The official Mormon Culture thread

[FMCoug]

I won't be participating here as I am too much of a lightning rod. But I'd love to see what others have to say.

Not that I chose "Mormon culture", not "Utah culture". The same phenomenon exists elsewhere in the church, it is just more pronounced in Utah due to the density of Mormons and the homogenous nature of the State. But my intent is for this to be about the culture at large, not just Utah. In fact, many of the negative experiences I have had relating to this have happened outside of the state of Utah.

Specific things I am interested in:

• What is the difference between Mormon culture, the Gospel, and "The Church"
  
• Is the culture a big part of the convert retention problem? If so, how big of a contributor?
  
• Why is it that (in my view) one is generally not considered a "stalwart" in the Church if they don't fit in culturally. Even if they are hold a temple recommend, home/visit teach, serve faithfully in callings, etc.

Lastly, I said I would not participate in this thread. So please do me the favor of not threadjacking it and making it about me. I am genuinely interested in others' take on these things.

[Mrs. Funk]

While I don't have time to answer your query at length just yet, I think the essay "Why the Church Is As True As the Gospel" by Eugene England is worth considering. It's certainly well-written (the author has an English literature background, which shows up more in some of his other personal essays), and has some interesting perspectives on one of the things I think people struggle with the most in being members of the LDS church.

The essay appears to have been reproduced more or less in its entirety on this blog post.

[Sullyute]

While I don't have time to answer your query at length just yet, I think the essay "Why the Church Is As True As the Gospel" by Eugene England is worth considering. It's certainly well-written (the author has an English literature background, which shows up more in some of his other personal essays), and has some interesting perspectives on one of the things I think people struggle with the most in being members of the LDS church.

The essay appears to have been reproduced more or less in its entirety on this blog post.

That is definitely a thought provoking talk. There is quite a bit that could be discussed but I liked this paragraph:

The Church is as "true" as—that is, as effective for salvation as—the gospel: the Church is where there is fruitful opposition, the place where its own revealed nature and inspired direction maintains an opposition between liberal and conservative values, faith and doubt, secure authority and frightening freedom, individual integrity and public responsibility—and thus where there will be misery as well as holiness, bad as well as good. And if we cannot stand the misery and the struggle, if we would prefer that the Church be "a compound in one" such as Lehi described (smooth and perfect and unchallenging, without internal opposition and thus "vanished away") rather than as it is, full of nagging human diversity and constant insistence that we perform ordinances and obey instructions and take seriously teachings embodying paradoxes that are not logically resolvable—if we refuse to lose ourselves wholeheartedly in such a school, then we will never know the redeeming truth of the Church. If we constantly ask, "What has the Church done for me?" we will not think to ask the much more important question, "What am I doing with the opportunities for service and self-challenge with which the Church provides me?" If we constantly approach the Church as consumers, we will never partake of its sweet and filling fruit. Only if we can lose our lives there will we find ourselves.

He seems to say that struggling against the very problems that we see in the church, including its culture, is what makes us grow individually. Personal growth comes from service and learning to love and accept those different from ourselves. Being active members of the church puts us in a better position for personal growth. I think this falls within the LA Ute school of religous thought.

[kccougar]

Like opening the blinds on a new window in the great and spacious building. Thanks, FM!

[UtahDan]

• What is the difference between Mormon culture, the Gospel, and "The Church

How you distinguish them (if you do at all) depends on how you define them.

[Moliere]

• Why is it that (in my view) one is generally not considered a "stalwart" in the Church if they don't fit in culturally. Even if they are hold a temple recommend, home/visit teach, serve faithfully in callings, etc.

It's a shame you won't post in this thread because a lot of the initial post needs definitions and explanation. For instance, what do you consider a stalwart? Are you saying that if you don't fall in line and be orthodox that you don't get a leadership position? Although that may be the case, I don't automatically consider those people to be stalwarts. In fact, the stalwarts are the ones that fulfill the real service assignments without being pressured or guilted. They just show up, serve, and go home. They don't like meetings and often avoid meetings altogether (with the exception of the church block).

Sure you'll have the people that huff and puff about their own spirituality and they'll humblebrag about their large family or their food storage or the fact their girls only wear one pair of earrings, but at the end of the day I'm assuming that most bishops would rather have a ward full of service minded people than what you (or others) might label as "stalwarts".