Thanks, Provo!

[Jeff Lebowski]

We should do everything we can to stop kids from turning into dumbass stoners, but weed shouldn't be criminalized.

[MartyFunkhouser]

We should to everything we can to stop kids from turning into dumbass stoners, but weed shouldn't be criminalized.

WTF is going on here, we keep agreeing. Please say something that I can disagree with.

[old_gregg]

to say that there are NO negative effects related to using pot - and in particular beginning to use pot in adolescence when the brain is still developing and we know that all kinds of other chemicals have long term effects - is just dumb. At least 6-8 lost IQ points dumb.

nobody said it has no negative effects, dingus--you said there was "plenty of research" of negative effects. that's not true. the new zealand study is widely cited but is garbage stat work and lazy analysis. also, i suppose you're a big 18th amendment guy, given the voluminous research about alcohol's effect on both developing and mature brains.

[falafel]

WTF is going on here, we keep agreeing. Please say something that I can disagree with.

Craft beers is nasty.

[Jeff Lebowski]

WTF is going on here, we keep agreeing. Please say something that I can disagree with.

It's bizarro Friday, funk. Let's just roll with it.

[swampfrog]

I read this book last year:

The New Jim Crow by Michelle Alexander

I was highly skeptical when I started but about halfway through I could no longer deny her thesis: our drug laws and the criminal justice system (three strikes, mandatory minimum sentencing, etc.) are racist, and have been an absolute disaster to the black community.

May be I'm just picking at nits. But if a law is motivated to be put into effect for racist reasons because it is known or expected that it will affect a specific population because of current-day usage still doesn't make the "law" racist. There have been laws instituted to control access to pseudoephedrine because it's a primary ingredient to create meth. The users of meth are a different demographic (typically, but slowly changing from what I understand). So do meth/pseudophendrine laws also have a "racist" origin? There is a specific demographic which is more affected than others.

I just find it hard to call the support for legislation of a substance which can be acquired by anyone (equal opportunity) racist. The lawmakers that instituted them may have had racist motivations (we can put all the black men in jail), and the execution of the law can also be racist as you mention.

I should read the book, or at least see if I can find a treatise of essay length that distills it down. I'm open to having my mind changed. My BIL is a sergeant in a small city in Washington. From his perspective things have not improved for the better since the change went into effect. But it's anecdotal. I also have a daughter that was one of the most self-motivated young people I had the privilege of knowing. Here's a recent tweet:

"I want to have a mental breakdown but imma roll this blunt instead ; an autobiography"

[Jeff Lebowski]

May be I'm just picking at nits. But if a law is motivated to be put into effect for racist reasons because it is known or expected that it will affect a specific population because of current-day usage still doesn't make the "law" racist. There have been laws instituted to control access to pseudoephedrine because it's a primary ingredient to create meth. The users of meth are a different demographic (typically, but slowly changing from what I understand). So do meth/pseudophendrine laws also have a "racist" origin? There is a specific demographic which is more affected than others.

I just find it hard to call the support for legislation of a substance which can be acquired by anyone (equal opportunity) racist. The lawmakers that instituted them may have had racist motivations (we can put all the black men in jail), and the execution of the law can also be racist as you mention.

I should read the book, or at least see if I can find a treatise of essay length that distills it down. I'm open to having my mind changed. My BIL is a sergeant in a small city in Washington. From his perspective things have not improved for the better since the change went into effect. But it's anecdotal. I also have a daughter that was one of the most self-motivated young people I had the privilege of knowing. Here's a recent tweet:

"I want to have a mental breakdown but imma roll this blunt instead ; an autobiography"

Yeah, I don't have time right now to really do it justice. It is a powerful book. You should check it out.

[falafel]

"I want to have a mental breakdown but imma roll this blunt instead ; an autobiography"

Oh man.

My son (who is 14) asked me the other day, "If you had a free pass from HF and the police to try any drug you want, what would it be?" :rant:

[BigFatMeanie]

Oh man.

My son (who is 14) asked me the other day, "If you had a free pass from HF and the police to try any drug you want, what would it be?" :rant:

Viagra

[old_gregg]

Oh man.

My son (who is 14) asked me the other day, "If you had a free pass from HF and the police to try any drug you want, what would it be?" :rant:

“i don’t know, son, let me call my friend robin finderson to ask him”

[falafel]

“i don’t know, son, let me call my friend robin finderson to ask him”

I hear his schedule is getting pretty booked.

[Eddie]

We should do everything we can to stop kids from turning into dumbass stoners, but weed shouldn't be criminalized.

Which is EXACTLY why I compared it to alcohol. I'm OK with laws focused on keeping it out of kids' hands. I don't see that as racist - I kinda want to keep it out of the hands of kids of all races.

nobody said it has no negative effects, dingus--you said there was "plenty of research" of negative effects. that's not true. the new zealand study is widely cited but is garbage stat work and lazy analysis. also, i suppose you're a big 18th amendment guy, given the voluminous research about alcohol's effect on both developing and mature brains.

Actually - no. Again - that's why I compared it to alcohol. I don't believe alcohol should be criminalized. I do believe the research that says that the earlier a teen starts drinking the more likely they are to become an alcoholic and the more likely they are to have issues later. So I agree with the concept of keeping alcohol out of the hands of kids.

Same with marijuana. Research is still young - but there is enough evidence to suggest it has long-term effects on kids who begin in adolescence versus those who begin as adults. Enough that, like alcohol, it makes sense to do everything to keep it out of the hands of children with developing brains.

But you just go ahead and assume that when I say we should keep drugs and alcohol away from kids what I really mean is that we should incarcerate anyone who has anything to with either regardless of their age. Just beat the hell outa that straw man.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Which is EXACTLY why I compared it to alcohol. I'm OK with laws focused on keeping it out of kids' hands. I don't see that as racist - I kinda want to keep it out of the hands of kids of all races.



Actually - no. Again - that's why I compared it to alcohol. I don't believe alcohol should be criminalized. I do believe the research that says that the earlier a teen starts drinking the more likely they are to become an alcoholic and the more likely they are to have issues later. So I agree with the concept of keeping alcohol out of the hands of kids.

Same with marijuana. Research is still young - but there is enough evidence to suggest it has long-term effects on kids who begin in adolescence versus those who begin as adults. Enough that, like alcohol, it makes sense to do everything to keep it out of the hands of children with developing brains.

But you just go ahead and assume that when I say we should keep drugs and alcohol away from kids what I really mean is that we should incarcerate anyone who has anything to with either regardless of their age. Just beat the hell outa that straw man.

WTH? Was that supposed to be directed at me?

[MartyFunkhouser]

Oh man.

My son (who is 14) asked me the other day, "If you had a free pass from HF and the police to try any drug you want, what would it be?" :rant:

The answer is marijuana. Good news for you is that you already have a free pass from the cops, so you are halfway there.

[Jeff Lebowski]

The answer is marijuana. Good news for you is that you already have a free pass from the cops, so you are halfway there.

No, the answer is that drugs destroy lives and should be avoided at all costs. Even if some of them are legal.