Why did Judas

[Hallelujah]

have to do what he did? Didn't everyone in the countryside know who Jesus was and where he was? Did it really take a Judas?

[Indy Coug]

Since he got paid for what he did, it was obviously both necessary and worth a sum of money to those who wanted his "services".

[Brian]

i've wonderd this too and never heard a good explanation.

[falafel]

have to do what he did? Didn't everyone in the countryside know who Jesus was and where he was? Did it really take a Judas?

I imagine most people knew who he was, but I'll bet that very few people knew where he was that night. It was late, it was dark, and it would have been pretty hard to keep tabs on people in those conditions.

[SoCalCoug]

Maybe to the Romans, the Jews all looked alike?

[Brian]

I imagine most people knew who he was, but I'll bet that very few people knew where he was that night. It was late, it was dark, and it would have been pretty hard to keep tabs on people in those conditions.

why that night?
was there a rush to get him captured? maybe that is part of the story we don't know...

[wuapinmon]

Jesus the Christ, Chap. 33,

CHAPTER 33 THE LAST SUPPER AND THE BETRAYAL

THE PRIESTLY CONSPIRATORS AND THE TRAITOR

As the time for the annual Feast of the Passover approached, and
particularly during the two days immediately preceding the beginning of the
festival, the chief priests, scribes, and elders of the people, in short the
Sanhedrin and the entire priestly party, conspired persistently together as to
the best manner of taking Jesus into custody and putting Him to death. At one
of these gatherings of evil counsel, which was held at the palace of the high
priest, Caiaphas, it was decided that Jesus should be taken by subtlety if
possible, as the probable effect of an open arrest would be an uprising of the
people. The rulers feared especially an outbreak by the Galileans, who had a
provincial pride in the prominence of Jesus as one of their countrymen, and
many of whom were then in Jerusalem. It was further concluded and for the same
reasons, that the Jewish custom of making impressive examples of notable
offenders by executing public punishment upon them at times of great general
assemblages, be set aside in the case of Jesus; therefore the conspirators
said: "Not on the feast day, lest there be an uproar among the people."

On earlier occasions they had made futile attempts to get Jesus into
their hands; and they were naturally dubious as to the outcome of their later
machinations. At this juncture they were encouraged and gladdened in their
wicked plots by the appearance of an unexpected ally. Judas Iscariot, one of
the Twelve, sought an audience with these rulers of the Jews, and infamously
offered to betray his Lord into their hands. Under the impulse of diabolic
avarice, which, however, was probably but a secondary element in the real
cause of his perfidious treachery, he bargained to sell his Master for money,
and chaffered with the priestly purchasers over the price of the Savior's
blood. "What will ye give me?" he asked; "and they covenanted with him for
thirty pieces of silver." This amount, approximately seventeen dollars in our
money, but of many times greater purchasing power with the Jews in that day
than now with us, was the price fixed by the law as that of a slave; it was
also the foreseen sum of the blood-money to be paid for the Lord's betrayal.
That the silver was actually paid to Judas, either at this first interview or
at some later meeting between the traitor and the priests, is demonstrated by
after events.

He had pledged himself to the blackest deed of treachery of which man is
capable, and from that hour he sought the opportunity of superseding his
infamous promise by its more villainous fulfilment. We are yet to be afflicted
by other glimpses of the evil-hearted Iscariot in the course of this dread
chronicle of tragedy and perdition; for the present let it be said that before
Judas sold Christ to the Jews, he had sold himself to the devil; he had become
Satan's serf, and did his master's bidding.

In saying to the Twelve, whose feet He had washed, "Ye are clean," the
Lord had specified an exception by His after remark, "but not all." John the
recorder, takes care to explain that Jesus had in mind the traitor, and,
"therefore said he, Ye are not all clean." The guilty Iscariot had received
without protest the Lord's service in the washing of his recreant feet, though
after the ablution he was spiritually more filthy than before. When Jesus had
again sat down, the burden of His knowledge concerning the treacherous heart
of Judas again found expression. "I speak not of you all," He said, "I know
whom I have chosen: but that the scripture may be fulfilled, He that eateth
bread with me hath lifted up his heel against me." The Lord was intent on
impressing the fact of His foreknowledge as to what was to come, so that when
the terrible development was an accomplished fact, the apostles would realize
that thereby the scriptures had been fulfilled. Troubled in spirit, He
reiterated the dreadful assertion that one of those present would betray Him.
Peter made signs to John, who occupied the place next to Jesus and was at that
moment leaning his head on the Lord's breast, that he asked which of them was
the traitor. To John's whispered inquiry the Lord replied: "He it is, to whom
I shall give a sop, when I have dipped it."

There was nothing unusual for a person at table, particularly the host,
to dip a piece of bread into the dish of gravy or savory mixture, and hand it
to another. Such action on the part of Jesus attracted no general attention.
He dipped the morsel of bread and gave it to Judas Iscariot, with the words:
"That thou doest, do quickly." The others understood the Lord's remark as an
instruction to Judas to attend to some duty or go upon some errand of ordinary
kind, perhaps to purchase something for the further celebration of the
Passover, or to carry gifts to some of the poor, for Judas was the treasurer
of the party and "had the bag." But Iscariot understood. His heart was all
the more hardened by the discovery that Jesus knew of his infamous Plans, and
he was maddened by the humiliation he felt in the Master's presence. After the
sop, which he had opened his mouth to receive from the Lord's hand, "Satan
entered into him" and asserted malignant mastership. Judas went out
immediately, abandoning forever the blessed company of his brethren and the
Lord. John chronicles the traitor's departure with the terse and ominous
remark, "and it was night."

THE BETRAYAL AND THE ARREST

During the period of the Lord's last and most loving communion with the
Eleven, Judas had been busy in his treacherous conspiracy with the priestly
authorities. It is probable that the determination to make the arrest that
night was reached when Judas reported that Jesus was within the city walls and
might easily be apprehended. The Jewish rulers assembled a body of temple
guardsmen or police, and obtained a band of Roman Soldiers under command of a
tribune; this band or cohort was probably a detachment from the garrison of
Antonia commissioned for the work of the night on requisition of the chief
priests. This company of men and officers representing a combination of
ecclesiastical and military authority, set forth in the night with Judas at
their head, intent on the arrest of Jesus. They were equipped with lanterns,
torches, and weapons. It is probable that they were first conducted to the
house in which Judas had left his fellow apostles and the Lord, when the
traitor had been dismissed; and that finding the little company had gone out,
Judas led the multitude to Gethsemane, for he knew the place, and knew also
that "Jesus ofttimes resorted thither with his disciples."

While Jesus was yet speaking to the Eleven whom He had roused from
slumber with the announcement that the betrayer was at hand, Judas and the
multitude approached. As a preconcerted sign of identification the recreant
Iscariot, with treacherous duplicity, came up with a hypocritical show of
affection, saying, "Hail, master," and profaned his Lord's sacred face with a
kiss. That Jesus understood the treacherous significance of the act appears
in His pathetic, yet piercing and condemning reproach: "Judas, betrayest thou
the Son of man with a kiss?" Then, applying the title with which the other
apostles had been honored, the Lord said: Friend, do that for which thou art
come. It was a reiteration of the behest given at the Supper table, "That
thou doest, do quickly."

[wuapinmon]

In a many dark hour
I've been thinkin' about this
That Jesus Christ
Was betrayed by a kiss
But I can't think for you
You'll have to decide
Whether Judas Iscariot
Had God on his side.
— Bob Dylan,
“With God on Our Side

I'm examining the story from a secular position here. I think we could possibly call Judas's betrayal the single-most important use of free will by a non-deity in the history of the world.

James Talmage wrote that if Judas had remained faithful to Jesus and worthy of his calling as an Apostle, someone else would betray Jesus:

Had Judas been true to the right, other means than his perfidy would have been operated to bring the Lamb to the slaughter. His ordination to the Apostleship placed him in possession of opportunity and privilege above that of the uncalled and un-ordained; and with such blessed possibility of achievement in the service of God came corresponding capability to fall. (650)

Presupposing a just deity (as Christianity typically does), if Judas had not had the freedom to choose his own destiny, the mission of Jesus would have been in vain; a truly just God cannot command obedience and then compel his subject to disobey a previous commandment against disobedience. According to this view, because Judas was given esoteric knowledge, and because he knew that Jesus was the son of God, betraying him was all the more severe, all the more cruel, and all the more prejudicial to his eternal soul, although it should be noted that the Apostle Peter also denied Christ on three separate occasions. Why Peter is forgiven and Judas has been vilified as Perdition for centuries is a source of debate.

If we think of Judas' actions as necessary and 'righteous' in the way that some Gnostics (e.g Carpocrates) viewed him, then his sacrifice of eternal condemnation is greater than Jesus' dying for our sins. That Judas chose the sins bereft of any virtue--abuse of confidence and betrayal--only further strengthens his effort to “mount to the highest heaven” in a Carpocratian version of salvation. Under an orthodox system, Judas holds no hope for salvation. According to Chapter Six of Paul’s Epistle to the Romans (6:16-23) the wages of sin is death. Death here means physical death (as in a suggested hastening of death due to the ill effects of sin on the body) and spiritual death. Spiritual death means the separation of the soul from the presence of God, because only the righteous may enter into the kingdom of heaven (Matt 5:20). From an orthodox standpoint, God’s virtue and righteousness do not increase because his creations sin, meaning that sinning does not help God become more righteous. Therefore under an orthodox system, Judas is hell bound. Only under certain Gnostic systems can Judas’s actions be considered righteous and salvation-worthy.

Man is an inherently un-divine creation, so a man who is incapable of sin is a contradiction; therefore a God who seeks to redeem man must rightly suffer endless agony in order to atone for his creations’ sins.

The prophecy in Isaiah 53:2-3 of a God who is “despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief” can easily be applied to Judas’s future and eternal impending agony, as well as general depictions of Judas in the scriptures, apologies, fiction, and art. The appeal of this scripture to orthodox Christians is that they are not of the “world,” meaning that they see with spiritual eyes and would be able to perceive the beauty inherent in a beaten, scourged, and dying man. Gnostics might interpret that same verse as saying that they possess the gnosis to know who the true Savior was.

The scriptural depictions of Jesus during the last twenty-four hours of his life include emotional and physical trauma so severe that he bled from every pore, beatings, scourging, the crown of thorns pressed into his head, and the slow suffocation of crucifixion. The Christian interprets Isaiah’s prophecies as describing Christ as a man filthy and covered in his own blood when he receives the Judas Kiss. After that, he is beaten, and the crowd rejects Pilate’s offer to free him. This story appeals to the orthodox reader.

The Synoptic Gospels all put Judas last in order of the Apostles. Mark always brackets his descriptions of Judas with some comment about the future betrayal (Mark 3:19). While eating dinner, Judas goes to sell out his brother, the same way that his ancestor Judah, during dinner, sold his youngest brother Joseph into slavery in Egypt. Joseph’s time in Egypt was crucial to the survival of the Jewish people during the horrendous famine of seven years that Joseph foresaw. Likewise, Judas’s time in Hell is crucial to the survival of humanity.

Judas is a doppelganger of Christ, he does everything that Jesus does but without the nobility--with that aversion to virtue that Antonio Conselheiro held--involved in doing something for the promise of eternal glory. So, God could have chosen any person to merit the condemnation necessary to annihilate himself and redeem mankind: Rurik, Pythagoras, Alexander, or Jesus, but he chose Judas, because no act could be any crueler and more worthy of eternal hellfire than to betray the savior of the world.

The compelling factor in the Judas Kiss comes from the betrayal by an Apostle, one of only twelve people called in the whole world, chosen specifically to testify of the divinity and mission of Jesus. This deceit is far more bitter, cutting, and symbolic than his betrayal by anyone else, excepting his own family. Jesus had thousands of disciples but he chose the Twelve as his special messengers to be at his side at all times. A kiss signifies love, or at least trust, and betraying someone by a kiss represents a potent act of treachery. The Judas Kiss, from a literary standpoint makes for good storytelling as an especially deceitful way to betray someone.

[wuapinmon]

bump

[YOhio]

I'm examining the story from a secular position here. I think we could possibly call Judas's betrayal the single-most important use of free will by a non-deity in the history of the world.

James Talmage wrote that if Judas had remained faithful to Jesus and worthy of his calling as an Apostle, someone else would betray Jesus:


Presupposing a just deity (as Christianity typically does), if Judas had not had the freedom to choose his own destiny, the mission of Jesus would have been in vain; a truly just God cannot command obedience and then compel his subject to disobey a previous commandment against disobedience. According to this view, because Judas was given esoteric knowledge, and because he knew that Jesus was the son of God, betraying him was all the more severe, all the more cruel, and all the more prejudicial to his eternal soul, although it should be noted that the Apostle Peter also denied Christ on three separate occasions. Why Peter is forgiven and Judas has been vilified as Perdition for centuries is a source of debate.

If we think of Judas' actions as necessary and 'righteous' in the way that some Gnostics (e.g Carpocrates) viewed him, then his sacrifice of eternal condemnation is greater than Jesus' dying for our sins. That Judas chose the sins bereft of any virtue--abuse of confidence and betrayal--only further strengthens his effort to “mount to the highest heaven” in a Carpocratian version of salvation. Under an orthodox system, Judas holds no hope for salvation. According to Chapter Six of Paul’s Epistle to the Romans (6:16-23) the wages of sin is death. Death here means physical death (as in a suggested hastening of death due to the ill effects of sin on the body) and spiritual death. Spiritual death means the separation of the soul from the presence of God, because only the righteous may enter into the kingdom of heaven (Matt 5:20). From an orthodox standpoint, God’s virtue and righteousness do not increase because his creations sin, meaning that sinning does not help God become more righteous. Therefore under an orthodox system, Judas is hell bound. Only under certain Gnostic systems can Judas’s actions be considered righteous and salvation-worthy.

Man is an inherently un-divine creation, so a man who is incapable of sin is a contradiction; therefore a God who seeks to redeem man must rightly suffer endless agony in order to atone for his creations’ sins.

The prophecy in Isaiah 53:2-3 of a God who is “despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief” can easily be applied to Judas’s future and eternal impending agony, as well as general depictions of Judas in the scriptures, apologies, fiction, and art. The appeal of this scripture to orthodox Christians is that they are not of the “world,” meaning that they see with spiritual eyes and would be able to perceive the beauty inherent in a beaten, scourged, and dying man. Gnostics might interpret that same verse as saying that they possess the gnosis to know who the true Savior was.

The scriptural depictions of Jesus during the last twenty-four hours of his life include emotional and physical trauma so severe that he bled from every pore, beatings, scourging, the crown of thorns pressed into his head, and the slow suffocation of crucifixion. The Christian interprets Isaiah’s prophecies as describing Christ as a man filthy and covered in his own blood when he receives the Judas Kiss. After that, he is beaten, and the crowd rejects Pilate’s offer to free him. This story appeals to the orthodox reader.

The Synoptic Gospels all put Judas last in order of the Apostles. Mark always brackets his descriptions of Judas with some comment about the future betrayal (Mark 3:19). While eating dinner, Judas goes to sell out his brother, the same way that his ancestor Judah, during dinner, sold his youngest brother Joseph into slavery in Egypt. Joseph’s time in Egypt was crucial to the survival of the Jewish people during the horrendous famine of seven years that Joseph foresaw. Likewise, Judas’s time in Hell is crucial to the survival of humanity.

Judas is a doppelganger of Christ, he does everything that Jesus does but without the nobility--with that aversion to virtue that Antonio Conselheiro held--involved in doing something for the promise of eternal glory. So, God could have chosen any person to merit the condemnation necessary to annihilate himself and redeem mankind: Rurik, Pythagoras, Alexander, or Jesus, but he chose Judas, because no act could be any crueler and more worthy of eternal hellfire than to betray the savior of the world.

The compelling factor in the Judas Kiss comes from the betrayal by an Apostle, one of only twelve people called in the whole world, chosen specifically to testify of the divinity and mission of Jesus. This deceit is far more bitter, cutting, and symbolic than his betrayal by anyone else, excepting his own family. Jesus had thousands of disciples but he chose the Twelve as his special messengers to be at his side at all times. A kiss signifies love, or at least trust, and betraying someone by a kiss represents a potent act of treachery. The Judas Kiss, from a literary standpoint makes for good storytelling as an especially deceitful way to betray someone.

bump

[SeattleUte]

bump

Shouldn't this be in the book section? Judas is a literary figure.

[SoCalCoug]

With long hair and beard, everyone looks like Jesus.

[YOhio]

I'm examining the story from a secular position here. I think we could possibly call Judas's betrayal the single-most important use of free will by a non-deity in the history of the world.

James Talmage wrote that if Judas had remained faithful to Jesus and worthy of his calling as an Apostle, someone else would betray Jesus:


Presupposing a just deity (as Christianity typically does), if Judas had not had the freedom to choose his own destiny, the mission of Jesus would have been in vain; a truly just God cannot command obedience and then compel his subject to disobey a previous commandment against disobedience. According to this view, because Judas was given esoteric knowledge, and because he knew that Jesus was the son of God, betraying him was all the more severe, all the more cruel, and all the more prejudicial to his eternal soul, although it should be noted that the Apostle Peter also denied Christ on three separate occasions. Why Peter is forgiven and Judas has been vilified as Perdition for centuries is a source of debate.

If we think of Judas' actions as necessary and 'righteous' in the way that some Gnostics (e.g Carpocrates) viewed him, then his sacrifice of eternal condemnation is greater than Jesus' dying for our sins. That Judas chose the sins bereft of any virtue--abuse of confidence and betrayal--only further strengthens his effort to “mount to the highest heaven” in a Carpocratian version of salvation. Under an orthodox system, Judas holds no hope for salvation. According to Chapter Six of Paul’s Epistle to the Romans (6:16-23) the wages of sin is death. Death here means physical death (as in a suggested hastening of death due to the ill effects of sin on the body) and spiritual death. Spiritual death means the separation of the soul from the presence of God, because only the righteous may enter into the kingdom of heaven (Matt 5:20). From an orthodox standpoint, God’s virtue and righteousness do not increase because his creations sin, meaning that sinning does not help God become more righteous. Therefore under an orthodox system, Judas is hell bound. Only under certain Gnostic systems can Judas’s actions be considered righteous and salvation-worthy.

Man is an inherently un-divine creation, so a man who is incapable of sin is a contradiction; therefore a God who seeks to redeem man must rightly suffer endless agony in order to atone for his creations’ sins.

The prophecy in Isaiah 53:2-3 of a God who is “despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief” can easily be applied to Judas’s future and eternal impending agony, as well as general depictions of Judas in the scriptures, apologies, fiction, and art. The appeal of this scripture to orthodox Christians is that they are not of the “world,” meaning that they see with spiritual eyes and would be able to perceive the beauty inherent in a beaten, scourged, and dying man. Gnostics might interpret that same verse as saying that they possess the gnosis to know who the true Savior was.

The scriptural depictions of Jesus during the last twenty-four hours of his life include emotional and physical trauma so severe that he bled from every pore, beatings, scourging, the crown of thorns pressed into his head, and the slow suffocation of crucifixion. The Christian interprets Isaiah’s prophecies as describing Christ as a man filthy and covered in his own blood when he receives the Judas Kiss. After that, he is beaten, and the crowd rejects Pilate’s offer to free him. This story appeals to the orthodox reader.

The Synoptic Gospels all put Judas last in order of the Apostles. Mark always brackets his descriptions of Judas with some comment about the future betrayal (Mark 3:19). While eating dinner, Judas goes to sell out his brother, the same way that his ancestor Judah, during dinner, sold his youngest brother Joseph into slavery in Egypt. Joseph’s time in Egypt was crucial to the survival of the Jewish people during the horrendous famine of seven years that Joseph foresaw. Likewise, Judas’s time in Hell is crucial to the survival of humanity.

Judas is a doppelganger of Christ, he does everything that Jesus does but without the nobility--with that aversion to virtue that Antonio Conselheiro held--involved in doing something for the promise of eternal glory. So, God could have chosen any person to merit the condemnation necessary to annihilate himself and redeem mankind: Rurik, Pythagoras, Alexander, or Jesus, but he chose Judas, because no act could be any crueler and more worthy of eternal hellfire than to betray the savior of the world.

The compelling factor in the Judas Kiss comes from the betrayal by an Apostle, one of only twelve people called in the whole world, chosen specifically to testify of the divinity and mission of Jesus. This deceit is far more bitter, cutting, and symbolic than his betrayal by anyone else, excepting his own family. Jesus had thousands of disciples but he chose the Twelve as his special messengers to be at his side at all times. A kiss signifies love, or at least trust, and betraying someone by a kiss represents a potent act of treachery. The Judas Kiss, from a literary standpoint makes for good storytelling as an especially deceitful way to betray someone.

**bump**

[Indy Coug]

Apocryphal documents either explicitly claim or imply that Judas was chosen by Christ for that role to help facilitate his own death to complete his mission on earth. A Google search will probably yield a quick hit for this, but I'm too damn lazy to provide the rest of you this service.

[Fiyero]

Apocryphal documents either explicitly claim or imply that Judas was chosen by Christ for that role to help facilitate his own death to complete his mission on earth.

In our day, do you believe that sometimes people with corrupt hearts are called to fill ward and stake leadership positions to help facilitate the ushering in of the second coming, due to wickedness in the kingdom? In other words, that some men are called with intent to fail?