Fire Ty

[Topper]

Every member of the offensive staff should know every play. That’s really a dumb question. You think a college O-line coach is teaching his guys how to block a specific run play and what gap to open, but they have no idea what the running back is supposed to do?


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It was a rhetorical question for somebody in the coaching business. TB believes that Grimey can't call plays.

[Shaka]

You can stick to your guns. You're still wrong. As others have pointed out I didn't say it wasn't important. I just think it's extremely overrated. And the most overrated responsibility an OC has. BTW, what you describe is what I would call game planning, not play calling. And that is something Grimes has done for years as CJ pointed out.

You thinking it's overrated and me being wrong are two different things. Game prep greatly affects what how you're going to call the plays during the game. It's all the same stuff. What I don't think you get is the importance of being able to make in game adjustments and call the right thing at the right time. Yes it's part of many things the OC has to do but it's very important. Making the correct calls in the game is a skill and a difficult one at that. Not everyone can do it and others it takes a while before they get the hang of it.

[Topper]

You thinking it's overrated and me being wrong are two different things. Game prep greatly affects what how you're going to call the plays during the game. It's all the same stuff. What I don't think you get is the importance of being able to make in game adjustments and call the right thing at the right time. Yes it's part of many things the OC has to do but it's very important. Making the correct calls in the game is a skill and a difficult one at that. Not everyone can do it and others it takes a while before they get the hang of it.

You're forgetting the head coach also has input into play-calling.

[Shaka]

You're forgetting the head coach also has input into play-calling.

No, I'm not.

[Surfah]

You thinking it's overrated and me being wrong are two different things. Game prep greatly affects what how you're going to call the plays during the game. It's all the same stuff. What I don't think you get is the importance of being able to make in game adjustments and call the right thing at the right time. Yes it's part of many things the OC has to do but it's very important. Making the correct calls in the game is a skill and a difficult one at that. Not everyone can do it and others it takes a while before they get the hang of it.

Play calling is a skill. And I'll concede that there may be a learning curve to it in that you have to be decisive and get plays in on time. But it's not difficult if you've game planned. Game planning is 10x more important than calling plays in game.

Ty Detmer didn't get fired because he was a terrible play caller. He was fired because he was never able to settle on personnel, develop an identity, simplify his offense, transfer his knowledge to the players, scheme and game plan adequately for opponents.

[Sizzle]

You thinking it's overrated and me being wrong are two different things. Game prep greatly affects what how you're going to call the plays during the game. It's all the same stuff. What I don't think you get is the importance of being able to make in game adjustments and call the right thing at the right time. Yes it's part of many things the OC has to do but it's very important. Making the correct calls in the game is a skill and a difficult one at that. Not everyone can do it and others it takes a while before they get the hang of it.

Again, in game adjustments is not the same thing as play calling. Game planning is not the same as play calling. Game preparation is not the same as play calling. I’d argue that the OL coach is usually one of the ones making the more complex in game adjustments since that’s one of the few things that can be tweaked. Grimes has done that at the highest levels of College Football. Serving as a run game coordinator he has absolutely had influence on game plans, including in the SEC, usually being one of the better teams in the country running the ball. Yeah, you’re right there are hours and hours and hours that go into watching film and knowing what may or may not work on 3rd and 8 versus 1st and 10. Sure, some people are more natural at it and have a great feel for why to call. But the prep work that goes into making those decisions Sunday through Friday is a hell of a lot more important than pulling the trigger on Saturday. Not saying it isn’t important. And some guys are better at it than others. But yeah, the game prep, the film work, the in game adjustments are things I’ve either seen first hand with Grimes at BYU or seen the results of teams he’s been on to feel like he will be just fine.

[Topper]

Play calling is a skill. And I'll concede that there may be a learning curve to it in that you have to be decisive and get plays in on time. But it's not difficult if you've game planned. Game planning is 10x more important than calling plays in game.

Ty Detmer didn't get fired because he was a terrible play caller. He was fired because he was never able to settle on personnel, develop an identity, simplify his offense, transfer his knowledge to the players, scheme and game plan adequately for opponents.

In short, he was not able to organize and administer at the college level. Many reasons exist for that, but his lack of college level management experience hurt him in being able to manage the many responsibilities you identify.

[Shaka]

Again, in game adjustments is not the same thing as play calling. Game planning is not the same as play calling. Game preparation is not the same as play calling. I’d argue that the OL coach is usually one of the ones making the more complex in game adjustments since that’s one of the few things that can be tweaked. Grimes has done that at the highest levels of College Football. Serving as a run game coordinator he has absolutely had influence on game plans, including in the SEC, usually being one of the better teams in the country running the ball. Yeah, you’re right there are hours and hours and hours that go into watching film and knowing what may or may not work on 3rd and 8 versus 1st and 10. Sure, some people are more natural at it and have a great feel for why to call. But the prep work that goes into making those decisions Sunday through Friday is a hell of a lot more important than pulling the trigger on Saturday. Not saying it isn’t important. And some guys are better at it than others. But yeah, the game prep, the film work, the in game adjustments are things I’ve either seen first hand with Grimes at BYU or seen the results of teams he’s been on to feel like he will be just fine.

It all goes hand in hand.

[Art Vandelay]

lBut the prep work that goes into making those decisions Sunday through Friday is a hell of a lot more important than pulling the trigger on Saturday.

I’m curious if coming into the office on Sunday is discouraged at BYU? I would imagine with modern technology “the film room” nowadays is anywhere you have access to a computer.

[Shaka]

I’m curious if coming into the office on Sunday is discouraged at BYU? I would imagine with modern technology “the film room” nowadays is anywhere you have access to a computer.

The players do it with iPads.

[tooblue]

Again, in game adjustments is not the same thing as play calling. Game planning is not the same as play calling. Game preparation is not the same as play calling. I’d argue that the OL coach is usually one of the ones making the more complex in game adjustments since that’s one of the few things that can be tweaked. Grimes has done that at the highest levels of College Football. Serving as a run game coordinator he has absolutely had influence on game plans, including in the SEC, usually being one of the better teams in the country running the ball. Yeah, you’re right there are hours and hours and hours that go into watching film and knowing what may or may not work on 3rd and 8 versus 1st and 10. Sure, some people are more natural at it and have a great feel for why to call. But the prep work that goes into making those decisions Sunday through Friday is a hell of a lot more important than pulling the trigger on Saturday. Not saying it isn’t important. And some guys are better at it than others. But yeah, the game prep, the film work, the in game adjustments are things I’ve either seen first hand with Grimes at BYU or seen the results of teams he’s been on to feel like he will be just fine.

All of his "experience" aside, there will be growing pains simply for the fact he has not been the one making the play calls, or in-game adjustments for the entire offense, not just the line. The best we can hope for is he will be "just fine" from the first snap in Tuscon, but the more important question will be for how long will he remain just fine. We just witnessed two years of just fine and look where that got BYU.

[originalsocal]

All of his "experience" aside, there will be growing pains simply for the fact he has not been the one making the play calls, or in-game adjustments for the entire offense, not just the line. The best we can hope for is he will be "just fine" from the first snap in Tuscon, but the more important question will be for how long will he remain just fine. We just witnessed two years of just fine and look where that got BYU.

Two words: Thera pee

[Sizzle]

All of his "experience" aside, there will be growing pains simply for the fact he has not been the one making the play calls, or in-game adjustments for the entire offense, not just the line. The best we can hope for is he will be "just fine" from the first snap in Tuscon, but the more important question will be for how long will he remain just fine. We just witnessed two years of just fine and look where that got BYU.

WTF are you talking about? Two years of "just fine"? 2016 we had an NFL RB and a borderline NFL QB and struggled at times. That's not just fine. The worst BYU offense of my life is nowhere near "just fine."

20+ years coaching at the college level, game planning, making those adjustments and being around some of the top coaches in college is not the same as Ty. Grimes won't be perfect. He'll make mistakes. But you could say the same about any semi-realistic hire for BYU. Embrace it. It's as good of a fit as we could reasonably expect.

[Moliere]

All of his "experience" aside, there will be growing pains simply for the fact he has not been the one making the play calls, or in-game adjustments for the entire offense, not just the line. The best we can hope for is he will be "just fine" from the first snap in Tuscon, but the more important question will be for how long will he remain just fine. We just witnessed two years of just fine and look where that got BYU.

So we do you propose BYU do differently? We aren’t going to lure a good P5 OC for many reasons (not just money). We could possible get a G5 OC to come to BYU, but that’s even difficult given the constraints many see at BYU (cough, cough, honor code).

BYU decided to take a more calculated gamble and hire a guy that had a lot of P5 experience (just not as OC) and someone who has worked at BYU and knows the culture and limitations.

You’ll always have a risk in making any hire if you are a G5 or a run of the mill P5 school. Alabama and Ohio State can go hire sure fire coaches because they have the name and money to do it. BYU doesn’t and for that reason alone many people are praising this hire because it’s just about as good as BYU could do. Some may even say it’s better than what they thought BYU could do.


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[Sizzle]

It all goes hand in hand.

As responsibilities of being the offensive coordinator, sure. But those components are definitely different skills, of which, play calling is more overrated than game preparation. Glad to see you've seen the light and agree.