Jewish genetic mutation found in Native American tribe

[jay santos]

What was the ethnicity of Sariah?

Not you, Indy. Don't give us this Dan Peterson bullshit.

[Indy Coug]

Not you, Indy. Don't give us this Dan Peterson bullshit.

I don't read Dan Peterson.

EDIT: Actually, who is Dan Peterson?

[NorthwestUteFan]

Apparently these Indians have some Spaniard ancestry.

No science degree is necessary to ascertain the importance of this to BOM historicity.

The link says they share an Ashkenazi gene mutation. The Ashkenazis were Germanic in origin, while the Sephardics were of Iberian origin (inlcuding North Africa).

If this study linked Native American tribes inextricably to Mizrahi Jews (Middle Eastern origin) then I would be more interested. Note Ashnkenazi, Sephardi, and Mizrahi Jews share common ancestry leading to the fall of Jerusalem at 607 BCE (or was it 587 BCE?), so the fact that this mutation to the BRCA1 gene only in Ashkenazi would lead one to believe it is a later mutation.

As the gene line links both studied communities to Cristoforo Colombo as a common ancestor, I am more interested to know about a link to CC's Ashkenazi ancestry.

[Jacob]

The linked article is so vague. I read another summary that was better on the history of the mutation:

It is ancient. More than 2,000 years ago, among the Hebrew tribes of Palestine, someone’s DNA dropped the AG letters at the 185 site. The glitch spread and multiplied in succeeding generations, even as Jews migrated from Palestine to Europe. Ethnic groups tend to have their own distinctive genetic disorders, such as harmful variations of the BRCA1 gene, but because Jews throughout history have often married within their religion, the 185delAG mutation gained a strong foothold in that population. Today, roughly one in 100 Jews carries the harmful form of the gene variant.

Also, claiming this might be from decendents of Columbus would be silly. This is a better postulation:

They believe the gene was introduced into the tribe by a single Jewish male descended from Jews expelled from Spain in 1492.

But it is only a postulation. The gene is apparently 2000 years old and originated in Israel. It could have come over at any time. Saying it was probably an expelled Spanish Jew might seem like a good guess based on our current historical understanding.

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/godandt...-indian-tribe/

[Moliere]

Makes this guy look silly....

[Indy Coug]

If a group of 20-30 people arrived in a world where hundreds of thousands to potentially tens of millions already lived, how long would it take to completely erase their genetic footprint?

[Jacob]

If a group of 20-30 people arrived in a world where hundreds of thousands to potentially tens of millions already lived, how long would it take to completely erase their genetic footprint?

Potentially thousands of years, if they happened to carry a certain genetic mutation, apparently.

[Flystripper]

If a group of 20-30 people arrived in a world where hundreds of thousands to potentially tens of millions already lived, how long would it take to completely erase their genetic footprint?

depends on how sexy they were to the native people.

[Clark Addison]

depends on how sexy they were to the native people.

What if they were, say, white and delightsome?

[UtahDan]

But it is only a postulation. The gene is apparently 2000 years old and originated in Israel. It could have come over at any time. Saying it was probably an expelled Spanish Jew might seem like a good guess based on our current historical understanding.

It's a hypothesis that is supported by some evidence. But apologists (not saying you) frequently make the mistake of saying "since A is not certain, B is just as likely." No. B is not the default position and is not made any more likely by the limited evidence for A. The default position is that no one knows.

[Dr. Heinz Doofenshmirtz]

The link says they share an Ashkenazi gene mutation. The Ashkenazis were Germanic in origin, while the Sephardics were of Iberian origin (inlcuding North Africa).

If this study linked Native American tribes inextricably to Mizrahi Jews (Middle Eastern origin) then I would be more interested. Note Ashnkenazi, Sephardi, and Mizrahi Jews share common ancestry leading to the fall of Jerusalem at 607 BCE (or was it 587 BCE?), so the fact that this mutation to the BRCA1 gene only in Ashkenazi would lead one to believe it is a later mutation.

As the gene line links both studied communities to Cristoforo Colombo as a common ancestor, I am more interested to know about a link to CC's Ashkenazi ancestry.

And...this is what I come to this site for.

[All-American]

And...this is what I come to this site for.

But you stay for the fun.

[Blueintheface]

Bummer that I just missed that and the Expo '92 that was held in Sevilla to celebrate 500 years.

Fortunately I was transferred to Sevilla after Cadiz where we spent 6 months planted outside of the Expo with our pancarta. Fun times.

Edit: The only bad part was Sevilla was in a severe drought that summer and all of the water was being diverted over to the Expo to keep the visitors from noticing it was 45 C. We only had running water from 2am to 6am so we'd set our alarms each morning at 5 to fill up for the day. I earned extra points from God for this.

[Dr. Heinz Doofenshmirtz]

But you stay for the fun.

I'm not sure why you assume that the post I quoted wasn't my idea of "fun."

[NorthwestUteFan]

And...this is what I come to this site for.

I hope I did sufficient justice to the topic. Thanks for starting it.

If a group of 20-30 people arrived in a world where hundreds of thousands to potentially tens of millions already lived, how long would it take to completely erase their genetic footprint?

Here is a better question: If 20-30 people came to the new world bringing their domestic animal-derived diseases (smallpox, e.coli, salmonella, campylobacter, listeria, shigela, yersinia, which all come from cattle or pigs which were not present until brought her from Europe in the 1600s), how long will it be until a previous unexposed population is decimated by these diseases? There is good evidence that upwards of 75% of the Native Americans on the east coast were wiped out through exposure to these diseases between the arrival of Columbus and the time of the Pilgrims.

Perhaps Lehi and co. were able to spread out and fill the face of the land and within a few hundred years they could afford to have thousands or tens of thousands of men killed in battles because they brought diseases that wiped out the indigenous population and they were able to multiply and replenish the earth?