not willing to concede an inch, even arguing against things like the documentary hypothesis for the OT. Such an approach is doomed to failure.
                        I actually think DCP and much of the FARMS crowd (or whatever they're called) are actually incredibly liberal, if we're talking about contravening the plain sense of the text in order to make one's interpretation fit with whatever archaeology (or whatever your preferred branch of science may be) is telling you. Take the limited geography theory, for example. It's not only an article of faith for that crowd, they've managed to wring concessions out of a church hierarchy which has become much more guarded in how it describes the inhabitants of the ancient Americas, especially when compared with how early church leaders regarded the BoM. I think the FARMers (rightly) recognized that the hemispheric model is not tenable for a variety of reasons that any archaeologist could readily summarize. They've raised the white flag and have simply retreated back a few steps and taken it (temporarily?) down.

                        Actually, the true conservatives, when it comes to sussing out the "actual locations" of BoM events, are more guarded about committing themselves to any particular hypothesis (or even whether there are any locations to be sought) and are more inclined to withhold judgment on irrelevant "empirical" matters about which the text does not invite us to ask. In my view, the real conservatives are the ones that are most reticent about extrapolating from the text to empirical claims regarding Mesoamerica (or anywhere else). There's really no meaningful difference between FARMers and the strawmen "liberals" that they love to attack. One group has said, "Mesoamerica or nowhere" and the other group has just said, "nowhere." A true textual conservative sees no need to draw inferences about geography one way or the other based on the "evidence" of the text.
                        Nothing lasts, but nothing is lost.
                        --William Blake, via Shpongle

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Harry Tic View Post
                          I actually think DCP and much of the FARMS crowd (or whatever they're called) are actually incredibly liberal, if we're talking about contravening the plain sense of the text in order to make one's interpretation fit with whatever archaeology (or whatever your preferred branch of science may be) is telling you. Take the limited geography theory, for example. It's not only an article of faith for that crowd, they've managed to wring concessions out of a church hierarchy which has become much more guarded in how it describes the inhabitants of the ancient Americas, especially when compared with how early church leaders regarded the BoM. I think the FARMers (rightly) recognized that the hemispheric model is not tenable for a variety of reasons that any archaeologist could readily summarize. They've raised the white flag and have simply retreated back a few steps and taken it (temporarily?) down.

                          Actually, the true conservatives, when it comes to sussing out the "actual locations" of BoM events, are more guarded about committing themselves to any particular hypothesis (or even whether there are any locations to be sought) and are more inclined to withhold judgment on irrelevant "empirical" matters about which the text does not invite us to ask. In my view, the real conservatives are the ones that are most reticent about extrapolating from the text to empirical claims regarding Mesoamerica (or anywhere else). There's really no meaningful difference between FARMers and the strawmen "liberals" that they love to attack. One group has said, "Mesoamerica or nowhere" and the other group has just said, "nowhere." A true textual conservative sees no need to draw inferences about geography one way or the other based on the "evidence" of the text.
                          Excellent post.

                          And BTW, this illustrates precisely why Borg is reluctant to use the terms "liberal" and "conservative" when it comes to a religious discussion. In addition to being highly charged labels, they mean different things in different contexts.
                          "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
                          "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
                          "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Katy Lied View Post
                            How about something like, The Book of Mormon is the literal translation of the culturally colored relationship between an ancient people and their/our God?

                            You would think that mormons, of all people, understand the potential risk of the tradition of plenary inspiration, as far as the works are translated correctly.
                            This brings up an interesting point. That well-known phrase is great in the sense that it recognizes that scripture and revelation are messy processes that are a mixture of the human and the divine. On the other hand, it can be problematic because it promotes the notion that somewhere in the past there was a pristine edition of the biblical texts that was the pure unadulterated word of God and that the only human part of the bible is errors of translation. That is just not a workable model.
                            "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
                            "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
                            "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              what exactly is the pure unadulterated word of God? I can understand the red letter sentences, but the bible describes misunderstandings between people, hurt feelings of people, colloquialisms (like piss against the wall), cultural oddities and other human foibles. Is it that the description of these human characteristics is God's rendition of what happened? Why would God speak in such a colloquial voice to echo the voice of the people that he interacted with? Or the voice of the people who edited the transcripts of the people he interacted with?

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