New LDS Church Website: Mormons and Gays

[cougjunkie]

It is certainly an improvement, but far from adequate. It is basically saying to homosexuals, well you can choose happiness here on earth or you can be happy in the eternities, you can't have both.

You are also right that it would cause a faith crisis among the rank and file that hate homosexuals, similar to the racists with the change on the Priesthood ban. Yes, I realize and am not implying that hatred of homosexuals or racism is not isolated to LDS people.

Of course someone hanging on with the LDS church who is homosexual will be thrilled with this compromise, it is much better than the current if you get married you are excommunicated policy.

I prefer happiness in the eternities.

[Shaka]

It is certainly an improvement, but far from adequate. It is basically saying to homosexuals, well you can choose happiness here on earth or you can be happy in the eternities, you can't have both.

You are also right that it would cause a faith crisis among the rank and file that hate homosexuals, similar to the racists with the change on the Priesthood ban. Yes, I realize and am not implying that hatred of homosexuals or racism is not isolated to LDS people.

Of course someone hanging on with the LDS church who is homosexual will be thrilled with this compromise, it is much better than the current if you get married you are excommunicated policy.

Sorry dude. as much as you like to wear the SJW badge you aren't the one who gets to decide its adequacy.

If enough LDS gay couples can get behind something like this they will tell the rest of you to STFU.

[imanihonjin]

It is certainly an improvement, but far from adequate. It is basically saying to homosexuals, well you can choose happiness here on earth or you can be happy in the eternities, you can't have both.

You are also right that it would cause a faith crisis among the rank and file that hate homosexuals, similar to the racists with the change on the Priesthood ban. Yes, I realize and am not implying that hatred of homosexuals or racism is not isolated to LDS people.

Of course someone hanging on with the LDS church who is homosexual will be thrilled with this compromise, it is much better than the current if you get married you are excommunicated policy.

Can you knock this shit off? Those in the church who "hate" homosexuals are in the significant minority and make the actual rank and file cringe.

[CardiacCoug]

Personally I think the church will eventually reach a happy medium where the standard is the temple for hetero marriage and the ability for homosexuals to be married civilly and still be in full fellowship. Until we reach this happy medium there will continue to be significant growing pains.

Yep it wouldn't surprise me if this happens within 10 years from now. Not that difficult IMO to rationalize the idea that as long as you are only having sex within a legal marriage situation then you're good as far as church membership.

Totally agree that is a reasonable compromise that gives a nod to the abstract theological construct and to some semblance of equality.

I mean for hells sake if the Church can keep you out of the temple for coffee and alcohol I think it's OK if they keep you out because you are having gay sex. It's pretty arbitrary.

[Shaka]

Yep it wouldn't surprise me if this happens within 10 years from now. Not that difficult IMO to rationalize the idea that as long as you are only having sex within a legal marriage situation then you're good as far as church membership.

Totally agree that is a reasonable compromise that gives a nod to the abstract theological construct and to some semblance of equality.

I mean for hells sake if the Church can keep you out of the temple for coffee and alcohol I think it's OK if they keep you out because you are having gay sex. It's pretty arbitrary.

Good points. I don't consider hetero couples that are married civilly to be fornicators so it's not a stretch to think the same of those in gay marriages.

[Joe Public]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7795746.html

[Shaka]

I was wondering when that was going to pop up. That was a publicity stunt pure and simple.

[Commando]

I was wondering when that was going to pop up. That was a publicity stunt pure and simple.

Yeah. I unwittingly got myself into arguing that on fb. Yeah- I'm sure that she was just nervous so she had that written out on paper, and somebody was filming it b/c she was so brave and it was all her idea and not put up to it by anybody. And she fully edited it with subtitles and put it up on youtube right after. My, that's a precocious 12-year-old!

[BigFatMeanie]

I was wondering when that was going to pop up. That was a publicity stunt pure and simple.

I think 12 is pretty early to completely understand complex issues around sexuality and specifically sexual orientation but I'm not gay so what do I know?

Another interesting quote from the article was from the Mom: "I was angry that they chose to hurt her for whatever reason they had."

This brings up a whole host of interesting questions about who is "choosing" what when multiple parties are in an interaction and one or more of them comes away from it hurt.

[Shaka]

Here mom is an ex or disaffected Mo. They invited people to come witness what was about to go down and had someone film the talk. They were hoping to provoke a reaction. It's unfortunate that, whether she's a lesbian or not, this young girl was used as a pawn.

When I first heard about this prior to watching the video I was initially outraged that some dumb counselor would cut the girl off as she was giving a heartfelt testimony about being gay. That ended about ten seconds into the video when I saw she was reading a statement that was most likely written, or at least heavily influenced, by someone else.

[LVAllen]

Yeah, testimony meeting isn't really the place for prepared statements. From JD's FB page, apparently, she is a member of an LDS support group, and she was planning to share the video there. Which leads to the question: if she had a prepared statement, why not simply read it at the support group rather than show a video? Yeah, it's a publicity stunt.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Ugh. Using a 12-yr-old kid to generate some outrage porn for social media. That's disgusting.

[Soccermom]

Here mom is an ex or disaffected Mo. They invited people to come witness what was about to go down and had someone film the talk. They were hoping to provoke a reaction. It's unfortunate that, whether she's a lesbian or not, this young girl was used as a pawn.

When I first heard about this prior to watching the video I was initially outraged that some dumb counselor would cut the girl off as she was giving a heartfelt testimony about being gay. That ended about ten seconds into the video when I saw she was reading a statement that was most likely written, or at least heavily influenced, by someone else.

Also pretty disgusting that they blurred out everyone's faces except the SP who cut her off. What a horrible position to put him in and I wonder how much emotional manipulation was used to get that girl to stand up in testimony meeting. I am reading a lot of people on Facebook outraged that anyone would dare say it is a set-up, but I'm not buying it. I think it was planned and they wanted to create outrage. They probably would have been disappointed if the leader hadn't cut her off.

[Uncle Ted]

I have to wonder, given the press and publicity generated, if this will turn into a "copy-cat" thing and the same sort of stunt will be coming to a ward near me on an "open-mic" Sunday. Normally I look forward to open-mic Sunday but if it turns into a "pride parade" every time then I might be more inclined just to stay home, especially with the NFL football season starting back up.

[PaloAltoCougar]

I expect a letter reaffirming Church policy against recording/videotaping Sacrament and F&T meetings, except in rare circumstances and only with the presiding officer's permission. I'm pretty liberal in my interpretation of policy, but the problems of allowing videographing a testimony seem pretty clear. There's enough showboating now during a meeting that's supposed to promote humility and sensitivity to spiritual things. Imagine if everyone knew their testimony was going to show up on FB.