The Great Apostasy

[SeattleUte]

a fundamentally sound idea.

We'll have to agree to disagree.

[Solon]

Lots of people considered the Christian Church to have gone astray and tried to return to the roots of christianity. Some of these people were heretics. Some were faithful. One was a pope. All thought that the Church needed reform.

the cathars
Beguins
Waldensians
Berenger of chartres
Pope Gregory VII
St. Francis
Erasmus of Rotterdam
John Wycliffe
Jan Hus
Martin Luther

whether or not you think this is argues for (or against) the transpiring of a "Great Apostasy" is more about definitions and opinions, I guess.

[SeattleUte]

Lots of people considered the Christian Church to have gone astray and tried to return to the roots of christianity. Some of these people were heretics. Some were faithful. One was a pope. All thought that the Church needed reform.

the cathars
Beguins
Waldensians
Berenger of chartres
Pope Gregory VII
St. Francis
Erasmus of Rotterdam
John Wycliffe
Jan Hus
Martin Luther

whether or not you think this is argues for (or against) the transpiring of a "Great Apostasy" is more about definitions and opinions, I guess.

It means, as I said, that there's nary an original idea in Mormonism.

[creekster]

It means, as I said, that there's nary an original idea in Mormonism.

And by retreatign to this argument, you concede that the notiuon of an apostasy is correct. Your beef is with all th eother stuff you complain about. SOlon says it best, if the apostasy was great or not is a matter of opinion.

[il Padrino Ute]

It means, as I said, that there's nary an original idea in Mormonism.

Nor is there an original idea in any of your complaints about the LDS church.

[LA Ute]

It means, as I said, that there's nary an original idea in Mormonism.

You, of course, will disagree, but the Mormon view is that our religion is older than the Earth and is the same one Adam practiced. So all religious ideas are derivative of "our" ideas, which are not our ideas at all, but revealed from God. No one's more original than we are.

Since this is a matter of belief, I trust you will follow your long-standing policy and refrain from attacking.

[LA Ute]

For those interested (and this sounds a lot like Solon's territory), I recommend this book:

The Lost History of Christianity: The Thousand-Year Golden Age of the Church in the Middle East, Africa, and Asia - And How It Died, by Phillip Jenkins.

It has nothing to do with Mormonism. The author is a history prof at Penn State. It's just interesting. Publisher's Weekly said:

Revisionist history is always great fun, and never more so than when it is persuasively and cogently argued. Jenkins, the Penn State history professor whose book The Next Christendom made waves several years ago, argues that it's not exactly a new thing that Christianity is making terrific inroads in Asia and Africa. A thousand years ago, those continents were more Christian than Europe, and Asian Christianity in particular was the locus of tremendous innovations in mysticism, monasticism, theology and secular knowledge. The little-told story of Christianity's decline in those two continents—hastened by Mongol invasions, the rise of Islam and Buddhism, and internecine quarrels—is sensitively and imaginatively rendered. Jenkins sometimes challenges the assertions of other scholars, including Karen Armstrong and Elaine Pagels, but provides compelling evidence for his views. The book is marvelously accessible for the lay reader and replete with fascinating details to help personalize the ambitious sweep of global history Jenkins undertakes. This is an important counterweight to previous histories that have focused almost exclusively on Christianity in the West.

I'm just starting the book.

[Solon]

Phil Jenkins is a great guy and yes, you're right, he has nothing to do with Mormons (except for saying hi to me and one other guy in the hall).