Mormon Socialism

[LA Ute]

I just think we should remember that socialism is not the same thing as communism. Socialism rewards individual effort.

Correct. The differences between the UO and communism are stark. There's less of a yawning chasm between the UO and socialism.

[The Fourth Nephite]

I used to be very, very conservative. More so than Rush Limbaugh even. Since Reagan, I never liked any of the Republic nominees for President because they were all too liberal for me.

I've always worked hard. I've always worked long hours. I've built a successful small business that provides me with a comfortable lifestyle. I've always felt that America is a land of opportunity and that anybody that applies themselves can achieve success. I never felt much sympathy for those that were down on their luck because I figured it was their own fault and they were probably lazy.

Then I moved to a rural, extremely conservative part of Utah. I have since experience 6 years of living among decent, good people that say some crazy conservative stuff. And they say it often and without being asked. They say it in priesthood, at gospel doctrine and over the pulpit. They say it and they automatically assume that you and God agree 100% with them and it never enters their minds that we might not.

Some of the stuff the say is so crazy, that it has caused me to pause and logically examine my personal beliefs. For example; I've heard that if somebody doesn't have health insurance and they die from something that is treatable, it's OK because they die in Christ.

I get emails from ward members that contain outrageous facts and statistics that 2 minutes worth of research prove they are clearly wrong. Not just a little inaccurate, but very, very wrong to the point of being flat out lies (the people that send me the emails aren't lying, they just pass on what comes their way without analyzation - they just assume it's correct because it mirrors what they believe).

I've also observed that many Utahns are very conservative, except when it comes to them, and then their hand goes out. Many talk the talk, but don't walk the walk.

Health care has been a big issue for me. My family, self include, is generally healthy with no serious health problems. But I see that many people are uninsurable, many times through no fault of their own, except for bad luck. If you have moderate health issues, it can be near impossible to get insurance and then if you get something serious, you're just out of luck. People die and suffer because they can't get insurance.

I read the New Testament and the Book of Mormon and the sense I get from it is that we are our brother's keeper. Jesus encouraged us to sell our belongings and give to the poor. He also send render under Caesar what is Caesar's. The overall tone, or message I get is that we should love one another and help one another (I know, that's crazy talk).

It also seems clear to me, that the early leaders of the Church (in this dispensation) were somewhat liberal. There weren't many mormon republicans in the early days of the church. For example, see the below link for a statement signed by early lds leaders. To me, it seems pretty liberal:

http://www.ldscooperative.com/proclamation

So now I consider myself moderate, although my neighbors would consider me a flaming liberal. I think it's shameful that all American's do not receive adequate health care. But I also think that our system makes it too easy for the idler. I think there should be more accountability.

There's a guy in our ward that's on disability, but he recently spent a week at scout camp. I don't know what his disability is, but to me it seems if he's not too disabled to go to scout camp, he's not too disabled to work.

I also find it ironic, that many members of the church pay tithing and a generous fast offering and they care not a whit that some of their funds are re-distributed to Harlem, the Phillipines or Guatamala, but they're outraged by the reduced lunch program to poor children in their own community.

[wuapinmon]

Your post surprised me. When I was at BYU I was a bleeding-heart liberal. I graduated and went to Tulane and I was staunch unfeeling conservative. I didn't change at all, just my scene.




Guatemala.

[Moliere]

http://themormonworker.net/past-issu...mormon-church/


Not the most academic article but full of interesting tidbits all the same.

I graduated high school with Will Van Wagenen. He was a smart kid and I think went on to Harvard Divinity School. He's now a social activist in Utah and marches/preaches social justice.

On another note, there's a place in the Book of Mormon where the Nephites actually pass wealth redistribution laws, or at least one can infer that they passed such laws. I'll see if I can find the reference.

[The Fourth Nephite]

Your post surprised me. When I was at BYU I was a bleeding-heart liberal. I graduated and went to Tulane and I was staunch unfeeling conservative. I didn't change at all, just my scene.

Guatemala.

Yeah, Guatemala's hard to spell.

[Goatnapper'96]

Aren't these the fundamental differences?

• voluntary versus involuntary
• focused on God and Christ versus focused on the state (atheistic, if the discussion includes communism)
• private ownership = fundamental, versus private ownership = secondary to collective interests

I think the two biggest differences between the two is the ownership concept which is really rather minor IMO. The other is legitimacy. The whole concept of any governing system is a social contract. In a religious communalism there is essentially ubiquitous support for decision, thus maximum legitimacy, makers while in a government ran socialistic program that is not likely - except in China where we are reinforcing their subordination and continual rejection of political development because our campaigns are not very nice.

[falafel]

I graduated high school with Will Van Wagenen. He was a smart kid and I think went on to Harvard Divinity School. He's now a social activist in Utah and marches/preaches social justice.

Will's brother is a good friend of mine. You are right that Will went to Harvard Divinity.