The Official Bell Helicopter Armed Forces Bowl Thread

[Commando]

on a positive note, the work rolls forth!!! Looks like the New Era is sponsoring the Pinstripe Bowl!!!

[Coach McGuirk]

From Cougarstats: Tulsa averages 205 rushing yards a game. Today they had 37 yards on 27 carries.

With a stat like that, you would think we would have won by 30.

[All-American]

on a positive note, the work rolls forth!!! Looks like the New Era is sponsoring the Pinstripe Bowl!!!

Call me when the Ensign BCS Championship Game kicks off.

[smokymountainrain]

With a stat like that, you would think we would have won by 30.

Should have. Unfortunately the QB and run game didn't get it done.

[Coach McGuirk]

Unless you're trying to argue that Lark, Munns, or Hill should start next year, comments like this are vacuous.

There are certainly arguments to be had that Riley will be the 4th best QB on the roster next year. At best.

[San Juan Sun]

There are certainly arguments to be had that Riley will be the 4th best QB on the roster next year. At best.

I'm sincerely interested to hear those arguments. Because the on-field reality will probably argue otherwise.

[MarkGrace]

This has to be the least satisfying 10-3 season ever. Maybe im just spoiled and my standards are too high. Glad we ended with a win though.

It's not satisfied because this team is headed nowhere. Going into the season we thought we were about to watch a team take its first step toward something potentially pretty great. Instead this season feels like a huge step backward despite the number of wins, and more like the ending of something (my hopes for a great season in the future) rather than beginning. We are now stuck with a QB who can't take us anywhere next season, and a massive transition in '13 that won't result in anything other than mediocrity -- and these are the two years we thought we were setting up for this year.

Great for Riley to pull this thing out, but he was awful today -- and again, as has been the case often this season, I thought he was actually worse than his numbers indicated. I swear I have never seen a kid get away with more than he does. The should-be picks (he should have had 3 in his first ten throws), the 500 balls, the absolutely bone-headed decisions, etc., just all seem to bounce his way. But maybe I'm just the dummy here because it seems to keep happening. At any rate, I'm still fairly convinced that he just doesn't have the skill/ability to lead this team to anything of note.

[Coach McGuirk]

I'm sincerely interested to hear those arguments. Because the on-field reality will probably argue otherwise.

On field results against who?

[Katy Lied]

I'm starting to realize what a big risk that faked spike was. If he didn't get the touchdown, they lose the game. No second chances.

[woot]

There are certainly arguments to be had that Riley will be the 4th best QB on the roster next year. At best.

Going by HS recruiting rankings, Riley is objectively the worst QB on scholarship and has been since he showed up (except for Kuresa maybe?). I would hope that we've moved beyond that as a valid way to judge QBs though, or that we would at least consider the idea that the coaching staff sucks at developing QBs, which would also obviate the rankings. Either way, it is completely nonsensical to aim our ire at Riley. He's just trying to live the dream and a bunch of ignorant fans are doing their best to spoil it for him without any clear reason for doing so.

I have been very vocal in my distaste of Riley's inconsistent and often reckless play, but what I haven't done, and am unwilling to do, is take the extra step of actively rooting against him, or digging in my heels and making enemies of those not willing to blame him for everything from games lost to Heaps leaving. Coaches often make bad personnel choices, and coaches often suck at developing players. Perhaps we could debate which of those is to blame right now (I say the latter, you seem to think the former), but either way, how is any of this Riley's fault? He's doing the best he can, which, I dare say, isn't as good as any of us would like. Unless there's an alternative, however, where does it get us to actively hope for his failure? Can you explain what I'm missing?

[Surfah]

It's not satisfied because this team is headed nowhere. Going into the season we thought we were about to watch a team take its first step toward something potentially pretty great. Instead this season feels like a huge step backward despite the number of wins, and more like the ending of something (my hopes for a great season in the future) rather than beginning. We are now stuck with a QB who can't take us anywhere next season, and a massive transition in '13 that won't result in anything other than mediocrity -- and these are the two years we thought we were setting up for this year.

Great for Riley to pull this thing out, but he was awful today -- and again, as has been the case often this season, I thought he was actually worse than his numbers indicated. I swear I have never seen a kid get away with more than he does. The should-be picks (he should have had 3 in his first ten throws), the 500 balls, the absolutely bone-headed decisions, etc., just all seem to bounce his way. But maybe I'm just the dummy here because it seems to keep happening. At any rate, I'm still fairly convinced that he just doesn't have the skill/ability to lead this team to anything of note.

My sentiments exactly. Our coaches sold out for this 10 win season.

[woot]

I'm starting to realize what a big risk that faked spike was. If he didn't get the touchdown, they lose the game. No second chances.

Not sure I get what you're saying here. If he'd completed a pass in the field of play, sure, but he was throwing it into the endzone.

[Surfah]

Going by HS recruiting rankings, Riley is objectively the worst QB on scholarship and has been since he showed up (except for Kuresa maybe?). I would hope that we've moved beyond that as a valid way to judge QBs though, or that we would at least consider the idea that the coaching staff sucks at developing QBs, which would also obviate the rankings. Either way, it is completely nonsensical to aim our ire at Riley. He's just trying to live the dream and a bunch of ignorant fans are doing their best to spoil it for him without any clear reason for doing so.

I have been very vocal in my distaste of Riley's inconsistent and often reckless play, but what I haven't done, and am unwilling to do, is take the extra step of actively rooting against him, or digging in my heels and making enemies of those not willing to blame him for everything from games lost to Heaps leaving. Coaches often make bad personnel choices, and coaches often suck at developing players. Perhaps we could debate which of those is to blame right now (I say the latter, you seem to think the former), but either way, how is any of this Riley's fault? He's doing the best he can, which, I dare say, isn't as good as any of us would like. Unless there's an alternative, however, where does it get us to actively hope for his failure? Can you explain what I'm missing?

These aren't mutually exclusive. Evidenced by our own coaches.

[woot]

These aren't mutually exclusive. Evidenced by our own coaches.

Agreed, which only further emphasizes my point. The hatred for Riley and his supporters is totally misplaced.

[Portland Ute]

Going by HS recruiting rankings, Riley is objectively the worst QB on scholarship and has been since he showed up (except for Kuresa maybe?). I would hope that we've moved beyond that as a valid way to judge QBs though, or that we would at least consider the idea that the coaching staff sucks at developing QBs, which would also obviate the rankings. Either way, it is completely nonsensical to aim our ire at Riley. He's just trying to live the dream and a bunch of ignorant fans are doing their best to spoil it for him without any clear reason for doing so.

I have been very vocal in my distaste of Riley's inconsistent and often reckless play, but what I haven't done, and am unwilling to do, is take the extra step of actively rooting against him, or digging in my heels and making enemies of those not willing to blame him for everything from games lost to Heaps leaving. Coaches often make bad personnel choices, and coaches often suck at developing players. Perhaps we could debate which of those is to blame right now (I say the latter, you seem to think the former), but either way, how is any of this Riley's fault? He's doing the best he can, which, I dare say, isn't as good as any of us would like. Unless there's an alternative, however, where does it get us to actively hope for his failure? Can you explain what I'm missing?

I felt the same way about John Hays at Utah. It's not his fault that he's the starting QB at Utah. It's not Nelson's fault that he's the starter at BYU. You don't just walk into a DI program and say, "Hey, I'm gonna be the starter, mkay?"

No. You are recruited, "developed" and the decision is made by coaches to put you there.

Just as the ire over Hays should have been directed at poor QB recruiting and development at Utah, the ire regarding Nelson being the starter should be directed at those that put him in that position.

Nelson, like Hays, are doing the best they can. Does anyone expect them to turn down the starting position?

It's a lot like when a mediocre NBA player is offered a huge contract (think Andre Kirilenko or Greg Ostertag). It's ridiculous for fans to be mad at those players over those contracts. Who would turn down a huge money offer from someone especially if they say you have earned it? The blame is on the execs that made the poor offers.

BYU and Utah coaches offered their QB positions to sub-par DI QBs. The coaches are the ones to blame. It's silly to hate a kid for taking the opportunity to live a dream.