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  • #16
    Originally posted by jay santos View Post
    Agree. But it might be time to have someone in the job with a stronger personality who can give warning of what's going to happen to the program in 20 years if they continue down this path. Probably not a big chance that will do anything. When your boss's boss's boss is getting instructions straight from Jesus and the current instructions from Jesus are to reverse a successful, multi-decade branding strategy, I doubt you're going to get very far pushing the PR benefits of BYU football for the church.
    Wow. You aren't going to let this one go, are you?
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
      Wow. You aren't going to let this one go, are you?
      I haven't lost faith in my religion. But it appears we're in an administration where decisions are made at the very top (ie a level above the prophet) without a lot of input from PR professionals, business executives, etc. And with the other changes they're making to MoTab and even stuff like no more pageants, I don't think it's the right time for a BYU AD to stick his neck out and demand change.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by jay santos View Post
        I haven't lost faith in my religion. But it appears we're in an administration where decisions are made at the very top (ie a level above the prophet) without a lot of input from PR professionals, business executives, etc. And with the other changes they're making to MoTab and even stuff like no more pageants, I don't think it's the right time for a BYU AD to stick his neck out and demand change.
        I agree with this sentiment. Whatever one's opinions on the changes there is clearly a more focussed perspective on the essential basics and my guess is the powers to be would not see BYU sports as part of those essential basics.
        Do Your Damnedest In An Ostentatious Manner All The Time!
        -General George S. Patton

        I'm choosing to mostly ignore your fatuity here and instead overwhelm you with so much data that you'll maybe, just maybe, realize that you have reams to read on this subject before you can contribute meaningfully to any conversation on this topic.
        -DOCTOR Wuap

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Goatnapper'96 View Post
          I agree with this sentiment. Whatever one's opinions on the changes there is clearly a more focussed perspective on the essential basics and my guess is the powers to be would not see BYU sports as part of those essential basics.
          keep going funk is close
          Te Occidere Possunt Sed Te Edere Non Possunt Nefas Est.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Goatnapper'96 View Post
            I agree with this sentiment. Whatever one's opinions on the changes there is clearly a more focussed perspective on the essential basics and my guess is the powers to be would not see BYU sports as part of those essential basics.
            That's how I see it as well. I question how high of a priority it is for church leadership. It is what it is.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Goatnapper'96 View Post
              I agree with this sentiment. Whatever one's opinions on the changes there is clearly a more focussed perspective on the essential basics and my guess is the powers to be would not see BYU sports as part of those essential basics.
              I'm callling it: Two hour practice sessions. Anything more would be a burden on the players' family. If the player doesn't have a spouse, he can use the remaining time to find one and get busy with his eternal duties.
              Last edited by LVAllen; 10-29-2018, 09:22 AM.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Sizzle View Post
                I’ve appreciated Tom. I think he’s a nice guy. I think he’s done his best. He’s been good interacting with the fans. But the two major sports at BYU are in as bad of a spot as I can remember in my lifetime. His fault or not, I think changes need to happen. And soon. And I think it may need to start at the top.

                Does BYU move on? If so, who is a realistic candidate?
                What has Holmoe done as far as internal infrastructure to help BYU to better compete? I know early on he got that Coaches Circle thing going so that the HC would have more cash to compensate assistants, he also got the hoops facility up and running. But I wonder what BYU is doing to put itself in a position to compete.

                Here is my issues with Holmoe:

                1.) I don't think he did enough to keep Mendenhall around. My opinion on Mendenhall was that he was the lightning rod for the reality of BYU's football situation - most of the challenges of which are outside of BYU's control IMO. Now Mendenhall created that to some extent - but, Mendenhall was a very good coach that was keeping BYU as competitive as the internal and external circumstances would allow. I think Holmoe was unable to keep Mendenhall happy, which given the whining from vocal members of the fanbase and Bronco's indifference or flat out hostility to inner thigh massaging might have been impossible to avoid - but my instincts are when Bronco told Tom he was thinking about leaving Tom did not fight to keep Bronco. When it comes to Kalani I don't really want to see him fired after year 3 - despite the fact he isn't doing a good job IMO, until BYU commits itself to building an infrastructure meant to compete at the level it claims it wants to compete at. Part of that might be recognizing and admitting it doesn't want to compete at a national level and returning to the MWC or AAC or something. I would like for BYU to keep Kalani around while it commits itself to building the resources to support the next coach consistent with the expectations. Right now there is a huge gap between program potential and expectations, IMO.

                2.) I am wondering if he is putting the pressure on Dave Rose. The turnover/losing kids before their eligibility is exhausted in the program has been a killer. I believe that not all of these departures were unavoidable.

                At the end I am interested in what Holmoe is doing to make BYU a place great coaches want to be and stay, I guess I should start by asking what sort of leeway does Tom have to create that type of environment - in the end even if obscene salaries were financed by donations would the LDS Church still allow that to be paid?
                Do Your Damnedest In An Ostentatious Manner All The Time!
                -General George S. Patton

                I'm choosing to mostly ignore your fatuity here and instead overwhelm you with so much data that you'll maybe, just maybe, realize that you have reams to read on this subject before you can contribute meaningfully to any conversation on this topic.
                -DOCTOR Wuap

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by jay santos View Post
                  I haven't lost faith in my religion. But it appears we're in an administration where decisions are made at the very top (ie a level above the prophet) without a lot of input from PR professionals, business executives, etc. And with the other changes they're making to MoTab and even stuff like no more pageants, I don't think it's the right time for a BYU AD to stick his neck out and demand change.
                  The changes that need to be made will not happen and any BYU AD that would even suggest them would be immediately fired.
                  As I lead this army, make room for mistakes and depression
                  --Kendrick Lamar

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by old_gregg View Post
                    keep going funk is close
                    Dyslexics are teople poo...

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by MartyFunkhouser View Post
                      The changes that need to be made will not happen and any BYU AD that would even suggest them would be immediately fired.
                      that might be a little dramatic. not sure an AD would be fired simply for the suggestion
                      I'm like LeBron James.
                      -mpfunk

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Goatnapper'96 View Post
                        What has Holmoe done as far as internal infrastructure to help BYU to better compete? I know early on he got that Coaches Circle thing going so that the HC would have more cash to compensate assistants, he also got the hoops facility up and running. But I wonder what BYU is doing to put itself in a position to compete.

                        Here is my issues with Holmoe:

                        1.) I don't think he did enough to keep Mendenhall around. My opinion on Mendenhall was that he was the lightning rod for the reality of BYU's football situation - most of the challenges of which are outside of BYU's control IMO. Now Mendenhall created that to some extent - but, Mendenhall was a very good coach that was keeping BYU as competitive as the internal and external circumstances would allow. I think Holmoe was unable to keep Mendenhall happy, which given the whining from vocal members of the fanbase and Bronco's indifference or flat out hostility to inner thigh massaging might have been impossible to avoid - but my instincts are when Bronco told Tom he was thinking about leaving Tom did not fight to keep Bronco. When it comes to Kalani I don't really want to see him fired after year 3 - despite the fact he isn't doing a good job IMO, until BYU commits itself to building an infrastructure meant to compete at the level it claims it wants to compete at. Part of that might be recognizing and admitting it doesn't want to compete at a national level and returning to the MWC or AAC or something. I would like for BYU to keep Kalani around while it commits itself to building the resources to support the next coach consistent with the expectations. Right now there is a huge gap between program potential and expectations, IMO.

                        2.) I am wondering if he is putting the pressure on Dave Rose. The turnover/losing kids before their eligibility is exhausted in the program has been a killer. I believe that not all of these departures were unavoidable.

                        At the end I am interested in what Holmoe is doing to make BYU a place great coaches want to be and stay, I guess I should start by asking what sort of leeway does Tom have to create that type of environment - in the end even if obscene salaries were financed by donations would the LDS Church still allow that to be paid?
                        1. part B) Tom didn't do enough to get us into a P5... e.g., He should have offered his first born to Bob Bowlsby for a Big 12 invite. That, and convinced the upper management that BYU needed to sustain the law of the land (you know, number 12) and recognize same sex marriage like everyone else (or at least lied and told the Big 12 they were open to the idea). Maybe we would still have Bronco if BYU was in a P5. Of course, many argued that BYU would be a middle of the road team if we were in a P5. That actually sounds pretty good right now.
                        "If there is one thing I am, it's always right." -Ted Nugent.
                        "I honestly believe saying someone is a smart lawyer is damning with faint praise. The smartest people become engineers and scientists." -SU.
                        "Yet I still see wisdom in that which Uncle Ted posts." -creek.
                        GIVE 'EM HELL, BRIGHAM!

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by smokymountainrain View Post
                          that might be a little dramatic. not sure an AD would be fired simply for the suggestion
                          Funk be dramatic w/r/t something that he HATES WITH THE FURY OF 1,000,000,000,000,000 SUNS!!!!? Unheard of!
                          "Seriously, is there a bigger high on the whole face of the earth than eating a salad?"--SeattleUte
                          "The only Ute to cause even half the nationwide hysteria of Jimmermania was Ted Bundy."--TripletDaddy
                          This is a tough, NYC broad, a doctor who deals with bleeding organs, dying people and testicles on a regular basis without crying."--oxcoug
                          "I'm not impressed (and I'm even into choreography . . .)"--Donuthole
                          "I too was fortunate to leave with my same balls."--byu71

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Lost Student View Post
                            Funk be dramatic w/r/t something that he HATES WITH THE FURY OF 1,000,000,000,000,000 SUNS!!!!? Unheard of!
                            touche'
                            I'm like LeBron James.
                            -mpfunk

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Goatnapper'96 View Post
                              What has Holmoe done as far as internal infrastructure to help BYU to better compete? I know early on he got that Coaches Circle thing going so that the HC would have more cash to compensate assistants, he also got the hoops facility up and running. But I wonder what BYU is doing to put itself in a position to compete.

                              Here is my issues with Holmoe:

                              1.) I don't think he did enough to keep Mendenhall around. My opinion on Mendenhall was that he was the lightning rod for the reality of BYU's football situation - most of the challenges of which are outside of BYU's control IMO. Now Mendenhall created that to some extent - but, Mendenhall was a very good coach that was keeping BYU as competitive as the internal and external circumstances would allow. I think Holmoe was unable to keep Mendenhall happy, which given the whining from vocal members of the fanbase and Bronco's indifference or flat out hostility to inner thigh massaging might have been impossible to avoid - but my instincts are when Bronco told Tom he was thinking about leaving Tom did not fight to keep Bronco. When it comes to Kalani I don't really want to see him fired after year 3 - despite the fact he isn't doing a good job IMO, until BYU commits itself to building an infrastructure meant to compete at the level it claims it wants to compete at. Part of that might be recognizing and admitting it doesn't want to compete at a national level and returning to the MWC or AAC or something. I would like for BYU to keep Kalani around while it commits itself to building the resources to support the next coach consistent with the expectations. Right now there is a huge gap between program potential and expectations, IMO.

                              2.) I am wondering if he is putting the pressure on Dave Rose. The turnover/losing kids before their eligibility is exhausted in the program has been a killer. I believe that not all of these departures were unavoidable.

                              At the end I am interested in what Holmoe is doing to make BYU a place great coaches want to be and stay, I guess I should start by asking what sort of leeway does Tom have to create that type of environment - in the end even if obscene salaries were financed by donations would the LDS Church still allow that to be paid?
                              Regarding #1, Bronco made it clear fairly early in his tenure that he was not a long-term coach at BYU. Could Holmoe have gone further to keep him around? Perhaps. In order to say that definitively, I think you have to have access to information to which the general public does not. Even though we've struggled the last two years, there's not a part of me that yearns for Bronco. He plateaued. It was time for both sides to move on. Kalani may not be the guy to help BYU get to the next level, but I don't think Bronco was that guy either.

                              Regarding #2, I think it's more likely that Rose thinks his shit don't stink than Holmoe exerting some sort of undue influence. I think this for a few reasons, not the least of which being that Holmoe seems like a very non-confrontational dude. He definitely takes his marching orders from the BOT, but I just don't see him barging into Rose's office and saying, "Get rid of the Chatman kid!"

                              On the other hand, I'm still a little perplexed by the Nashif exit, so maybe you're onto something.
                              Jesus wants me for a sunbeam.

                              "Cog dis is a bitch." -James Patterson

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Green Monstah View Post
                                Regarding #1, Bronco made it clear fairly early in his tenure that he was not a long-term coach at BYU. Could Holmoe have gone further to keep him around? Perhaps. In order to say that definitively, I think you have to have access to information to which the general public does not. Even though we've struggled the last two years, there's not a part of me that yearns for Bronco. He plateaued. It was time for both sides to move on. Kalani may not be the guy to help BYU get to the next level, but I don't think Bronco was that guy either.

                                Regarding #2, I think it's more likely that Rose thinks his shit don't stink than Holmoe exerting some sort of undue influence. I think this for a few reasons, not the least of which being that Holmoe seems like a very non-confrontational dude. He definitely takes his marching orders from the BOT, but I just don't see him barging into Rose's office and saying, "Get rid of the Chatman kid!"

                                On the other hand, I'm still a little perplexed by the Nashif exit, so maybe you're onto something.
                                Bronco made it clear he was not a long term coach period. It was never just about staying at BYU long term. He didn't want to stay in coaching long term. UVA gave him 15 million reasons why he should put in a few more years. I would suspect now that he is ranked and possibly going to win his division that they will give him an extension with 5 million more reason to keep coaching.
                                *Banned*

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