Originally posted by Uncle Ted
View Post
Announcement
Collapse
No announcement yet.
Comrade Trump
Collapse
X
-
-
Originally posted by BlueK View PostI guess if we can't agree that a presidential candidate's team talking with a foreign adversary about how they can help influence our electoral process is kind of scary, then I don't know what else to say. Ultimately this is going to end up being a political question more than a legal one."If there is one thing I am, it's always right." -Ted Nugent.
"I honestly believe saying someone is a smart lawyer is damning with faint praise. The smartest people become engineers and scientists." -SU.
"Yet I still see wisdom in that which Uncle Ted posts." -creek.
GIVE 'EM HELL, BRIGHAM!
Comment
-
Originally posted by Uncle Ted View PostI guess it is really up to what he did with the dirt emails... Maybe he use them to blackmail Hillary to not campaign in Wisconsin and all those other states that she didn't set foot in and then lost.
Comment
-
Originally posted by BlueK View Postread the plea agreement he signed.
https://www.lawfareblog.com/george-p...plea-agreement
The lying they got him to plead guilty to was about what he told investigators about when he met with Russian officials to get "thousands" of Clinton emails for the purpose of helping the campaign. It turns out this meeting actually happened when he was officially working for the campaign and not before, which is what he lied about.
1. Trump never met the Russians.
2. Trump never received any of the emails.
3. The supposed highly connected Russians referenced in the stip never introduced Papadopoulos to the Russian Ambassador.
Now there might be plenty more to come that will show there was a collusive effort by the campaign, but this stipulation simply does not constitute such evidence. Over-claiming its import and content is not something that is very useful in this discussion. It is also not something the special prosecutor is doing. I think this plea and stip prove only what they say. Let Mueller finish his job and see what happens without adding unsupported and hyperbolic speculation.PLesa excuse the tpyos.
Comment
-
Originally posted by BlueK View PostI guess if we can't agree that a presidential candidate's team talking with a foreign adversary about how they can help influence our electoral process is kind of scary, then I don't know what else to say. Ultimately this is going to end up being a political question more than a legal one.Originally posted by BlueK View PostThis is where I apparently differ. I don't care whether it worked or didn't work. To me, the slimy act of teaming with a country that doesn't like us to help gain political power is bad enough, whether it can be proven that it helped a huge amount or didn't. Trump does have something in common with Putin though. They both seem interested in eroding democratic norms here and in other countries.
So just talking to the Russians is enough to make you uneasy? If so, where were in you in 2012?"If there is one thing I am, it's always right." -Ted Nugent.
"I honestly believe saying someone is a smart lawyer is damning with faint praise. The smartest people become engineers and scientists." -SU.
"Yet I still see wisdom in that which Uncle Ted posts." -creek.
GIVE 'EM HELL, BRIGHAM!
Comment
-
Originally posted by creekster View PostI read the plea and the stipulation before I asked. That was why I asked. I am not sure why you are convinced this stip evidences collusion. It certainly shows this guy was nosing around with Russians and looking to get information about Clinton and to arrange a meeting with Trump and the Russians, but there are a few inconvenient facts for your view:
1. Trump never met the Russians.
2. Trump never received any of the emails.
3. The supposed highly connected Russians referenced in the stip never introduced Papadopoulos to the Russian Ambassador.
Now there might be plenty more to come that will show there was a collusive effort by the campaign, but this stipulation simply does not constitute such evidence. Over-claiming its import and content is not something that is very useful in this discussion. It is also not something the special prosecutor is doing. I think this plea and stip prove only what they say. Let Mueller finish his job and see what happens without adding unsupported and hyperbolic speculation.
Comment
-
Originally posted by Uncle Ted View PostOh, so you are saying they just talked about influencing the election and maybe didn't do anything. Kind of like the little chat that Obama had with the Putin's minion on the hot mike about having more flexibility to be chums after the election. Of course, not to mention, Obama told us in the presidential debate that the Ruskies were also nothing to worry about...
So just talking to the Russians is enough to make you uneasy? If so, where were in you in 2012?
Comment
-
Originally posted by creekster View PostIt is also not collusion.
Comment
-
Originally posted by BlueK View PostBecause you classify what we know so far as not being large enough in scale to meet your standard of what "collusion" is.PLesa excuse the tpyos.
Comment
-
-
Originally posted by creekster View PostScale? It has nothing to do with scale. It has to do with what is here admitted to have taken place. There was no meeting. Talking about maybe meeting but then not actually meeting is not collusion. You have to actually do something to collude. It might have occurred here, to be sure, but nothing in the plea agreement or the stipulation constitutes an admission of collusion.Te Occidere Possunt Sed Te Edere Non Possunt Nefas Est.
Comment
-
Originally posted by old_gregg View Postyou mean other than the meeting at trump tower between kremlin associates and donald trump, jr and other prominent campaign members to discuss information they hoped would be damaging to the hrc campaign?Part of it is based on academic grounds. Among major conferences, the Pac-10 is the best academically, largely because of Stanford, Cal and UCLA. “Colorado is on a par with Oregon,” he said. “Utah isn’t even in the picture.”
Comment
-
Originally posted by old_gregg View Postyou mean other than the meeting at trump tower between kremlin associates and donald trump, jr and other prominent campaign members to discuss information they hoped would be damaging to the hrc campaign?
Looking to foreign sources for dirt, and even paying for it, is not collusion. I think hrc and the DNC would agree with that conclusion.PLesa excuse the tpyos.
Comment
-
You know who also doesn't apparently believe Trump colluded with Russia?
James Comey.
http://www.independent.co.uk/News/wo...-a7778161.htmlPart of it is based on academic grounds. Among major conferences, the Pac-10 is the best academically, largely because of Stanford, Cal and UCLA. “Colorado is on a par with Oregon,” he said. “Utah isn’t even in the picture.”
Comment
Comment