Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Why Mormons cleave

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Why Mormons cleave

    Mormons leave the church for a lot of obvious reasons. These include the fraudulence in respect of historicity (ongoing as well as past fraudulence), the inistitutional anti-intellectualism, the historical racism (actually current racism given the failure to come to terms with history and repudiate racist teachings by men adored by the LDS church), current sexism and homophobia, being generally on the wrong side of all the great civil liberties issues in our country's history (what could be more important for prophets to get right?), distaste for paying tithing, sheer agony and boredome of meetings (see, e.g., the what I learned in church this week thread), the Lord of the Flies culture including local leadership culture (ever debriefed anyone who's been in a church court (no, I haven't nor would I attend)?), the lack of artistry anywhere, indeed a pervasive hostility for much artistry, puritanical attitudes toward some of the finer humanistic aspects of life (like wine, lattes, sex, etc.); in short, a will and desire to live fully, to suck from the marrow of life. These are all excellent reasons to leave the LDS church, and I have only scratched the surface of reasons to leave. Any one of them should suffice.

    The more interesting question BY FAR is why anyone stays. Seriously.

    I went on a mission, was a Zone leader (after 10 months!), was active for 23 years. I was even a ward clerk. Here is my best experience in an LDS church, and it happened after I apostatized: When I blessed my oldest daughter. This is the only ordinance I ever performed on my children in an LDS church. For some reason I agreed to do it. All of us brothers and fathers and brothers-in-laws held this tiny six pound girl in the palms of our hands. All of a sudden she started to scream. I winced and started to talk. Suddenly, at the sound of my voice, she went absolutely silent, our eyes locked, and she stayed that way till the end of the blessing. That is my greatest experience in an LDS Church, and it has nothing to do with LDS per se. It has to do with her hearing my voice through the previous ten or so months, and the unconditional love of a young father for his daughter and oldest child.

    After many years of intense experience with the LDS church, this is the thread that connects me to it in a positive way, and it must be weighed against all the negative stuff some of which I have noted above.

    The most interesting thing of all is why progressive Mormons stay. They may be the most inscrutable people of all in the LDS orbit.
    Last edited by SeattleUte; 06-19-2012, 01:22 PM.
    When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.

    --Jonathan Swift

  • #2
    Nice contranym usage there.
    "Wuap's "problem" is that he is smart & principled & committed to a moral course of action. His actions are supposed to reflect his ethical code.
    The rest of us rarely bother to think about our actions." --Solon

    Comment


    • #3
      You should have done, "Why Mormons Louvre"

      Fitter. Happier. More Productive.

      sigpic

      Comment


      • #4
        Nice post, SU. I agree. Baby blessings are beautiful.
        "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
        "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
        "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

        Comment


        • #5
          Some people are able to resolve their cognitive dissonance. That whole faith thing, I guess.
          what I am is what I am and I does what I does.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by SeattleUte View Post
            Here is my best experience in an LDS church, and it happened after I apostatized: When I blessed my oldest daughter. This is the only ordinance I ever performed on my children in an LDS church. For some reason I agreed to do it. All of us brothers and fathers and brothers-in-laws held this tiny six pound girl in the palms of our hands. All of a sudden she started to scream. I winced and started to talk. Suddenly, at the sound of my voice, she went absolutely silent, our eyes locked, and she stayed that way till the end of the blessing. That is my greatest experience in an LDS Church, and it has nothing to do with LDS per se. It has to do with her hearing my voice through the previous ten or so months, and the unconditional love of a young father for his daughter and oldest child.

            After many years of intense experience with the LDS church, this is the thread that connects me to it in a positive way, and it must be weighed against all the negative stuff some of which I have noted above.
            Good post. There is something nice about blessings (baby and other father's blessings) just from a non-religious, human standpoint. Having to stand there and express my hopes and dreams for my kids is good for me. And it's a bonding experience. My wife makes me give the kids blessings before the first day of school and even though it seems corny the kids love it and it's a nice experience for me, too. And the baby blessings are a nice bonding experience for all the men in the family and for men with the kids (where bonding doesn't happen as easily as between the women and the kids). It's a way for the men to think a little bit about what what they want their kids to become and what they are doing to help their kids and nieces, nephews, etc. succeed.

            Comment


            • #7
              A great scene from the Roots miniseries: The father of baby Kunta Kinte raises his infant child high above his head under a starlit sky and declares something like, "Kunta Kinte, behold the only thing greater than yourself!," a very pithy and inspiring father's blessing. I wanted to do that with our firstborn, but it was inside, and the chapel ceiling wasn't very impressive.

              Comment


              • #8
                I have been wrestling with this very question for a long time...

                I no longer believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet, at least in the sense that he is celebrated by the church. I think the Book of Mormon has some inspired things in its pages, but I do not believe the origin story as claimed. I see the first presidency and quorum of the 12 as generally good dudes that do the best they can with limited information (I haven't gotten to the stage where they're horrible monsters hell bent on controlling the minds of the faithful - maybe next year). I disagree vehemently with the church's stance on homosexual issues and am troubled by the race issue and polygamy.

                That said, I go every week. I even teach Sunday School and stick to the lesson plan that's outlined in the manual. I pay my tithing without hesitation. I hold a temple recommend and even go every so often. So why do I do it?

                Well, every time I decide that the church is a total lie and a waste of my time and I'd very much like to enjoy a nice Hennessy on the rocks on a Sunday afternoon, something happens to make me decide to stay. Usually it's a feeling I get while I'm at church, especially in those quiet moments of reflection. Like the feeling I get when I'm done teaching each Sunday. I pour my heart and soul into creating an environment where people can be inspired. I feel that I owe that to them since I accepted the calling, even if I tend to gloss over things of which I no longer have a firm testimony.

                As much as I want to pull away, I can't deny the feeling that I get when I walk through those doors and I can talk about important issues and problems with other people. Call it the spirit. Call it a sense of community. Whatever you want to call it, I can't deny that feeling. I love the community of the church. I love that the church is an apparatus for service because I don't feel like a whole person if I'm not serving others on a somewhat regular basis. But it's the feeling that keeps me coming back, no matter how hard I want to kick against the pricks so to speak.

                So that's why I stay now. In all honesty, my faith has been fading pretty steadily, and I might not stay forever. After all, the cognitive dissonance can be taxing. But for now, I choose the church - warts and all. There is still a lot of good that comes out of that organization.
                Machine wrapped with butter.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by SeattleUte View Post

                  The most interesting thing of all is why progressive Mormons stay. They may be the most inscrutable people of all in the LDS orbit.
                  They stay because of the paradox at the center of Christianity--self-realization through self-sacrifice.

                  You're welcome.
                  We all trust our own unorthodoxies.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by TripletDaddy View Post
                    You should have done, "Why Mormons Louvre"



                    Nice.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I still maintain this is a much more interestign question than why Mormons leave. I'm now convinced of this more than ever. But it's never the most interesting threads that get the most attention on cuf, is it.
                      When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.

                      --Jonathan Swift

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by SeattleUte View Post
                        I still maintain this is a much more interestign question than why Mormons leave. I'm now convinced of this more than ever. But it's never the most interesting threads that get the most attention on cuf, is it.
                        DO you find that all the really interesting threads that get ignored are started by you? Just curious.
                        PLesa excuse the tpyos.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by creekster View Post
                          DO you find that all the really interesting threads that get ignored are started by you? Just curious.
                          ABSOLUTELY NOT.
                          When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.

                          --Jonathan Swift

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Because God tells them to. Duh.



                            Comment


                            • #15
                              It obviously has nothing to do with free wine on Sunday.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X