2018 - 2019 BYU Hoops

[BlueK]

Funny how the honor code is the ultimate scapegoat for byu fans.

I didn't say that. I don't believe that was it at all. But what part of being thousands of miles away from family did you miss in my post? It would probably be similar if he'd gone play for any school in Utah. Maybe you also missed Dave Rose quoted after the MSU game saying he was glad they were able to get him a game close enough for his mom to be able to go see him? Sure, there were probably also basketball related reasons.

[Jeff Lebowski]

A church school a couple of thousand miles away from family might be tough for any non-LDS kid. I like him and thank him for giving it a chance. Good luck to him.

Funny how the honor code is the ultimate scapegoat for byu fans.

[Green Monstah]

A church school a couple of thousand miles away from family might be tough for any non-LDS kid. I like him and thank him for giving it a chance. Good luck to him.

In my experience the non-LDS, African-American kids from the south adjust better than most.

[jay santos]

Don’t be ridiculous jay.

Which part is ridiculous? He's inefficient? Easily replaceable? Or it's somewhat concerning to have so many departures?

[BlueK]

Hardnett's a very inefficient player. We could probably find a walk on in the student body to replace him. But a junior starter that's leaving the program is weird. That's a lot of departures in recent years.

A church school a couple of thousand miles away from family might be tough for any non-LDS kid. I like him and thank him for giving it a chance. Good luck to him.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Hardnett's a very inefficient player. We could probably find a walk on in the student body to replace him. But a junior starter that's leaving the program is weird. That's a lot of departures in recent years.

Don’t be ridiculous jay.

[jay santos]

Hardnett's a very inefficient player. We could probably find a walk on in the student body to replace him. But a junior starter that's leaving the program is weird. That's a lot of departures in recent years.

[smokymountainrain]

Hardnett is transferring. I fear that his leaving is not a simple issue of role or playing time. It seems that Rose is not connecting with his players and has created a culture where players, lesser talents and major contributors alike, take the first train out.

yikes.

[wapiti]

Hardnett is transferring. I fear that his leaving is not a simple issue of role or playing time. It seems that Rose is not connecting with his players and has created a culture where players, lesser talents and major contributors alike, take the first train out.

[BlueK]

That's my point. It seems the perception is that there's no long-term value staying at BYU. We're not recruiting one-and-done kids, so it's pretty disruptive when players bolt for middle-manager money or transfer (whether forced or willingly) and succeed in other college programs. That's a Rose issue, IMO.

This goes well beyond BYU these days and is a sign of where the college game is today. I recently read there were something like 200 college players who left last year with NCAA eligibility still on the table. Unfortunately, leaving early knowing your most likely bet is to play overseas is now seen by many players as a good option. One and done just means something different than it used to. And our very best players sometimes do fall into that new definition now -- maybe not after just one year necessarily, but it seems the culture around the college game has changed now to where it's gotten unlikely to expect any talent good enough to eventually be paid at any pro level to stay in college all four years. The thing is, Mika getting pro coaching for a couple of years now hasn't exactly developed him into NBA talent either. I understand Bryant leaving as he redshirted and had accomplished what college is supposed to be about in getting a degree.

Could a different coach have somehow gotten Mika to stay longer? Maybe, but that's not really answerable.

[Green Monstah]

Poor performance right now is on Rose, but I think this perception of not developing some stellar raw talent is pretty faulty. Do we have specific examples of players who didn't develop into good pro players who actually should have? Mika maybe? But he left before anyone had the chance to turn him into that, if it was going to happen at all. He has coached some who became very good in Europe like Travis Hansen, Cummard, Plaisted... Over the years he has definitely recruited good college-level talent but really no one who was ready made or even develop-able NBA level, IMO.

That's my point. It seems the perception is that there's no long-term value staying at BYU. We're not recruiting one-and-done kids, so it's pretty disruptive when players bolt for middle-manager money or transfer (whether forced or willingly) and succeed in other college programs. That's a Rose issue, IMO.

[BlueK]

I

There's a perception that BYU cannot develop you into a next-level player, and it's tough to argue against.

Poor performance right now is on Rose, but I think this perception of not developing some stellar raw talent is pretty faulty. Do we have specific examples of players who didn't develop into good pro players who actually should have? Mika maybe? But he left before anyone had the chance to turn him into that, if it was going to happen at all. He has coached some who became very good in Europe like Travis Hansen, Cummard, Plaisted... Over the years he has definitely recruited good college-level talent but really no one who was ready made or even develop-able NBA level, IMO.

[smokymountainrain]

this isn't rocket science. crappy coaching.

nice thing about college sports is that even if you feel the actual coaching is amazing, i.e., X's and O's - but the talent is lacking, it is still ultimately the coaches fault. whether its recruiting, talent evaluation or player development - or X's and O's for that matter, ultimately this is definitely on Rose. that can't be argued.

[Green Monstah]

this isn't rocket science. byu doesn't have enough good players. at last count, i think they had two.

I agree there's a paucity of talent, but the reason for the lack of talent is the reason I think Rose has to go: 1. Lack of development, 2. Poor talent assessments, and 3. Early transfers/leaving early to go pro overseas.

There's a perception that BYU cannot develop you into a next-level player, and it's tough to argue against.

I think Rose is likely the GOAT hoops coach at BYU, but all good things must come to an end.

[BlueK]

this isn't rocket science. crappy coaching.

I hate to go this direction because I really like Dave Rose and he's done some great coaching in the past. But I can't see the talent issues they may have being bad enough to mean losing to teams like Weber State, or not being competitive at all with St. Mary's when the Gaels are having a down year. We have also seen these same players even this season play well at times, like beating the snot out of a good Utah State team or blowing out Utah, which are both better than some of the teams we've played embarrassingly bad against. In fact, USU is one of the best teams we've played according to the metrics the committee uses.