Great negotiator or dishonest?

[Katy Lied]

This is both new and very interesting to me. I was aware WalMart can really screw over its vendors, but it didn't occur to me that pretty much any major retailer can and does do the same.

The local radio station was doing a call-in show about vendors who get hosed by Walmart and Costco. I actually thought of Senioritis as I was listening. The topic was occasioned by Costco's current battle with CocaCola over preferential pricing given to Walmart by CocaCola. Costco wants the same wholesale pricing as Walmart and CocaCola is telling Costco: "Dude, we know you're a big seller, but you're not Walmart big." So Costco has pulled Coke products off their shelves and they say they wont sell Coke any more until Coke starts to provide Costco members with the same pricing as they do Walmart customers.

Anyway, some small T-shirt guy called in with the story of his run-in with WalMart. Before the 2002 Olympics, he provided WalMart with product which he imported from Asia. I can't remember the details, but after taking delivery, WalMart refused to pay the entire price, which was $160,000. They wanted to pay something short of that, and small vendors usually fold and accept less. This guy refused to take partial payment because he had an ace up his sleeve. He called WalMart and said he was an official vendor of the Olympics, and if WalMart didn't pay him, he would register a complaint and WalMart would get no Olympic merchandise from any of the official vendors, and they would be shut out of any Olympic merchandise for the upcoming games.

The vendor related: "So a WalMart representative shows up on my doorstep at 6:00am in the next morning. He's got a briefcase, and in the briefcase is $160,000 cash. End of dispute and WalMart gets their merchandise."

Although their business tactics leave something to be desired, I kind of admired WalMart for being so nimble even tho they're a huge conglomerate. Kind of makes you believe those stories that WalMart has a Labor Attorney with a Lear Jet idling in the driveway, ready to jet off anywhere in the world to sniff out nascent union organization movements and stomp them to death.

[wuapinmon]

The rug was in the dining room. Food was spilled on it...and it was thrown up on once.

Unethical, and you know it.

Keep bragging, though. I'm sure you'll find someone to soothsay and assuage that little nagging thing some folks call a conscience.

Here are some links that might save your soul since you've built up a resistance to Jesus apparently:

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/aristotle-ethics/

http://academics.eckerd.edu/instructor/starkjl/jls--inactive/405/September13/Nietzsche.pdf

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/kant-moral/

Of the different normative ethical theories out there, I might recommend distancing yourself from Max Stimer's egoism and go more for Kant's deontology, or, if you can't hack that, at least move away from your seemingly-fossilized consequentialism.

[TripletDaddy]

I used to frequent a WRX tuning board - back when I had an aftermarket-equipped WRX. One guy came on the board and bragged about how he'd WAY over boosted his engine, and blew the heads off one side of the engine. He'd had an 'interceptor chip' installed to make the changes he wanted to the turbo boost/fuel-to-air mixture/timing/etc, which tells the cars CPU one thing, but tells all the engine components another. Long story short, he removed all his after market stuff, and simply told the dealer that he was driving it normally, and BAM! The dealer checked the CPU, and found all the numbers to be in the normal range (his interceptor chip passed only normal numbers to the CPU), so they replaced his engine - about $8000.

I copied the string of posts and forwarded it on to Subauru USA.

The guy came back a day or two later lamenting that Subaru had changed its mind and wasn't replacing his engine. I told the guy he was an ass and that I'd told Subaru he was trying to rip him off. The two things that made me the maddest about the whole thing were:

1) He was COMPLETELY irresponsible. He'd seen videos of a WRX that did 500hp on a dyno & wanted to duplicate it. NO ONE generating 500 hp with a 2.0 liter engine expects that engine to last. The people who made the video make their money selling expensive upgrades to idiots like this guy. An engine is a pretty cheap investment for them, considering the leads such a video would generate. He found out what the guys in the video had done, and went beyond it with much cheaper components and no safeguards. OF COURSE he blew his engine!

2) After successfully ripping off Subaru he had to come to the tuner site and brag about it. That really pissed me off...

The opinion of me on that site was about 50-50, which is pretty understandable, I guess. Everyone who tunes a car knows that if they mess up it's going to cost them. A lot of people were glad to hear that someone had gotten away with one. A lot were glad I did what I did...

This raises another issue altogether.

Snitches get stitches.

For whatever reason, I really dislike ratting people out. Does anyone else feel this way? In the context of what we are discussing here, I think the used mattress guy is a tool, but I also think it is weak to rat him out to authorities.

Just as people would beware of their interactions with a liar, I tend to beware of my interactions with a snitch. Not sure why I feel this way because technically a snitch is simply passing along information. Just seems slimy to me.

[wuapinmon]

This is both new and very interesting to me. I was aware WalMart can really screw over its vendors, but it didn't occur to me that pretty much any major retailer can and does do the same.

WalMart has a GIGANTIC distribution center in Pageland, SC. Across the street there is a business says, "Wal-Mart refuse your load? Let us repack it; $300 flat fee." They have an adjacent bar & strip club while you wait. That's an entire business model based on WalMart refusing truckloads of merchandise.

[wuapinmon]

This raises another issue altogether.

Snitches get stitches.

For whatever reason, I really dislike ratting people out. Does anyone else feel this way? In the context of what we are discussing here, I think the used mattress guy is a tool, but I also think it is weak to rat him out to authorities.

Just as people would beware of their interactions with a liar, I tend to beware of my interactions with a snitch. Not sure why I feel this way because technically a snitch is simply passing along information. Just seems slimy to me.

That seems like an odd opinion for someone in your field.

[Viking]

I used to frequent a WRX tuning board - back when I had an aftermarket-equipped WRX. One guy came on the board and bragged about how he'd WAY over boosted his engine, and blew the heads off one side of the engine. He'd had an 'interceptor chip' installed to make the changes he wanted to the turbo boost/fuel-to-air mixture/timing/etc, which tells the cars CPU one thing, but tells all the engine components another. Long story short, he removed all his after market stuff, and simply told the dealer that he was driving it normally, and BAM! The dealer checked the CPU, and found all the numbers to be in the normal range (his interceptor chip passed only normal numbers to the CPU), so they replaced his engine - about $8000.

I copied the string of posts and forwarded it on to Subauru USA.

The guy came back a day or two later lamenting that Subaru had changed its mind and wasn't replacing his engine. I told the guy he was an ass and that I'd told Subaru he was trying to rip him off. The two things that made me the maddest about the whole thing were:

1) He was COMPLETELY irresponsible. He'd seen videos of a WRX that did 500hp on a dyno & wanted to duplicate it. NO ONE generating 500 hp with a 2.0 liter engine expects that engine to last. The people who made the video make their money selling expensive upgrades to idiots like this guy. An engine is a pretty cheap investment for them, considering the leads such a video would generate. He found out what the guys in the video had done, and went beyond it with much cheaper components and no safeguards. OF COURSE he blew his engine!

2) After successfully ripping off Subaru he had to come to the tuner site and brag about it. That really pissed me off...

The opinion of me on that site was about 50-50, which is pretty understandable, I guess. Everyone who tunes a car knows that if they mess up it's going to cost them. A lot of people were glad to hear that someone had gotten away with one. A lot were glad I did what I did...

I really think that's a bullshit move on your part. It was clearly wrong of the guy but it's none of your fucking business.

I think the greater sin is with you.

[TripletDaddy]

That seems like an odd opinion for someone in your field.

what is my field?

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

what is my field?

Being waup's hero.

[I.J. Reilly]

Being waup's hero.

LOL.

That sent some of my morning toast onto my computer. I'll be returning it.

[falafel]

LOL.

That sent some of my morning toast onto my computer. I'll be returning it.

Not even Costco will accept chewed up toast.

[TripletDaddy]

Not even Costco will accept chewed up toast.

Costco will if you forward them all the posts in this thread.

[scandell]

Costco WILL accept chewed up toast. It is part of their return policy. In fact MOST if not ALL grocery stores will accept chewed up toast. If it tastes pucky...return it.

[statman]

I really think that's a bullshit move on your part. It was clearly wrong of the guy but it's none of your fucking business.

I think the greater sin is with you.

He made it my business by bragging about it.

Dicks like him make it nearly impossible for WRX owners to get warranty coverage for major malfunctions. They simply assume that you've modded your car and that the failure was your part. If you have a major failure - which simply happens on a small % of cars - and they find ANYTHING aftermarket on your car - even spark plug wires or a fancy air filter or a body kit no installed by Subaru - they claim you've modded your car and they won't cover anything.

I personally paid a price for guys like this. I modded my WRX with a new exhaust and a chip (took away top end speed regulator, and allowed for improved exhaust flow). Did nothing to boost pressure or waste gate settings or fuel air mixture.

I was one of the few that had a major engine defect - threw a rod on the Interstate, doing about 75. It got towed into the shop with all my mods exactly as they were when it happened. The tech looked at it, saw it was modded, and said that there was going to be no way they were paying for anything. He checked it all out and came back and said that he felt really badly. My settings were definitely not the problem - he saw my speed & rpms at the the time it happened, plus fuel-air mix, boost, etc. None of them were out of the ordinary. The engine wasn't under stress, it simply had a mechanical failure not of my doing. But still, there's no way Subaru was going to pay for it.

In the past, Subaru would've taken the tech's word for it that it was a mechanical failure not caused by modifications. But not now. Not after they've been ripped off by so many guys like the one I turned in...

[statman]

WalMart ... wanted to pay something short of that, and small vendors usually fold and accept less.

I've got a good friend in Fort Worth who works for a commercial refrigeration manufacturer. He was on his third company in the industry. Wal-Mart had put the first two out of business.

Their modus operandi? Go to a supplier who is running at nearly full capacity. Offer them a large contract with a prety good price for their product. The manufacturer expands to cover the big WalMart order, at which point WalMart may as well own the manufacturer.

WalMart takes a few orders at the agreed upon price, but as soon as the new factory is up and running, they come back to the manufacturer and say - oops sorry, we're only going to pay you 2/3 of what we agreed. The manufacturer really has few options at that point.

Like I said, my buddy worked for two of such companies who were driven out of business by these exact tactics. In his current company, WalMart is their single biggest customer, but they'll only do business with WalMart overseas in countries that have protections from such practices....

[Fiyero]

Sometimes I seriously wonder. Do you really think it comes back to bite people like this? It seems like nice guys (and gals) may very well finish last. But I really hope karma is a *itch. This particular couple has done several shady things, so I guess DDD is right about them being serial offenders. It would be nice to see them get a taste of their own medicine.

Are you kidding? Those are the people who get ahead in life. Think of who "the king of this world" is (... for now, anyway). And your friend's spouse is ripe to be a family law attorney.